The Hutts and the Hutt Empire (possible spoilers)

I usually used to dismiss the Hutts and being petty gangsters with no real weight in galactic politics but recently after reading some background on them I have come to somewhat like their background more so now. Mostly, on how they managed to hold onto such a large area of space namely Hutt Space as well as hold it from numerous threats such as Xim, the Tionese, the Republic during that one crusade, maintaining neutrality during the Cold War between the Republic and Sith Empire etc. Jabbas influence allowed the Republic to use Hutt territory to supply the frontlines in the war against the Separatists, they managed to maintain relative independence during the Empire's reign, fought a resistance against the Yuuzhan Vong with actual Hutt warships being used according to the Essential Atlas and contributed to the Confederation in the Second Galactic Civil War with Hutt cruisers. Also, where does FotJ leave the Hutts now? Will they fall as a power or try and find other means to remain on top?

Some sources like the Essential Guide to Aliens I think said that the Hutts have no industry or anything. They are more like middlemen and businessmen who get what they want from others. Which is why they make heavy use of mercenaries and I think they employ quite a few slave races during the war with Xim though thats recently changed in FotJ, I believe. A single Hutt managed to have enough resources to create the Darksaber even though it was of shoddy construction. Also, I believe the Shell Hutts hired a scientist to create the A-series assassin droids. Some articles on Wookieepedia indicate that the Hutts had their own droid designs that predated the Republics but nothing has been used of those in recent fluff. There is also that image on Wookieepedia of a Hutt in some form of battle armour. TOR says that Nar Shadda was also used by various corporations as a testing ground for dangerous pieces of technology. The UK Comic Guns of Nar Hekka had Tagta the Hutt create powerful cannons used repulsor technology that annihilated a Republic convoy during the Clone Wars.

To put it simply, how powerful are the Hutts? Is it all just because of influence or do they actually have a military might to back up their actions? I mean, surely the Hutts must have some form of military from the time before they managed to get mercenaries to do their dirty work. Also, how powerful would their warships and military be? I don't think I have ever heard of a company that the Hutts use to build any wargear so who builds their stuff? A few vessels seem to be made by MandalMotors but surely the Hutts would establish their own industry wouldnt they?

 

The Atlas describes fleets of warships guarding the most secretive and opulent parts of Hutt Space, rarely seen by outsiders. They have a sizable military it seems, but for most ventures outside Hutt Space, they rely on mercenaries and third-rate gear.

 

I essentially see them as simply a gang of largely independent criminal warlords who simply couldn't care less about what goes on outside their front door so long as they're still getting their cut and remain free to enjoy the good life. To use their fleets for conquest and the like would bring undue attention from the wider galaxy, which would simply create headaches. Easier just to focus on keeping themselves safe and letting some other scum or hired help (Mandos I'm looking at you) get their hands dirty for them instead.

While I can't think of any exact analogies, I pretty much see them as a Mafia ruled land, with each Hutt one of the various dons who are fiercely territorial within their own boundaries, and who certainly might have their hand in things outside their own walls, but who prefer to maintain the carefully built up illusion that they're perfectly legit and that there's nothing untoward about what they're up to.

...they just might secretly by funnelling money toward some totally illegal planet shattering superlaser.

But back home in the palace? Nothing to see here... move along, move along. That Star Dreadnought in orbit? Oh... don't you worry about that. It's just to keep the neighbours in line (aka. a great big "Stay The Frack Away" sign).

It'd certainly be fun sometime though to see what they could do if they chose to pool their resources together to assemble a genuine war fleet. I'm kinda hoping TOR might give us something to that effect, as it's been making quite a lot of mention of Hutt Space.

 

These are the Hutts who'll casually refit an ImpStar with a superlaser.... tells us that they have some decent shipyards, but raises the question: just what sort of hardware was Booster smuggling in to them where they do THAT as payment?

Also, does anyone know what the evidence is for Ubrikkian being a KDY subsidiary as the Wook claims? And is there evidence for actual Hutt control, aside from the Atlas showing Hutt dominance there until the Clone Wars?

