Requiem for a Fantheory: R.I.P. Jacen = Darth Krayt

As the release of Sacrifice looms nearer, the time has come for those of us who read about Darth Krayt and Jacen becoming a Sith at about the same time and thought, "Hm...this could be a great story point. It seems obvious! Jacen = Darth Krayt" to give ourselves over to resignation. Though we were so sure we were right, it would seem we aren't.

But indeed we could have been! Jacen Solo not only brings the Sith back but succeeds in bringing the galaxy once again to its knees decades later! A link between Legacy and LotF! Confirmation of Jacen Solo's fall having a real, concrete and long lasting importance to the SW galaxy! Alas, the Darth Who contest came along and destroyed the dreams of us who saw materializing before us one of the coolest connections/character journeys the EU had thrown at us in years.

This thread is one last hurrah, to discuss the evidence that seemed to be lining up - and, at times, continues to line up - in support of what a wicked cool decision it would have been to make Jacen Solo = Darth Krayt.

And perhaps we'll even bring up a few reasons why it must not be so.

Know, of course, that I have full confidence that Krayt's real identity, and Jacen Solo's fate, will be satisfying in the end. I'm enjoying LotF, and I think Legacy is the best thing to happen to the EU in a really, really long time. However, for us fans here on the board who were really gunning for it, let's look back at all the reasons this would have been awesome.

[image=http://images.wikia.com/starwars/images/5/54/DarthKrayt.jpg]
Why it Should Have Been Jacen Under There

Publishing
Legacy of the Force and Legacy both share an era. They almost share a title. The implication there is that they are united by story. LotF is about the rise of the first new real Sith Lord since Vader died, and Legacy is about a galaxy plagued by Sith. Presumably, these are the same bunch of Sith, right? I mean, that would be what makes sense? Lumiya implies the existence of more Sith in Tempest, of course, but why Jacen, if Krayt is out there?

Character
First off, some simple character similarities: both have martyr/messiah complexes. Both believe they are right and attempt to fly in the face of thousands and thousands of years of wisdom telling them otherwise. Both have a penchant for being verbose. Both have some relationship to the Yuuzhan Vong. Both are calculating and patient, though Krayt far more so. It's also pretty clear that in terms of raw power, Darth Krayt is, if not a Skywalker, then at least a Skywalker-class Force adept.

Beliefs and Drives
Both Jacen and Krayt believe themselves to be bringers of order, a new type of Sith, able to use the dark side with a gentle hand. Yes, they seek power, but not for power's sake. They seek to acheive an end. They seek peace and order and a unified galaxy. What Palpatine claimed to want, Krayt and Jacen want intesnely. Jacen's entire turn to the dark side, from DNT onward, has been primarily motivated by a desire to shape the galaxy according what Krayt would call a "vision of galactic order," and Krayt is, according to himself, "that man of vision." Krayt's quote "Sometimes, things must be broken in order to be rebuilt" just drips with Jacen. His description of Cade's healing as "a dark light in the Force" reflects Jacen's attitudes towards the light and dark sides.

The Timeline
Much has been made of the timeline, saying that Darth Krayt was a Sith longer than Jacen. However, in Exile, Jacen reflects that the old him is dead, and has been for some time. Thus, it can be said that Jacen no longer existed and somewhere in the middle of the Vong war his current, LotF, Darth Who Sith self has been germinating. In fact, the oh-so-common "Certain point of view" angle was raised long before Exile was released, when the Jacen = Krayt theory first surfaced. If there is a problem in the timeline, it could be that Krayt is said to be the leader of the Sith for a century, but t

 

How do we know that Jacen isn't Darth Krayt?

 

You forgot the most important reason of all: For the LULZ.

 

We don't know for sure, I guess...but Del Rey's Darth Who contest means that in the next book he's going to be the most popular of the five, fan-submitted names chosen by LFL as the cream of the fan-submitted crop.

LULZ?

 

What if that was all just a cover to throw us off the sent? Oh ye of little faith

 

I think it would be hilarious if Darth Who was the biggest game of misdirection ever, and it turns out that Jacen really is Darth Krayt. That the whole thing was just hogwash invented to give them ironclad cover for something that would otherwise have seemed fairly obvious.

-Paul

 

Of course, those five fans would be pissed off.

I've got the solution: Jacen = Darth Krayt, and then each of those five fan-submitted names gets made into a Sith Lord serving him.

 

Plural of LOL (Laughing Out Loud.)

