Was Sidious REALLY Darth Plagueis' apprentice?

I was thinking about a couple of things that dont add up.

OK now most of us assume that Darth Sidious is Plagueis' apprentice (visual guide), but can we really be sure of that?

Darth Plagueis was supposed to be a "Sith Legend" that the jedi could have possibly known about, now if that's the case and the "legend" of Darth Plagueis is true, then that means that Plagueis would have had to have been around at least a millenium before the events of TPM. (remember Ki-Adi Mundi's words..."the sith have been extinct for a millenium") which means that if his power to cheat death is known of by the jedi (even if it is considered to just be a legend) then Sidious being his apprentice would mean that Sidious must have been around hundreds of years before TPM.

But people keep argueing over the age of Darth Sidious....some people insist on believing that he's only in his sixties while others (myself included) believe that he's "at least" a couple of hundred years old, but this Darth Plagueis story would require him to be even older than that.

If he's really the apprentice of a sith lord that the jedi would have known about then he might even be somewhere around Yoda's age.

Unless he's not REALLY Plagueis' apprentice....keep in mind that he NEVER, not once, during the movie says that he was, he tells the story of the "legend" of Darth Plagueis but how can we be 100% sure that he was that apprentice?

And if he was then that takes us back to the Sidious age issue, which would mean that he's an "ancient" human.

So either he wasnt Plagueis' apprentice or Sidious is up there with Yoda in the age department......which one is it??

 

The Visual Dictionary and the novel say he is. Next...

 

So then we're back to the age of Sidious question.

How can he be the apprentice of a "legend" that the jedi would have known about and NOT be somewhere around Yoda's age?

 

The Jedi say that the Sith are extinct but they don't know everything.

 

Conversely, we have no reason not to believe it. As long as Anakin believes it, thats all that matters.

 

But see it's implied in the movie that they would have known about the "legend of Darth Plagueis", so how do you answer that one?

EDIT:

And let's try to come up with something sensible...everytime something cant be explained the next option is to call someone a liar. (Vader's a liar....Obi-Wan's a liar....Sidious is a liar.. c'monnnnnnn, EVERYBODY'S not lying all the time, especially Obi.)

 

Yes. Read the novelization. In an earlier draft of the script (upon which the book was based), it was revealed to Anakin by Palpatine that Plagueis was Palpatine's Master and Palpatine murdered him after learning his secrets. This would also mean that Palpatine does in fact know how to extend someone's life using the Force. Such knowledge gives new insight into Vader's line in ROTJ: "You don't know the power of the Dark Side. I MUST obey my Master..."

 

Maybe Darth Plagueis was not a sith legend at all but more of a story by palpatine about his master to further persude anakin to the dark side

 

There's no better weapon for a liar than the truth. Dooku used it to great advantage in AotC when he told Obi-wan everything only to have the Jedi disbelieve him. The same holds here I think. Plagueis was real, and in the original script Sidious admits that he killed him in his sleep. Whether he truly learned to conquer death we will never know. But Sids seemed to take great pleasure in explaining how he could save everyone execpt himself. That gleam in his eye tells me he knows all about Plaugueis and his death from a very personal level.




And Blain, love the name. I'd wish you long days and pleasant nights but you tried to cheat my fellow gunslingers and we left you rotting in a Kansas that was long ago.

 

All Anakin had to do was simply ask Yoda or go to the library and find out.


Again, the novel has your answer along with my previous post. He was only a Knight. He could not get into the "deeper" parts of the library that talked about force powers of the dark side. Only masters could do this. He couldn't just run down there and check it out

 

So then....how old is Sidious??

"If" the story is true.

 

But he could have asked someone....and that leaves me to believe that Sidious was telling the truth about Plagueis, then that takes us back to the question I asked Roland^^^.



EDIT:
And this wasnt a question about Sidious' age or just simply a question about the legitimacy of the Plagueis story...it's a question to try and find out if this Plagueis story/Sidious age thing is a contradiction of each other or more detail about the sith/Sidious history.

 

But he could have asked someone....


I can't think of a good way to bring that up without having to tell why I would want to know. He was having to sidestep the issue with the Jedi. Plus he didn't want to bail on his friend. He couldn't just say "So, Palps was saying there are parts of the force you guys are holding out on"

 

I think Sidious was Plagueis' apprentice.

Look at the opera scene when he turns away from Anakin and says the 'Ironic, he could save everyone else...' stuff. Look at the expression on his face. To me, that's Palpatine remembering the kill.

 

Who's to say Plagueis was human?

He very well could have been a 'legend.'

The last remaining Sith from the days before the Republic.

 

Actually, I think Starwars.com says that Plagueis was the master of ole Sids. The best bet is that Sids is older than most humans because of those freaky powers Plagueis was supposed to have, but he's nowhere near ancient.

And you don't need to be a thousand years old to be a legend. Two-hundred or less works fine.

Finally, That same article says that Plagueis died of old age. Go figure.

 

No, but you need to be AT LEAST a thousand years old to be a sith that the jedi would know about.


You see what I'm sayin?

Because I really dont think Sids was lying to Anakin about Plagueis....but if Plague is a sith lord that the jedi would have known about (legend or not) then that would mean that Sidious would have had to have been around since waaaaay back then, "IF" he's really his apprentice.


Something just doesnt add up.

 

No, but you need to be AT LEAST a thousand years old to be a sith that the jedi would know about.


You see what I'm sayin?


Yep, so that particular legend could not have been in the Jedi archives. So that makes that legend more like an urban legend only spread in certain circles. Or the current jedi council were too lazy to read the archives and the sith were not extinct for a thousand years as they assumed.

 

Palpatine just asked to be polite, PLagueis may have lived a bit longer than normal humans but not much, Palps had a normal life span. PLagueis was obviousley after Darth Bane (Last Jedi Known Sith), many sith after Bane. It was on the ROTS novel and LOE, so he was the master of Sidious, and an apprentice to another Darth who lived long after the Rule of Two began

 

We don't know if Plagueis was human or not. But that's beside the point. It may have been implied that Plagueis lived a long time ago, or else there would have been no legend about him, but in all honesty, can we trust half of what Palpatine says? Everything he said in the opera scene was designed to make Anakin question the ways of the Jedi Order and start to see things from the Sith point of view. He is the master manipulator, and so what he says isn't necessarily true.

 

Personally, I don't care either way. Doesn't affect the story much or at all.

 

It affects Star Wars in the whole. The claim that he lived since before Darth Bane or that Sidious lived since then just messes up things, its useless and affects the continuity. We know Plagueis was a sith, we know he was Sidious Master, and we know he was apprenticed to another sith. There were more than a few sith between Bane and Sidious.

Only a few are known (Darth Zannah, Darth Millennial,Darth Finn,Marka (not Ragnos), and Darth Plagueis)

 

Palpatine was born 82 BBY, so he's not nearly as old as a lot of you seem to think.