Precognition: Jedi Standard Or Not?

A thread to clear up an issue I thought was: whether or not all Jedi have "precognitive" abilities.

From: http://boards.theforce.net/literature/b10003/27837004/p9/?176

I hope folks like quotes....

 

I think the precognition is very common in jedis but there are different grades of it, in some cases it might be kinda inexistent but they.

We maybe can confuse that with "danger sense" but IMO precognition is when the threat is intended THEN the jedi can feel it.

 

Qui-Gon identifies Anakin because he has a "Jedi" trait. I'm not sure he means "Jedi," so much as he means "Force-sensitive," so that Shmi can understand him. What Anakin does in a podrace doesn't seem to be any different than what Jedi do when deflecting blaster bolts. Luke doesn't have it honed the way Anakin does, probably because Luke's not exposed to danger the way Anakin is, but Luke nonetheless gets the hang of it in a few hours onboard the Falcon. Anakin's special talent, however, seems to be stuff more in the long view - Anakin is a seer, which seems to be a very different kind of precognition than what all Jedi have, that sort of momentary, more reflexive knowledge of what's about to happen right now.

What's a bit confusing to me is why he seems to lose this ability when he becomes steeped in the dark side, as Yoda mentions in the AotC novelization that seeing like that is pretty close to the dark side - which seems to make sense, if you think about it...

 

I think Jedi are pretty much taught Farseeing and Lightsaber Combat as part of the standard course. Farseeing being the first of the "Advanced Skills" that almost every Jedi and Sith starts to rely on a whole darn lot as time goes on.

 

I'm pretty sure it is for everyone save QM.

 

To clarify...

Not necessarily.

Right. I'll have to revise "existing threat" to, well, "existing threat".

No, actually, I'll have to shift emphasis from the blaster bolt to where the blaster is pointing.

Going back to my "exceptional ability" assertion.

Because it's useful know exactly where the danger is coming from and when. The blaster-blocking wouldn't really work without it.

Based, it would seem, on the Force informing you that a particular threat has intent to attack you in a particular way. I wouldn't really call that precognition.

How do you know I'm not doing this out of pure contrarianism?

 

I'm not convinced farseeing is anything most Jedi are particularly skilled at, considering the fact that there are Seers - if all Jedi came to rely on Farseeing, Seers would be redundant. In moments of clarity and deep meditation I'm sure any Jedi can get glimmers of it, but not all are particularly gifted with a talent for it.

Personally, I tend to see Jedi time perception ability as a spectrum that begins with danger sense and ends with flow-walking.

 

Why do you say that?

 

I don't know about "farseeing", Charles. That makes me think of something a lot more... farsighted (Uh, darn) than the Jedi precog I'm talking about, which is more of a "what will happen in the next few seconds" type of deal.

I'm sure some Jedi are farseers - it seems like a natural extension of such a standard ability - I'm just not entirely sure they all are. Though I could be wrong.

So a Jedi knows exactly where the bolt is going to be based on where the blaster is pointing?

Even when they're blindfolded?

Except this is clearly meant to be an explanation for the "reflexes" of all Jedi. They can all deflect blaster bolts, ya know. Albeit some better than others.

Two guys in a duel know where the danger is coming from - the opponent. Danger sense doesn't tell you "when", it says "you're in danger, right now!" Once you're in a duel, it's effectively worthless because, hey, you're in danger the entire time. That's where precog steps in, which gives you a split-second (or more, in some cases) warning of what exactly is going to happen before it does.

Luke: "I could almost see the remote..."

If you know they're going to attack you in a particular way, before they've attacked you in that way... how didn't you "see it before it happened"?

 

Why do I think it's confusing or why does he seem to lose it?

In DL, doesn't he talk about losing this ability, to an extent, or am I making that up?

And...as much as I hate to say it, I think I'm with QM. I think Qui-Gon is simplifying things for Shmi.

 

QM: Danger sense is only involved in deflection if the Jedi in question is not already aware of the threat. This is partly why Order 66 was successful.

Once the Jedi's attention is focused on the threat, precog is what allows them to intercept the blaster bolt. Danger sense has nothing to do with it.

If you are, then heh, I called it.

 

Are we sure about that? Obi-Wan makes it seem like you're reacting reflexively, as if someone else is controlling you, when you're deflecting blaster bolts, and Traviss or Stover describes it something like feeling a point of heat where the blaster is trained. Seeing where a shot is going and then reacting seems like something that would take too long to process cognitively, whereas the Jedi seem to merely, if I may coin a term, pre-react, that is, they react to what's about to happen.

I think what Qui-Gon says to Shmi is a simplified version of what a Jedi does.

 

No, you're not. I was confused about which form of precognition you meant.

 

Er... yeah. Preacting is precog.

 

As you like it.

I concur. It doesn't seem at all like they're "seeing things before they happen", but rather that they're being made aware, through the Force, of what is happening, specifically actions that are directed towards harming them.

 

Well, Luke certainly was taught it fairly early on by Yoda.

I tend to think almost all Jedi have some degree of farseeing.

ZAYNE CARRICK seems to have had a couple of visions of the future.

Seers just specialize in it.

Like Jedi Healers and Healing.

 

Not if they aren't cognitive of it.

 

There's battle precognition and/or danger sense which all Jedi have, but is stronger in some than in others, and then there is there the real deal precognition, which only the highly trained, highly skilled, or naturally gifted have.

 

Yoda says something to that effect in the ROTS novel.

 

Yeah, okay, so... all Jedi have precog, QM agrees, and we're arguing just to argue.

Thread over.

 

All Jedi have precognitive abilities of SOME sort, be it a possibility of immediate danger sense at the very least. However, some Jedi can get very developed and/or specific with their studies to hone those skills further.

As well, plot devices often determine visions -- and all Force-sensitives are susceptible to said plot devices...

 

Bah, that should be "cognizant".

 

There is precog, and there is precog, and then there is Ventriss and Durge just walking right up to you from behind and *urrk*

You don't need spidersense to have commonsense.

 

No, but that doesn't make it any less of a superpower.

 

Some Jedi have crappy danger sense or Ventress and Durge are skilled enough to find ways around it.