Atlas implies they used to run Gyndine, too, not to mention having a TIE factory at Nar Shaddaa in TFU, which hardly suggests that Palpatine was pursuing a policy of aggressive non-cooperation in his own arms production plans...

Do the Hutts build the Galactic Empire's tanks?!

So it could be that not only do those bouncy dudes have some secret fleet of their own... they also control some mid-to-major military-industrial kajidier on the other side of the line...?!

EDIT: I also seem to remember there being a reference or two to Jabba having a very clever spy/electronic protection setup, with the visible toughs being part of his posturing of just being a minor crimelord rather than the big boss... anyone?

- The Imperial Ewok

 

Ubrikkian made the Khetanna and in The Mandalorian Armor, Kuat of Kuat notes the Khetanna was made by one of Kuat's subsidiary companies.

"Over the years Jabba had commissioned several large orders, lethal equipment for his thugs and hirelings from KDY's personal armaments division, plus elaborate palace furnishings and a superbly appointed sail barge, with military retrofits, from one of the Kuat subsidiaries devoted to luxury vessels. There had been extras thrown in that Jabba had known nothing about: hidden recording devices that had captured nearly everything that took place in the palace on Tatooine and aboard the floating barge. A good contractor, thought Kuat of Kuat, knows his accounts. Better than they even know themselves."

 

Also, doesnt TEA say that the Hutts had patrols to prevent anyone from going to their homeworld, Varl? I mean for gangsters to be able to do that... seems to me that they have quite a bit of muscle.

 

Also, for the Republic to take them so seriously in the CW movie that they needed their permission to cross Hutt Space, there must be military there to prevent unauthorized crossings in the first place.

 

Hmm... but that doesn't refer explicitly to Khetanna, and as Jabba's been on Tatooine for 520 years as of 4 ABY, I suspect he's had more than one sail barge - doesn't Ventress trash one at the start of the Clone Wars movie...?

[image=http://images3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080718165818/starwars/images/thumb/1/14/Octopus_ship_capture.jpg/830px-Octopus_ship_capture.jpg]

So, if KDY only built Jabba one sail barge, but he's had at least two Ubrikkians... either KDY take over Ubrikkian after the Clone Wars (which fits with the Atlas showing the Empire wresting Ubrikkia and Gyndine off the Hutts), or else the KDY barge wasn't Khetanna, Ubrikkian was never a KDY subsidiary, and we might suspect it was always owned by the Hutts...

True. I can see the Hutts being a bit like the Ottoman Empire - there are some ancient superweapons and a powerful leader can raise an army of conscripts and build or buy a fleet of decent modern warships, but the average local governor or garrison gets no supplies or orders from the centre, and is hardly distinguishable from the average bandit in a mountain fortress...

I thought it was that the Hutts had navigation info for hyperlanes the Republic didn't use? And I'd also imagine that Yoda would be very careful about not being seen to "invade" neutral territory, regardless of its defenses...

- The Imperial Ewok

 

No, the book is explicit that Kuat put spy equipment onboard the Kethanna itself, the sail barge which one of Kuat's subsidiary companies built for Jabba, not some unnamed secondary barge we've never heard of before or since. All of the equipment Kuat made on order from Jabba, had these devices implanted to keep tabs on Jabba, like most of Kuat's clients. Kuat himself makes a point of waiting for footage transmitted from the spy pieces onboard Jabba's barge.

An unrelated trivia-bit is that Ubrikkian made the Heavy Assault Vehicle/repulsorlift A9 Floating Fortress. Other models in the same HAV A-series, the Juggernauts, are built by Kuat Drive Yards. So Ubrikkian is yet another subsidiary company that creates its own designs, much like Rothana Heavy Engineering.

 

I was actually suggesting it was an earlier barge, since Jabba seems to have had more than one Ubrikkian - more on that below.

