What truly went wrong with The Phantom Menace?

I believe that Lucas had a good idea and an interesting story for The Phantom Menace. One thing I dislike and really think is the major problem in the movie (other than Jar-Jar) is the slow story.

In every other SW movie, we are either jumping into the middle of the action or the plot develops quickly and the action continues on from there.

The Phantom Menace, though, seems to make the story feel unimportant. Why is it so necessary to fight these droids on Naboo? We know that the planet has been invaded, but why? Also, why are they so worried? All that seems to be happening is the queen was taken hostage, wow. I don't see innocent civilians dying and being blasted for trying to protect themselves. The enter Naboo conflict seems so boring to me.

Then the action sequences, there really isn't any major action that gives you a feeling of suspense until the pod race. The confrontation with droids on the Federation ship is pretty short lived, I didn't feel any suspense at all after Qui-Gon pulls his lightsaber out of the door and they fight the droidekas.

The entire Gungan thing is so slow and boring, not to mention the voices just getting under my skin.

TPM really starts out slow, I don't feel good about the movie at all until I finally can see the Maul/Qui-Gon fight in the desert on Tatooine. Then I lose intrest again until after the group meets with Boss Nass.

AOTC really didn't have this problem, there's always a mystery or a story going on that keeps me intrested.

What are your thoughts on the main problems of the movie? (Jar-Jar aside )

 

I disagree.
While the Tatooine scenes go by a bit slowly, I don't feel the movie does on a whole. There is a collision course between the Nemodians/Maul and the heroes and that is always exciting. There is a lot of exposition because this is the base for the prequels. So there are long scenes explaining the slave system, the corporate greed, the need to train the boy and the Jedi Code. However the film has plenty of action sequences to balance it off.

From the opening crawl to the escape from Naboo is very exciting. There are submarines, undersea creatures, hostile droids, and an onslaught of enemy tanks.

It slows down a bit for Tatooine, but those scenes are still interesting.

It is mostly exposition in Coruscant, but I still found that to be an exciting part of the film.

From the return to Naboo to the Iris Out, is non-stop action and excitement.

My only problem with the entire film is the five seconds of bathroom humor, which is a very small problem and I could care less. Jar Jar can be annoying but he doesn't bother me.

-Seldon

 

I honestly don't know why TPM is "wrong". It may be flawed but it's my favorite Star wars movie.

 

I disagree with the people dying part. People were dying on Naboo, inocent civilians. Maybe we don't see it, but Padme's people were being held in prison camps and dying. She says it herself on Naboo and Coruscant.

Also, I think that the movie is pretty suspensful. It def. kept me going. Sure the gungans are annoying as all H**, but still, take tem away you have a lot of conflict going on in the film.

 

The "problem" with TPM isnt the movie- its what people thought the movie would be.

People expected suited Vader, not a kid. People expected a young Han, not OB1.

People wanted and expected different things then what they received.

Yes, some of TPM is tough to watch- but all in all the story behind it is pretty darn good.


CLone

 

^^^Exactly my point. The people of Naboo were in camps. WHY DOESN'T LUCAS SHOW US. I want to see that. I want to see a little baby crying while being taken away from its mother. I want to see people hiding in back allys. Lucas leaves too much up to our imagination. He'd rather not show us than change the rating to PG-13. Some is good but can you please show us? SOMETHING! Can there be a reason for the whole trade federation blockade? Please. A reason for something.

I wanted less Jar Jar. He had no point in coming to tatooine. He should of stayed on the ship with Obi-Wan.

In a perfect world this is Jar-Jar's role: Qui-Gon meets him the same way (In the woods). Then after going to the city Qui-Gon sets Jar Jar free and they parts ways with Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan. Then over a radio or something a messanger tells Padme, Qui-Gon, and Obi-Wan that some Gun-Gan convinced there army to join the Naboo. "Who was the Gun-Gan?" asks Padme the officer replies "A Gun-Gan by the name of Jar-Jar Binks." (Qui-Gonn and Obi-Wan have a smile). Then hes at the final celebration.

They needed a different kid to play Anakin. He looks nothing like Hayden and he is really annoying. YIPPY...no, just no

It would have been cool if Maul had gotten away. Obi-Wan would have anger built-up. Showing hes more human and more of how he failed in teaching Anakin.

(P.S. If you think TPM is slow go watch ANH again. Zzz..)

 

I agre with clone3131 and going along with that.

People expected Alderaan, not Naboo.
They wanted the Emperor, not a rodent like politician.
These fans expected to see young Han, Lando and Boba playing in a school yard while the droids remained on the side lines.
They expected a huge clone war that would engulf the three prequels.

What they were given instead, was a complex story about a kid from an obscure desert world who ends up shaping the galaxy. The child is real, he has wants and needs and fears as well. They recieved a headstrong apprentice, and an independent master rather than a refined Jedi Master of ultimate sapience. Also on screen was a misfit alien that just didn't fit in, and a queen who wanted the best for her people and was determined to get it.

This isn't what the expected, it was new and different and added something to the saga. It changed our perception of the saga and some just weren't willing to accept it.

-Seldon

 

except that Jar Jar's scenes were to long I do not really think there was much wrong with TPM.

 

Honestly, I think The Phantom Menace had the most interesting storyline between it and Attack of the Clones. I agree it wasn't the best Star Wars film ever, but it was still good.

