When did Lucas decide Leia was Luke's Sister?

I've wondered this for a long time - when did Lucas decide Leia was Luke's sister?
Gary Kurtz said in an interview that Luke's sister was meant to be another character over on the other side of the galaxy, and I assume that this is the "Other" that Yoda refers to in ESB. So then Lucas decided sometime after ESB that Leia would be Luke's sister.
Of course all the scripts have gone thru revisions, is there any evidence of Leia being Luke's sister in any earlier versions of ANH or ESB?

gez

 

Damn! I could probably answer this if I had my copy of STAR WARS: THE ANNOTATED SCREENPLAYS, but I let a friend borrow it, and he lives about four hours away.

But I had always assumed that Lucas probably decided on it as he was writing ESB.

 

There are two evidence that I can think of. First, in ANH Leia was flying above Tatooine at the beginning to pick up Obi-Wan to help against the Death Star. It was her father that told her to get him. This ties Bail Organa w/ Obi-Wan and shows that Bail knew where Obi-Wan was (not common knowledge). This kind of goes to the whole thing that Yoda, Ben, Bail Organa, and Padme split the twins to protect them from Vader and the Emperor.

In ESB, Leia heard Luke calling to her from Bespin. This shows that Leia had some attunement w/ the force. It also shows that there is a connection b/w Luke and Leia.

Edit: these of course are only circumstantial evidence and don't prove anything. This concept in ANH (like many other aspects) were clearly vague and general that could lead to different developments later on (Obi-Wan's answer and look when telling Luke what happened to his father)

 

dont kid yourself. The notion of Leia being Luke's sister was created during the writing of ROTJ.

Originally the "other" was to be someone else that wouldnt be revealed until the episodes VII-IX; when it was decided to end the saga with ROTJ, Lucas had to compress all the storylines into one film, and he had a lot of loose ends to tie together. Thats why the film feels rushed and contrived in many places. Leia seemed to be the ideal choice to deal with the "other"--the sister of Luke--without introducing another character and it allowed them to get it out of the way quickly.
All the so-called "evidence" that this was always the plan is merely coincidence. Lucas saw that there was coincidental evidence that could be stretched enough to barely make the storyline believable. The exact same thing happened with Vader and Luke father, who were originally two different individuals.

 

So if when they did Empire Strikes Back and Leia wasn't supposed to be Luke's sister, how come Luke called to Leia and Leia mysteriously heard him? I think by the time they stuck that in, Lucas must have decided to make them siblings.

 

Zombie, there is only one way and that is the final product on film. For one, Lucas has never said that Ep VII-IX was condensed into ROTJ. Only Kurtz says this, and Kurtz is still disgruntled that Lucas fired his worthless behind. So who knows how reliable his comments are. Conceding that you may be right, for the sake of argument, who cares? All writers and directors make changes and revisions to their stories before they are finally released on film. There is nothing wrong w/ this either. There are plenty of aspects in Anh and Esb, in which Lucas left himself open to develop and change the story.

 

"All writers and directors make changes and revisions to their stories before they are finally released on film. There is nothing wrong w/ this either. There are plenty of aspects in Anh and Esb, in which Lucas left himself open to develop and change the story."

What's up with all this? ?

Zombie was simply answering the question. "Who cares" would be the poster of this thread, and anyone else who would "care" to know as well.

I'm just glad Lucas made up his mind before things got really hot and heavy between the two twins.

 

According to Lucas in an issue of Bantha Tracks (published around the release of ESB), the "other" that Yoda was referring to in ESB was a character from "Star Wars 3" who was to return for the final trilogy, and NOT Leia.

So it seems that it was after ROTJ came out that Leia became Luke's sister.

[EDIT- found the quote;

Q: At one point there were going to be twelve Star Wars films.
I cut that number down to nine because the other three were tangential to the saga. Star Wars was the fourth story in the saga and was to have been called "Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope". But I decided people wouldn't understand the numbering system so we dropped it. For Empire though we're putting back the number and will call it Episode Five: The Empire Strikes Back. After the third film in this trilogy we'll go back and make the first trilogy, which deals with the young Ben Kenobi and the young Darth Vader.

Q: What is the third trilogy about?
It deals with the character who survives Star Wars III and his adventures.

Bantha Tracks, on the eve of release of TESB

Note; his adventures...

 

Zombie -

what you say matches what I've learned over the years.
The Annotated scripts book doesn't really address this issue, which seems odd . If I've missed something let me know.

