With the Introduction of moral relativity into Star Wars, I can't help but to rethink the whole Clone Wars. Question: Is the CIS really the bad guy? The opening scrawl of the Phantom Menace says that the taxation of the ... worlds are in dispute, so Trade Federation decides to blockade Naboo, etc. So the way I read it, the Naboo government wanted excessive tariff on merchandise going in and out of their world, and the Trade Federation wants free trade, which is denied to them. You could think it's the other way, but it doesn't make sense. In that case the Feds could just not trade with them, and that would be it. So it's pretty much Commodore Perry (the Feds) vs Shogunate Japan (the Naboo). On another front, what exactly is the Casus Belli? In American Civil War, the issue was slavery, but there isn't any corresponding valid casus belli. The issue put up by Wookiepedia is that Obi-Wan et al is sentenced to death on Geonosis, etc. But what do you do when unfriendly spies infiltrate your top secret facility (Think if Iranians were to snoop around the Pentagon). What exactly is the ideology of the CIS? Count Dooku says the republic will bow to any demands put forward. Yet he does not say what those demands would do. Does he wants to unleash Nazism on the galaxy? Does he wants everyone in the galaxy to wear red forever and ever? Let's look at Philanthropy. The CIS is so humane that they only fight with droids. You do not see anything organic fighting in their army besides the leader, scientists and bounty hunters. Whereas the Republic fights with human beings, and not only that, but clones. So the bad guy was the Galactic Republic from the beginning. And I don't think saying but Palpatine was leading both sides! really count as a valid counterpoint. I'm saying the whole Republic system might be at fault.
The tariff is imposed by the Republic, not by Naboo. Darth Plagueis and Cloak of Deception delve into the issue in more detail. the CB: the CB during the ACW was not the issue of slavery, but the legality of secession and the attack on Fort Sumpter by the rebels. From the traitor perspective, it was the removal of arms from the Fort that was the Union provocation. As far as SW goes, the CIS probably had grounds to execute Kenobi as a spy, but the Republic didn't have to go along with it. CIS war goals: made up on the fly and changed with every book/comic/TV episode. We're told that there are heroes on both sides, and we're told that there are true believers among the Seppie ranks, but mostly what we see (especially in TCW) involves Dooku threatening each and every new member of his movement and reminding them that they're worth less than trash to him. I thought he was an idealistic and charismatic leader? So much for that. Humanity: Yeah but let's not forget that since the CIS are villains, they pull the same antics that the Empire will later be accused of: strip-mining, slavery, etc. Fault: No, the dirty Seppies are definitely at fault. I'd love for them to be more developed and have an actual point since it's completely implausible that so many people would willingly *join* such a cartoonishly evil faction. It's not like people were left without a choice as they were with the Empire. That said, no, they're still the bad guys.
Well, there are characters like Krell. Republic- a Jedi in fact, yet treacherous and plotting his defection to the CIS. There's also Tarkin. And probably others.
This is why I'd actually like to see the Separatist Parliament again. It provides a window into what the worlds who joined the CIS actually thought it represented and could offer them. But apart from the most minor mention in TCW, it's not been given anywhere near as much exposure as it could have. If Luceno who did do a Darth Tyranus novel, it's the sort of thing I think an author like him could delve into well, since there's so much opportunity to explore Dooku as the charismatic leader he's described as -- after all, that is the Dooku that recruited people, not the evil Saturday morning cartoon villain who would have been bleeding support faster than you can say Empatojayos Brand.