 

I think the story of TPM is fantastic. I love it. I think what went wrong with TPM is the screenplay itself. It needs one more revision. Bring in someone else who LIKES writing to give it a go through and improve the characters and situations. THAT is what truly went wrong with TPM. The script needed work.

 

The only REAL thing that was wrong with TPM was no explanation for the Sith and the Force. Instead, we got midichlorians. Aside from that, I believe TPM is a WONDERFUL movie, with AMAZING depth that I believe was what AOTC lacked. But, ROTS is going to have depth, so I believe it will be better.

 

I wasn't trying to imply that I didn't like the story, I do. I just really hated how slow it was and the fact too much was left to our imagination.

I like the whole idea of the movie, but I want to see why in the world they are going on this huge long out of the way trip to Coruscant just so the Queen won't have to sign a treaty. Why doesn't she just sign it? It doesn't look like the Trade Federation has hurt anyone.

Jar-Jar's scenes really annoyed me, deviating from the main dialogue and stuff. I wish he would have been quieter.

But my main point is the entire movie revolves around the Federation wanting to control Naboo. Why does it even matter? Nobody cares except for a few people. If it wasn't for the fact I was a Star Wars nut, I would have absolutely no idea that the planet was really being taken over. I've watched TPM with non-Star Wars freaks and they don't understand why the Federation wants to take over, and I agree, I wondered the same thing the first time I saw the movie.

That in my opinion is it's biggest flaw. The second thing is the slow telling of the story.

 

It's so important because it's the vehicle by the means of which Palpatine gets power.

 

He's saying why do the Neimoidians care, which is because they really WERE blockading tax routes and crap. When I first read that, I was like, is this a different language?

 

God forbid a Star Wars film make you THINK...

 

I was 7. I couldn't think, not properly anyway.

 

First off, I'd like to say that not everyone who dislikes The Phantom Menace "wanted to see THEIR OWN VISION of the movie" and "were angry that they didn't see what they had envisioned" as so many of the TPM supporters like to say. I 100% accept that these are George Lucas's movies and I am grateful for the incredible amounts of time and effort put into it to bring us a new Star Wars movie.

Does that mean I adore absolutely everything about the Phantom Menace? Absolutely not. It is easily my least favorite Star Wars movie and there are many things I dislike about it, particularly Jake Lloyd's weak performance and the afformentioned lack of any tension whatsoever in the Naboo scenes.

There are bits and pieces that I like( particularly the character of Qui-Gon and Palpatine's rise to Supreme Chancellor) but overall as a whole movie TPM just doesn't work for me.

What I really want to make clear is that I don't critique TPM against my vision of Episode I, but as a film in of itself, and to me even in that standard if falls short. Looking back, would I have taken a different direction for Episode 1? Possibly, but that was never my decision to make or anybody else's besides Lucas', and I completely understand that.

 

Well as you get older then you will appreciate more subtle stories that make you think and function on multiple levels like TPM does.

 

The only problems I had with TPM were some of Jake Lloyd's performances (mostly the Naboo fighter sequence) and the fact that Lucas has a consistent lack of "show don't tell" throughout the movie. nyjet is right - we get tons of verbal reflections on the state of Naboo, but we never see anything beyond the people being directed into camps. No scenes of people starving and suffering, no Gungan city in ruins. Lucas missed two big opportunities to visualize important aspects of the film, and given that the very nature of the SW films rely heavily on the optical interpretation of the viewer, I was surprised that he overlooked it.

Otherwise, I'm fairly satisfied with TPM as a whole. It has some interesting characters and a plot that's fairly tightly layered and requires more thinking than one might expect.

 

Oh, so now at 18 I'm just not old enough to like The Phantom Menace. I don't think so

 

I was replying to Bacon, not to you.

 

George Lucas had a good idea with the phantom menace but ruined it. The whole deal with the trade federation is boring. George Lucas would have a winning product if he focused more on the prophecy of the chosen one, and the controversy surrounding Anakin's training.

The whole sequence on tattooine was very good.

The duel with maul was also very good. The palace fighting scene was also pretty good. However, the space battle sucked in comparison to the revenge of the sith space battle. The gungan battle was too stupid and was the worst star wars battle EVER.

A lot of the dialogue scenes regarding the conflict with the trade federation were vey boring.

If george lucas had focussed on the story about Anakin and obi-wan and qui-gon and included a bit more on the sith and a little more charge on the action sequences, he would have had a winner. The musical score could have been better, too. The music was horrid with exception to the recycled themes from the old trilogy and 'duel of the fates'. The music was great in the old trilogy, but not here.

The serious scenes were dull and the scenes meant to be fun were just kiddy and juvenile.

TPM was just an above average movie, but it could have been great.

 

Strilo posted on 4/10/05 10:58am

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I think the story of TPM is fantastic. I love it. I think what went wrong with TPM is the screenplay itself. It needs one more revision. Bring in someone else who LIKES writing to give it a go through and improve the characters and situations. THAT is what truly went wrong with TPM. The script needed work.[hr][/blockquote]

That's a good way to put it. I agree.

 

<<<<<Well as you get older then you will appreciate more subtle stories that make you think and function on multiple levels like TPM does.>>>>>

Oh, I do now that I can actually understand what the scroll says.

<<<<<The music was horrid>>>>>

No, it wasn't!

 

its still my favorite.it has none of the "elements" but is still f.a.s.