See also: LULZ

 

I have a theory - which probably many people have had before me - that originally Jacen was intended to become Darth Krayt, or at least that option was seriously considered, but that at some point the people at DR changed their minds. All these resemblances between them are not coincidences. The almost total disappearance of the tassels from the picture as LotF has progressed is connected to this, I think. They were intended as steps that would make Jacen Darth Krayt - like BobaMatt argues, they fit all too well with what we know about Krayt. At some point this plotline was abandoned and the Darth Who contest was organized. Perhaps there were good reasons for it, perhaps it was DH people who did not want to make this connection, perhaps it was just a marketing gimmick that someone came up with and sold to the bigwigs at DR. Whatever, Jacen would no longer become Darth Krayt, and of the tassels only few parts, mainly the sacrifice part, would still have relevance to Darth Who, that Jacen would now become.

Like BobaMatt writes, at first LotF and Legacy would really have been a single story of one person, Jacen Solo, who would have been the Anakin Skywalker of this era. LotF as PT and Legacy as OT. But then plans changed. Instead of getting closer together, creating connections between them, we should now see an ever greater differences between Jacen and Darth Krayt as LotF progresses, and as the new plotline takes over from the old one that still dominates Betrayal and which still has some importance in Bloodlines and few echoes in the visions that Luke and Jacen see in Tempest.

 

^ Interesting.

 

The Very name Krayt.

Krayt is a species of large Dragons/Liards native to Tantooien.

Jacen (a) isnt from Tantoieen
Jacen (b) no longer recognnizes his connectio with Nature/Animals
Jacen (c) Jacen dosent use the Ja'kari style of saber dueling
Jacen (d) isnt proactive
Jacen (e) can link with and control Vong bio-tech, and would be in litle danger from it
Jacen (f) though claimes to have "Died" on the Myrkr mission, he is seen Talking to animal, Healing others, and acting not to unlike him self, as he has been potrayed through the YJK abd NJO all up untill, DNT book II.

You have to do some heavy surgical retconning to make Jacen Darth Krayt, And Considering what is happening they have been playing willie nillie with NJO chracter continuity. Which is why the most apropriate name for Jacen is Darth Substace Abuse, because his logic has been as steady as a crack fiends.

All he needs is a Roid rage, and to trip out on visions and he will ahve the full set.

 

BobaMatt

We don't know for sure, I guess...but Del Rey's Darth Who contest means that in the next book he's going to be the most popular of the five, fan-submitted names chosen by LFL as the cream of the fan-submitted crop.

Is it possible that Jacen goes by the name selected in the Darth Who contest for a while, but then, for some reason that's unknown right now, he changes the name to Darth Krayt later?

 

That's kind of a narrow view of reasons he'd pick the name, assuming, of course, that Sith naming follows a real, IU logic at all.

Neither did Luke or Anakin Skywalker. Saber styles are stupid. Any Jedi can pick up another saber and pwn.

What?

So far.

Notwithstanding, he sees himself as having died then, so, since it's a point-of-view question...

Are you kidding? I just made a huge monster post detailing all the reasons it already made sense.

100 + years of gym membership?

He already trips out on visions.

 

^ Yeah, it's just...a shame, is all.

 

That it is.

 

I've thought of that possibility myself. Good thinking.

 

? I thought you were familiar with Literary design. A villain must cause, or provide a cause for a hero to act.

Ie.

Luke joining up with Obi-Wan after Beru and Owen are Killed.
Peter becoming spiderman after Uncle Ben is killed.
Bruce Wayne, Cade Skywalker, Harry Potter, you name it a Hero, or should I say a Protagonist is forced to act due to the action sof an Antagonist/Villain.
Anakin Solo and the death of Chewbacca, Jacen and being capyured and tortured by the Vong.

Jacen only reacts, He reacts to the action of others. and always at the prompting of another chracter. Jacen Takes little action of his own accord.

Krayts very act of Persuing the plans against the Alliance , denots action. He Activly has people persue Cade. Jacen only attacks people right infront of him. he only attacks one problem right infront of him.

I can go on if you would like.

Are you kidding? I just made a huge monster post detailing all the reasons it already made sense.[/quote]


Not realy, you have made connections because of chracter similarities, as seen of DNT. But Jacen's Existance, History, and the experinces that drives his behavior far exceeds DNT (If you want to portray a realistic chracter)

Based on the teaxts so far you have only their Martyr Complex as a support. Jacen shows no more intrest in sith philosphies than he dose in Fallassani philosphies, or the sith themselves. All he realy wants is to learn few new tricks. The very fact he is working around by obaying letter of Lumyia's prophcy (An I realy cast doubt on if a bunch of beads she admited to making up can be counted as such) instead of the spirit of it shows he probably dosent give a gundarks backside about the sith.

Their are Just as mainy Diffrent Character traits, that sevearly differntiate him from Krayt.