I wonder what Kershner was thinking when Yoda says there is another, had Lucas told him it was the as-yet unseen sister?
Has anyone read any early ROTJ scripts which might shed some light.
And - has this been discussed before? I did look at the thread list but couldn't see anything similar; altho I know that the genesis of the paternal relationship between luke and Vader has been discussed quite a bit.

gez

 

firstly, i was not complaining, merely explaining. As a writer myself, i can understand the choices GL makes, even if i occasionally disagree, but Leia as Lukes sister was something i never had a problem with.

But anyway...

Kurtz' comments and the comments of the actors and crew are often times more reliable than Lucas' own words. He has been known to frequently lie, misrepresent and deliberatly hide certain facts. I know that seems bad to not trust the CREATOR himself, but sometimes you have to read between the lines and look at the evidece and the comments of others as well.
But aside from all of that, as pointed out above, Lucas has admitted to what i posted earlier--that the "other" was a different character that would have been prominent in VII-IX.

If the annotated scripts say nothing about this then it is yet another attempt at Lucas to cover up his storytelling. Theres no mention of the genesis of Lukes father and Vader being the same person either (which happened while writting the second draft of ESB).

I have read the first draft of ROTJ and im fairly sure that Leia is revealed to be his sister there as well. If i remember correctly, it was said with even more passing than in the theatrical version--sort of a "oh by the way, leia is your sister", and then never dealt with in detail.

Therefore we can reasonably assume that after ESB was released it immediatly thought up because it made it into the rough draft.
so there you go.

 

SomeRandomNerd -

I've had a look at the interview you mentioned in BANTHA TRACKS - however I don't see how this is related to the "other" that Yoda mentions. In fact I'm not sure what Lucas does mean by this, he could be talking about Luke I suppose.

gez

 

I think an early TESB draft features a scene where Luke has a conversation with his father´s ghosts and where he learns that he has a sister who has begun her Jedi training on the other side of the galaxy.

 

wait just a minute, they're making a third trilogy? Did I read that right?

 

awww, man! i agree, a sequel trilogy wouldn't have hurt but the leia=sister thing adds a lot of drama maybe not in the ot, but certainly in the prequel and more fan fics than I'd care to count.

 

Either during the ESB, or while writing ROTJ.

 

I'm sure GL has kinda thought all of it from the beginning, despite what various sources say.

 

absolutly not Jimkk. The current state of the star wars films are far removed from his original conception of the saga. Read the prior drafts of ANH and you'll see what i mean. Luke didnt even have a sister until after ESB was filmed.

 

When did Lucas decide Leia was Luke's Sister

When Lucas decided he'd end the saga on ROJ... some time after the post-production of ESB.

 

Allow me to repost Zombie's glorious post:

dont kid yourself. The notion of Leia being Luke's sister was created during the writing of ROTJ.

Originally the "other" was to be someone else that wouldnt be revealed until the episodes VII-IX; when it was decided to end the saga with ROTJ, Lucas had to compress all the storylines into one film, and he had a lot of loose ends to tie together. Thats why the film feels rushed and contrived in many places. Leia seemed to be the ideal choice to deal with the "other"--the sister of Luke--without introducing another character and it allowed them to get it out of the way quickly. All the so-called "evidence" that this was always the plan is merely coincidence. Lucas saw that there was coincidental evidence that could be stretched enough to barely make the storyline believable. The exact same thing happened with Vader and Luke father, who were originally two different individuals.

Are you my sock?

 

I think it's plausible Lucas played with the idea of them being siblings as early as writing those outlines and first drafts for Star Wars. He probably bounced the idea around in his head a few times during conception/writing. After all he was trying a lot of ideas out and meshing things together.

But the idea wasn't solidified until somewhere in and around ESB and ROTJ.

I don't think those couple kisses in ANH and ESB are that bad. Different world, differnt culture, different customs. Hence the opening disclaimer A Long Time Ago, In A Galaxy Far Far Away . I'm not saying it promotes incest, just that a simple kiss is just that, a simple kiss.

 

i cant conveive of Lucas deliberatly placing incest in his films, even if he wasnt sure if he would go along with that paryicular plot point. I mean this is the guy that is responsible for Ewoks! I think the lone fact that Leia gives Luke tongue is enough to refute the evidence (regardless of the fact that she was doing it to get Han jealous--thats no excuse to french your brother!). Its no coincidence that yoda mentions a mysterious "other" and Leia is kissing Luke--the other was never meant to be Leia until after the film was released.

 

I'm guessing that the audience all thought that Luke and Leia would get together, but Lucas all ready had Han and Leia pinned down so he at the last minute said she can be his brother.