Re-reading the whole scene, you're pretty clearly right about authorial intent here, inasuch as some of Kuat's sensors are clearly aboard the Khetanna (it's still possible that they're actually located in "lethal equipment" and "elaborate palace furnishings" rather than shipboard fixtures, but I'd agree that's a more convoluted and broadly unnecessary argument )...

As Khetanna was apparently not Jabba's first Ubrikkian, but the narrative implies it was the only one KDY built him, the implication would thus be that KDY acquired Ubrikkian after 22 BBY, around the time of the Imperial expulsion of the Hutts from Ubrikkia - fitting neatly with the wider narrative...

The further possibilities are that the Hutts also retained some influence there, and that they kicked KDY out after Endor (and if I'm remembering right about Jabba's two-tier security setup, Kuat may only have seen what Jabba wanted him to from those cams, too)...

It's a nice idea, but this part of your argument is based on the premise that the HAV/ designations are KDY ones, rather than Republic/Imperial Army ones - for example, the F-15 is made by a Boeing subsidiary, but that doesn't mean the F-14 and F-16 are too!

Now it's possible that the HAV/ designation is a KDY one (or even that KDY took over the whole HAV/ line from the Hutts!), but it actually fits into a wider bracket of Imperial Army designations for ground assault vehicles (GAVs), including the Nen-Carvon CAV/w PX-10, the Uulshos LAV/r QH-7, and (if Wookieepedia's right) the Sienar "Century Tank" with another CAV/w designation...

So, while the Khettana reference does indicate that Ubrikkian became a KDY subsidiary under the Empire, the designations tell us more about the Imperial Army instead...



- The Imperial Ewok

 

I haven't found any source for the Hutts controlling or owning Ubrikkian Industries. Having the borders of Hutt Space encompass Ubrikkia is one thing, owning or being in majority in a company there, another.
Either way, the Sail Barge is given ROTJ and CW appearances in its profile on the OS Databank, with its manufacturer being Ubrikkian.

As far as vehicle lines go, there's no set naming pattern within the Imperial Army whatsoever. If there was, every single vehicle would conform to these, yet there's plenty who do not:

6500 ATV
Armored Personnel Carrier
CAP-2 Captivator
HSP-10 pursuit airspeeder
Imperial Troop Carrier
MTV-7 Multi-Terrain Vehicle
Multi Altitude Assault Transport
PX-7 troop transport
Reconnaissance Troop Transporter
SP.9 anti-infantry artillery vehicle
WW-676 repulsorlift sled

and so on.

The possibility does exist that not all HAV line vehicles are made by Kuat or a Kuati subsidiary, just as the AT-line is mostly dominated by Kuat or a subsidiary (Rothana), but not always (Carida Engines). Either way, so far Ubrikkian is a subsidiary company in Kuat of Kuat's time, and the known HAV models come from them or from Kuat directly.

 

Apologies for dragging on but the more I read... the more curious I get on this subject

Other points to mention, TEA says that the ancient Hutts were warriors who worked several slave species to extinction whilst reducing others to being thralls. So I'm curious how they managed this feat during their first forays into space when they lacked any slave races unless they made use of the races on their own homeworld. Don't the Rybets claim that Varl is their planet as well and they fought an ancient war against the Hutts that reduced the planet to a dead world? I know the claims are dismissed by the Hutts and others but perhaps the Rybets were the first slave race the Hutts used?

Also, I'm assuming that the Hutt Empire was first established from Varl whereupon they fought against Xim after which the Hutt Cataclysm occured which reduced Varl to a dead world whichs aw the Hutts relocate to Evocar. So, if thats the case, could it be that the Hutts ancient glories are simply long forgotten by later years when they focused on the criminal system? TEA says that the Hutts have used other species technology for so long that their own inventions have been forgotten. So would this include those ancient battle and security droids seen on Wookieepedia? The Despotica also mentions something about Hutt Jumpgates? How much did the Hutts lose?

TEA also mentions that the Empire tolerated the Hutts activities as they preferred the Hutt Council in charge rather than dozens of smaller crime lords working towards their own goals.