The issue of the Separatists is complicated because there is a huge gap between the concept and reality that shows up. In a very Basic sense the Separatists represent the largely repressed and alien-dominated populations of the Mid and Outer Rim sections of the galaxy. This is a frontier populace that is largely being exploited by the powers that be back in the Core and Colonies and is having the greatest majority of its resources extracted and exported away. This is an almost colonial dynamic, with the Separatists representing a native rebellion. of course its not precisely cut and dried, elements within the Rim areas, such as the Hutts, pirates, smugglers, and others use their largely unsettled territories as a safe zone from which to pillage everyone's resources and, critically, the Rim is not able (or necessarily willing) to muster the military strength to maintain order in its own territories. As a result the Republic considers its taxes justified to defend the Rim, not just the Core. There are some fairly reasonable parellels with the lead-up to the American Revolution actually with the Republic in the role of the British. However the issue is vastly complicated because the principal actors behind the Separatists are not its people or its politicians, but a group of corporations. The Trade Federation and its ilk are in fact the principal groups executing the destructive pseudo-colonial economic policies that govern the Core-Rim dynamic, and they have manipulated the system through the failure of the Republic's political system to rig the game to protect themselves more than anyone else. The corporate faction represents an extremely predatory form of capitalism and one that wishes to insure the state is forced to back them in perpetuity. So the CIS is not a people's movement. EgtW labels the Separatist parliament as a figurehead, and when Mina Bonterri claims that Dooku is simply the president of senate everyone else basically rolls their eyes. It is worth noting that, as much as Palpatine and his allies manipulated the Clone Wars into occuring when they did and in the form they did, some form of Core vs. Rim armed conflict was surely inevitable even well before Naboo, though it might have been a few decades down the road. The Republic was corrupt, quite probably past the point of any successful reform effort. Had things, Valorum probably blocks the Trade Federation's right to arm, and instead the megacorporations demand the Republic push outward to police the spacelanes. The local populations launch into armed resistance after some sort of brutal massacre or accident, seize regional shipyards, and the whole thing snowballs. Of course, in that situation the Jedi may well sit the war out, which Palpatine couldn't have happen.
There's a good line in The Essential Atlas- page 3: Starve the center and you reap anarchy. Feed the center and you breed tyranny. The problem is obvious to every man. A solution has been revealed to no man. -Sayings of Uueg Tching
We really need to get more people to start calling it/thinking of it like that. The Clone Wars really did have the opportunity to be the most "grey" conflict in Star Wars (save the 2nd Galactic Civil War). Sadly, both the CW and GCWII failed to provide any real merits to the opposition (even though there were two distinct chances to get it right for the Clone Wars), and any moral ambiguity was added only by making the good guys less good. A horrendously missed opportunity.
Yeah, another time where the CWAS goes against the actual movies. Frankly, I thought the Congress was an excellent addition to give a more 'populist' element to the CIS that it sorely needed - since the CWAS doesn't seem interested in it anymore, hopefully some EU sources will pick up on it. (As an avid Republic Senate watcher, I'd love to see some run-downs on the constituents of the Separatist Congress).
Is there any official source of how the CIS came to be? I would like a story detailing how Dooku approached all the groups and convinced them to join him and all the strife after that up to AOTC.
I got the impression that the CIS was essentially a corporatist movement and its main reason for forming was to escape Republic business laws. I certainly would not compare the CIS to the Nazis, although as a PP said, TCW will lead the viewer to believe that the Separatists only defected from the Republic to escape Republic laws against enslaving and torturing people. There are good and bad people on both sides, and considering that both sides are ultimately orchestrated by Palpatine, it's a bit difficult to label one side as inherently more "evil" than another.
Brutality on the part of the Separatists is shown in many sources, not just TCW - it's in the Jabiim portion of Republic, it's in Galactic Battlegrounds, it's in the micro-series (the Nelvaan experiments) and elsewhere. There are two things we can blame for this though. One is the use of a droid army. Droids are merciless, literally. They are simply programmed to slaughter. As a result they form an army lacking in restraint or subtlety. They were particularly poor at contained precision strikes. A very ham-fisted approach to warfare, which is what we largely see, is what you would expect. Second is the leadership at the top. the politicians might have ideals, but the people Dooku placed in charge of his armies make for more of a 'who's sadistic and cruel in the galaxy' than anything else. There's a decent justification for that too though - given the small size of the repbulic judicial forces, the available officer pool was tiny, and almost all the professional soldiers remained loyal. that left Dooku scrambling to find anyone with military expereince. That left him with aliens from remote worlds that had carried on wars despite republic sanction (Grievous, Riff Tamsin, Admiral Trench), largely incompetent Trade Federation officers, calculating tactical droids, and highly-skilled head cases (Durge, Ventress). Not exactly a group of 'laws of war' types.