Jacen has expressed no intrest in ruling anything, Jacen has expressed little to no care for sith philosophy. Jacen has little to no fear of pain or death (Krayt clearly has fear of his fate).

I partialy agree, but it still flys in the face of the fact that fighting styles (In Reallife and fiction) are reflections of the person using them, and are as identifying as finger prints.

Jacen Knows how to dule weild, but has never used it, in combat. As someone says more blades isnt superior its just diffrent, a reflection of a personality.

It would be as if, Jacen Wielded a Katana for most of his life then suddenly switched to a pair of Chinese Dao. Not impossible, but in a fight you optimal weapon is what you are comfortable with. History clairly states he is comforteble with a single blade. Or he would have dule weilded before now.

 

I thought you were referring to a more common definition of proactive.

By your logic, however, Harvey Dent can't be the same person as Two-Face because he didn't used to give Batman a reason to react. You see, if Jacen is Krayt, then Jacen right now represents Krayt's beginnings, then there's 100 years of planning, until finally, in Legacy, he becomes proactive.

If you say so.

Actually, that's shown by both characters to be specifically untrue. Lumiya has stated, and Jacen has acknowledged, that there's no tricks, no techniques, no abilities that Lumiya can teach him. He's, basically, maxed out in the Force. All that Lumiya can give him is philosophy and his destiny.

Jacen hasn't expressed how far he'll go to acheive his ends, and he's already playing politics. Jacen, again, has expressed a ton of curiosity about Sith philosophy and teachings, he's just not ready to learn it until he makes a sacrifice (it's not even subtext, it's plainly stated). Krayt has a fear of dying before the plan he's worked on for over a century is completed. If I put that much time into something, I'd want to see it through to completion rather than watching it unravel, too.

Your point about fighting styles bears consideration, and it's a pretty strong argument, but if it just looks cooler in a comic, it's not beyond retcon. I'll grant you, however, that it's a pretty good argument.

 

God I hope so. I've been preaching Jacen=Krayt forever now, and I'd hate to be wrong.

 

To Bad he wants to learn the force phantom projection, and was intrested in battle meditation in Exile.

And in Tempest he was soing it for Allana Tenel Ka, and all the Little Children

And in Boodlines he was Doing it for Galactic Peace, and was willing to sacrifice Allana and tenel Ka,

And in Betrayal he was doing it so he would not kill Luke.


Jacen's chracterization and motivation has flip floped from book to book, so badly and so irraticly it screams badly doen retcon

 

Yeah, those are cute, but neither of those are Sith techniques. Well, the phantom projection might be, but it seems to be an amalgamation of stuff he can already do.

First of all, it hasn't. Every one of those concerns has always been in his head. Galactic peace was the overarching goal, even before he joined the Sith, then it became so important that he was willing to sacrifice Allana and Tenel Ka because he felt that the need for galactic peace for "all the Little Children" was bigger than just Allana's life, and the desire not to kill Luke was the straw that broke the camel's back, the final piece that made his pledge to the dark side "necessary."

Second of all, none of that contradicts the fact that in at least two of the books, probably in Betrayal, too, Lumiya's focus is on philosophy and destiny.

 

How do you get that?
He has always searced for inner peace through the force. He never gave 3 trips to the crapper about Galactic peace. Thats a recent tip to the Movie prequals. Even in DNT, He never thought about the Alliance or the empire, or anything except what he was as a threat.

Jacen Made no move against the Killiks or raynar, nor the Chiss, till he "foresaw" their little conflict going out of control and consuming the galaxy. He inteceeds not for some Ideal, but to prevent destruction.

same way most people dont want Earth to blow up, but it dosent mean im going to inteceeding every nickle and dime petty war on the planet.

Frankly this whole over reaching crud is a invention for LOTF to tie isnt to the crappy prequals.
Even in tempest Denneing wrote it out, its freaking pointless to save the galaxy if none you love is around to enjoy it. Irratic and pointles movie tie in.

 

Oh brother, can we please stop with the Jacen=Darth Krayt stuff already. I mean whats he going to say to Cade when he meets up with him huh? Cade, I am your cousin!!!!!!!!!!! LAME!

 

Jacen is still capable of change and the decades between LOTF and the comics could shape him into the Darth Krayt who plots the overthrow of the Fel dynasty. Decades of living on Korriban, that armor, war, could have a profound effect on his personality and actions. Krayt does share Jacen's arrogance that only he can "save" the galaxy and is willing to go to extraordinary lengths to lengthen his life so he can put his plan into action.

While I would love for Krayt to be Jacen, I suspect Krayt will turn out to be someone else, perhaps an apprentice of his or someone like Anakin Solo who was thought dead.