What were Anakin / Vader's motivations?

Anakin was drawn to the dark side of the Force by the prospect of gaining the power that he believed would enable him to control everything around him, and most specifically, life and death. I was thinking about this recently and two questions occurred to me.

1. After Padme's death, what made Vader tick? Why did he carry on as Sidious's right hand? What did he want to accomplish?

2. Would he have continued in the role til the end of his life had Luke not come on the scene and turned him back to the light?

Thoughts?

Actually that's about five questions, but you know what I mean...

 

I think he believe he might be able to bring to peace to the galaxy by opressive rule , find ways to resurrect Padme,SLAUGHTER Obi-Wan,kill his master,heal his wounds................................Even if he does not want to carry out Sidious order he cant right?
ANakin=Form5 variant<Sidious=Form7
ANakin=Force Grip<Sidous=Dark Side lightning
Anakin=501st Legion and Dark side users,Sidious=Entire Empire plus some allies (INCLUDING vader's henchmen)

 

I actually just read the chapter in the ROTS novel where Vader realizes Padme's dead. He remains as Sidious's righthand man somewhat as a punishment- He does not feel he deserves a merciful death and his hatred towards himself can only promise him more power. He had done some pretty dirty work to get where he did by Mustafar and he wasn't about to give it all up- even for Padme. The only things I could think that kept Vader where he was until ROTJ was the prospect of more power and ruling the galaxy with an iron fist. In the end it was kinda sad, Palpataine was all he had left up until Luke came along. His hatred kept him alive; his hatred of the betrayal of Sidious, his hatred towards Obi Wan and his hatred towards himself for killing the person he loved the most.

and yeah, I'm gonna say Vader was comfortably numb in his position. He knew there was no way he could ever best the Emporer in a physical fight after being that seriously wounded, so he accepted his place. It's better to be second in command rather then at the bottom.

 

After tapping into the Dark Side, he was overtaken with it. He thirsted for it's power. When he kneels before Sidious, he's doing it for Padme. A day later, when she confronts him on Mustafar, he feels he can rule the galaxy, and force things to be the way he thinks they should be. Perhaps, like a drug addict. After the Jedi Purge, there is no going back for him. He has nothing left to go back to. It's kind of like a person who has become a convict, and gives up on themselves. He can never be a good person again, he thinks, so why try? He's a slave to the dark side. "it's too late for me , son."

 

1. After Padme's death, what made Vader tick? Why did he carry on as Sidious's right hand? What did he want to accomplish?

A desire for order and control. Anakin had always believes that a strong hand was necessary(as shown in his political views from AotC) and feared things being out of his control. When he fell it was a fear of not being able to stop Padme from dying, and after his baptism by fire, Vader's desire for control was amplified and it lead to the Vader who wanted to "bring an end to this destructive conflict" by ruling with an iron fist.

2. Would he have continued in the role til the end of his life had Luke not come on the scene and turned him back to the light?

Probably. He had no where else to turn.

 

^ ^ ^ So his redemption really was almost entirely down to Luke then?

 

I think so. He needed someone who was willing to forgive him and was able to make Vader see that he could turn back from the Dark Side. The only other person I think could succeed at it would be Padme if she had survived. Vader hated Obi-Wan too much for it to work and his view of Leia was probably too negative for her to be able to as well.

 

Agreed with everything you posted, Master_Starwalker. He would see his failure to protect Padme not as a failure of the Dark side, but his own failure for simply not being strong enough in it yet. This would no doubt have led to him strengthening his desire for a controllable galaxy under Palpatine. Once he failed at protecting Padme, what else did he have? He had already betrayed his Order, slaughtered numerous Jedi, attempted to kill his Master, so he clearly couldn't go back to being a Jedi. The only choice he had was to even further devote himself to the Dark side. He had burned his bridges, had nowhere else to go. He could have struck Palpatine down, but, then what would his place in the galaxy be? Without Palpatine, Vader would have had no direction after ROTS. Without Padme, Palpatine was the only one giving him guidance, giving him acceptance. I think you are also correct that without Luke's intervention, Vader probably dies a sad, lonely old Sith Lord, not unlike Michael Corleone in Godfather III. He dies quietly on his throne. It wouldn't have mattered if he killed Palpatine at some point, he still would have been all alone. Luke saves him from that fate, if only for a few minutes. Luke allowed Vader to die with hope in his heart, knowing forgiveness. Knowing love from a son to his father. Those minutes on the Death Star, as he was dying, meant more to Vader than the entire previous 23 years combined. Because of Luke, Anakin's spirit also finds peace, and acceptance from his former Master Obi-Wan Kenobi and Yoda. Because of Luke's intervention, the tragedy of Darth Vader has a happy ending.

 

To the first, I would say that he was driven by A) his hatred and B) his craving for power... so, in other words, the same things that would drive any good Sith Apprentice. His hatred of Obi-Wan, the Jedi, Sidious, and himself was--as Stover put it--a kind of unshielded thermonuclear reactor that he could turn onto anyone who stood in his way, channeling it like a lightsaber. And his need for power drove him to overcome his physical limitations by reconfiguring his lightsaber form and taking threats to the Empire very seriously (consider his views on the Rebellion and the Jedi in comparison to Tarkin and the other Imperials in ANH).