Frankly I think the CIS and the Clone Wars are the dumbest things ever, conceptually two forces tossing disposable troops at eachother. I know "Clone Wars" was mentioned in A New Hope, but seriously Clone a handfull of Military Legends, institute a general draft. I Understand having droids in support roll and insanly dangerious, (Shock troops) (mobile artillery) but a all droid military force? seriously? Well all droid sans a few cartoonish overseers.
The official story (which really deserves the Luceno treatment) is that Count Dooku reappeared after eight years from leaving the Jedi Order to make an impassioned speech at Raxus. (Originally the junk world, but I have a feeling that's going to be changing to the Raxus from the CWAS, which I actually don't mind) 200 worlds immediately seceded from the Republic. Palpatine at the time was about to end his Chancellorship due to term limits, but coincidentally the Separatist Crisis caused the Senate to grant him an extension - changing horses in mid-stream, and all that. The AOTC HNN articles show how more and more systems and sectors were leaving the Republic shortly before the Battle of Geonosis, although still a very small number when compared to the Republic itself.
Well if we ever get a Dooku novel I hope this is answered. Luceno ftw. I knew there was online articles or something but not sure.
I don't understand your objection to be honest. Frankly, an entirely robotic army is fairly logical, and I expect that in a hard sci-fi it would be almost impossible to justify human soldiers in anything but command positions. Even in a soft sci-fi/science fantasy like Star Wars, droids are actually pretty effective - despite all the jokes and the fact that b1s are super cheap pieces of crap, they nearly overran the galaxy anyway, and if the Clone Wars were a genuine conflict without any of Palpatine's manipulations, I think there is a good chance they would have won (the main advantage I am giving the Republic here is the severe lack of skilled officers on the side of the CIS)
Fun thing is many sources mention they did we just sadly seldomly get to see these normal Soldiers, on either side that is. With the odd human world thrown in that suffered the same problem.
It has evolved quite a bit over time. Really, in the beginning it was just the corporations plus secret Sith conspiracy against the Republic but now includes an actual cause amongst some. Sadly, thats never really shown much so the general perception of any Separatists is I think evil stuff. Droids armies taking over worlds and deployments of nasty weapons against innocent worlds. Generally though, i'd like to divide the Separatists into three categories; genuine Separatists who hate the Republic, the corporations profitting from the war and finally the dark siders who have their own agendas but ultimately are following a Sith one. A three headed beast each doing their ownt hing.... thats what I'd like to see in the CIS.
I can definitely understand why someone would join the CIS. The Republic was corrupt. The Republic offers no protection (well, I mean before TCW). Piracy was not handled. As long as you lived in the Core, okay. If you lived in the Outer Rim, you were in trouble. The Jedi did not always act immediately and when they decided to act, they ofter ended up serving the wrong side (Galidraan, the Huk War). The CIS were not the only ones to use weapons of mass destruction, the Republic did so too (ex. Armand Isard created that thing seen in the Marvel series when Han runs into "Jabba"). ... Most of the CIS had right intentions. Only people such as Dooku, Ventress, Tambor and Gunray did not. I do believe Grievous would have ruled in a proper way after war had ended. He tried to ruin the Jedi Order, yes, but he from all people knew what is was to loose someone dear to him. Apart from that, there are a lot of good people who did join the CIS (for example Nas Ghent, Tofen Vane, Yoda's friend in the comic series Jedi:Yoda). I even think Alto Stratus was a good leader. Wouldn't you fight the Republic if you had been through what he had been through? In war, can we really speak of the good guys? It all depends on who wins the war. If the CIS had won, the Republic would have been the bad ones. One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.
He's not exactly the same guy as waged the Huk war- going by Labyrinth of Evil, he was altered by the CIS scientists- made crueller and more ruthless.
