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Saga Star Wars and the distinction between thoughts and feelings

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by Seagoat, Feb 18, 2015.

  1. Seagoat

    Seagoat Former Manager star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jan 25, 2013
    A very common thing I noticed, having just watched SW over the past 13 and a half hours, is the importance of two key terms that, while in concept are similar, could not be any more different in terms of results

    First, we'll look at the understanding of feelings within the universe. Four lines in specific stand out to me:

    "Anakin, search your feelings. You know, don't you?"
    "Search your feelings, Lord Vader, you will know it to be true."
    "Search your feelings, you know it to be true!"
    "Search your feelings, father, you can't do this, I feel the conflict within you."

    I have no doubt these lines all contain the same phrase for a reason. Let's look now at Qui-Gon's well known line and another one that ties in:

    "Feel, don't think. Trust your instincts."
    "My feelings tell me they will destroy you."

    And then there is Obi-Wan's maturing philosophy on this topic, as shown by the two lines:

    "Patience. Use the Force. Think."
    "Yes, but use your feelings, Anakin, something is out of place."

    Later on, even Yoda has a line of this nature:

    "Use your feelings, Obi-Wan, and find him, you will."

    Now, these are just some examples. If you go through the scripts and search for some key terms, the context is very interesting. One odd thing I've found is that "think" is often used in a negative context, while "feeling" is more often than not used in a sort of esoteric phrase. So that was probably horribly formatted and poorly organized, but I felt that this would be a good thread idea. We'll see

    I have a bad feeling about this
     
  2. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord 52x Wacky Wed/5x Two Truths/29x H-man winner star 10 VIP - Game Winner

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    "Let go your conscious self and act on instinct"
    "Stretch out with your feelings"
    "Luke, trust your feelings"

    And that's just in ANH.
     
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  3. Lulu Mars

    Lulu Mars Chosen One star 5

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    Mar 10, 2005
    Mace Windu: "Be mindful of your feelings."

    Obi-Wan Kenobi: "Be mindful of your thoughts."
     
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  4. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord 52x Wacky Wed/5x Two Truths/29x H-man winner star 10 VIP - Game Winner

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    "Bury your feelings deep down, Luke. They do you credit, but they could be made to serve the Emperor."
    "Your thoughts betray you. You feelings for them are strong, especially for ... sister. So, you have a twin sister. Your feelings have now betrayed her too."
     
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  5. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Skywalker Saga/LFL/YJCC Manager star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Mar 4, 2011
    Instincts seem to be really important for Force users, who can trust them for guidance...as long as they (the Force users) are "calm, at peace."

    Feelings meaning "passion" or "unchecked emotion" seem to be discouraged as they can impede healthy, rational decision making. "Thoughts" is used interchangeably here, with "your thoughts betray you", with thoughts in this case meaning Luke's fears for Leia, Han, Lando and the Alliance, but Leia in particular.
     
  6. MOC Vober Dand

    MOC Vober Dand Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jan 6, 2004
    Often they're used interchangeably in SW. Thoughts can lead to feelings if not controlled.
     
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  7. Cushing's Admirer

    Cushing's Admirer Chosen One star 7

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    Jun 8, 2006
    They are very intrinsically linked in SW as in RL. It's truly about balance. Unfortunately also true to life Jedi are a constant contradiction.

    I think feel is meant in the sense of trust intuition, trust faith in the Force.

    Think is much more 'practical' much more 'collect evidence and work from it'.
     
  8. Cryogenic

    Cryogenic Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2005
    Feelings can become thoughts; thoughts, feelings.

    That seems to be the basic idea -- one, I think (oh!), it is hard to disagree with.

    But generally, in the contemporary western world, "thought" is considered a higher kind of mental construct, in terms of the connotations of the word, than "feeling/s". Which is a bias maintained with some irony.

    Perhaps, then, there is a cautionary aspect at work, with regard to self-deception. Don't assume you necessarily have the "higher ground" just because you believe yourself to be thinking. Examine your intuitions and beliefs. Make sure they align with the common good and not personal biases or inculcated attitudes from the media or society; beware of duplicity and error.

    I agree with that.

    Ultimately, I see the Jedi playing a bit of a dangerous game -- intuition is often false.

    As a metaphor for following the light within you, and not just being a cog in a greed-driven power structure, I think the concept of the Jedi works beautifully.

    But I do worry about attendant effects. Irrationality, superstition, and dogma are everywhere. We have primitive brains based around emotion and instinct. Critical thinking has always been scarce in human history. The neocortex is rarely used.

    If you want a basic explanation for all the evil done throughout history and through to the present day, that is really it. People have little true respect for knowledge or rationality. Few are striving to overcome the regrettable aspects of their own animal nature. Many even deny the fundamental fact of biological evolution.

    And the present system, based on a horrible mix of primitive social dogmas, militarism, and consumerism, enslaves the body and mind. The only viable release is to develop a passion for knowledge and thinking along more rational lines generally. You can then apply this to every area of life. There is no area of life that won't benefit -- and isn't in desperate need -- of it.

    This remark of Lucas', in my opinion, remains critically important. He puts it a bit more simply, but he seems to have identified the chief emotional issue of our age (and every age before this one) >>

    I would like to see our society mature, and become more rational and more knowledge-based, less emotion-based. I'd like to see education play a larger role in our daily lives, have people come to a larger understanding -- a "bigger picture" understanding -- of how we fit into the world, and how we fit into the universe. Not necessarily thinking of ourselves, but thinking of others.

    http://www.achievement.org/autodoc/page/luc0int-7
     
  9. Cushing's Admirer

    Cushing's Admirer Chosen One star 7

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    Jun 8, 2006
    I'd say the opposite. People place too LITTLE import on intuition and faith and too MUCH on science/thought.
     
  10. anakinfansince1983

    anakinfansince1983 Skywalker Saga/LFL/YJCC Manager star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2011
    Science and thought are provable and reliable. It's much harder to get ****ed over or blindsided by something that is provable and reliable.

    People can prioritize whatever they want though.
     
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  11. Cryogenic

    Cryogenic Force Ghost star 5

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    Jul 20, 2005

    Not if you look at polls and see the way the world actually is. Conspiracy theories, quack medicine, apocalyptic doom-saying (along with a perverse denial of global warming and the cancerous effects of capitalism), racism, sexism, cultural elitism, medieval attitudes to crime and punishment -- these are just some of the areas in which faith and blinkered reasoning prevail; where the light of rationalism and a dispassionate weighing of evidence are critically needed.

    Tyrannical, diseased thinking prevails the world over. People tend to respect authority rather than question it. And populaces are constantly manipulated and misled by a vast media machine that simplifies, distorts, distracts, and omits, in order to advance a capitalistic, consumer-based agenda. It's everywhere. It's in schools, homes, pubs, restaurants, the Internet -- everywhere. The top 0.1% make off with all the money, while billions labour in pointless jobs and struggle with bills, or can't even get clean drinking water and die of preventable diseases and malnutrition. And many retrograde elements (religious leaders linking natural disasters to sexual practices, for example) continue to thrive.

    The world could do with a lot more rationalistic and pragmatic thinking. It is not suffering for an abundance of these things.
     
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