As for the second question, I would think that Vader might have kept on going because--again, as Stover put it--the Sith path was all he had left. There was no Padme to turn to, and all of his former friends were either dead or in hiding. All he has left is Sidious (who he plans to overthrow) and a vast Empire living in terror of him. It isn't until Luke shows up that we get a glimpse of the old Anakin inside Vader, the one who would be proud to have such an excellent Jedi for a son. I think that redemption in general works only when there are individuals that the darksider has some kind of bond with. I think it's tied into the Sith Order, in that the apprentice has only his or her Master to depend on, and when he or she finally kills him and claims Mastery, the Sith's destiny becomes forever sealed to the dark side. It's why Sidious is so immaculately evil--he has no backstory, no history to indicate if and when he was ever on the good side.

 

1. After Padme's death, what made Vader tick? Why did he carry on as Sidious's right hand? What did he want to accomplish?

He carried on because he had nothing left. He'd sacrificed everything he was for two things: his wife and power, and the latter cost him the former. The Emperor was the only one who would shelter him, who would accept him after all he'd done. In his mind, he'd committed himself to a path and there was no reason to turn away. After all, what was waiting for him if he simply walked away (assuming Palpatine would LET him)? Having seen the Saga, Vader in ESB looking out of the Executor's viewport no longer looks like a Dark Lord surveying his kingdom, or even a father searching for his son. He looks like a man looking out his window because there's nothing else to do. Part of his lethal malice is sheer boredom and despair. Unleashing his wrath on a lower officer, no matter how mild the reason. probably cheers him up for just a small moment. As for his goals, I agree with the others: he wanted a nice, orderly galaxy that ran the way he wanted it to.

2. Would he have continued in the role til the end of his life had Luke not come on the scene and turned him back to the light?

No, I believe he was searching for a way to overthrow the Emperor. Perhaps he even hoped to finally unlock the secrets of Darth Plagieus at long last. If possible, that power might even be used to regenerate some of his damage. Sure the limbs would still be a total loss, but maybe he could take off the mask and breath again, see the world with his own eyes. However he couldn't do it himself, he needed a partner. Starkiller, Luke, Lumiya, all these represented potential chance to depose his master when the time was right. So while he would have remained a Sith Lord, he was seeking a way to no longer be the apprentice, but the master.

 

Don't you see, we don't have to run away anymore. I have brought peace to the Republic. I am more powerful than the Chancellor. I can overthrow him, and together you and I can rule the galaxy. Make things the way we want them to be.

You can destroy the Emperor. He has foreseen this. It is your destiny. Join me, and we can rule the galaxy as father and son. Come with me. It's the only way.

Once Anakin decided to embrace the darkside of the force, his purpose changed. Just like any Sith Lord, he wanted to overthrow his Master to complete his quest for power.

 

^ ^ ^ So by that rationale, even by the time Padme came to Mustafar, she ceased to be Anakin's top priority?

 

I see it as Anakin's top priority was still Padme, he wanted to save her, to raise their child and live together, but the seeds of Vader was saying "You can do all that, but be top dog too."

Anakin is so messed up by that time that he doesn't realize how pyschotic he sounds, and how oblivious. Obviously Padme, former queen and a passionate Senator for democracy, isn't going to rule an Empire with her crazed husband. Anakin would've known to keep those wishes quiet, but Vader was telling him he was above everything else.

Even once Vader is constructed, his first concern is Padme. He's not asking "What's happened to me?" but "What's happened to her"

 

Exactly.

 

Wow, this is really deep

After being "ressurected" by Palpatine, he really had nowhere left to go. While inwardly he desired "more power" (no doubt blaming Padme's death on himself), he had no way of attaining it - he couldn't defeat the emperor in the condition he was in and so was left to obeying his orders until a possible apprentice (Luke) came along.

 

You gotta feel bad for Vader though. He had the potential to destroy the Emporer, but he kept him around for a minute too long and ended up having Padme die and stuck being crippled in a life support suit.

Even if Luke did join the darkside, whose to say Poppa Vader would be there much longer? Luke would be the one who killed the Emporer, .'., he'd be the rightful ruler.

 

Very interesting thread!

I believe that once Vader learned of the death of Padme, what little remained of Anakin was burried under layers of anger, hatred, and ambition. I think Vader's hatred of Obi-Wan would be a definate sustaining force in his life, which maybe transmuted into a hatred of all Jedi. With his powers heightened by his immertion in the dark side, I think Vader would nurture his ambition to over-throw his master.

I think that this relationship with the emperor is also something that would be a major part of his life. With Padme's death, perhaps the Sith ideal of greater power has firmly taken over by the time of the OT. Learning Sith secrets from Sidious for the sake of power, plotting to rule the galaxy himself by killing a master that he loves and hates could be a continuous theme for Vader.


I don't like the idea of our Dark Lord we see in the OT being a man full of self pitty and sorrow, though. I would rather think of him as being someone who has a spark of goodness deep within but not as something that dictates his life, or even something he is aware of.
Possibly in the small hours, alone in his meditation chamber, he will remember who he once was and the emotions this causes will further fuel the darkness within him.