Who erased the Kamino-files and why?

Dangerous and disturbing this puzzle is...

...UNTIL NOW:

Only a jedi... my guess is Qui-Gon-Jinn
as a former apprentice of Dooku (he could
use his help right now).
Because this army is for the Republic (the
Jedi are not there to serve...). He had
to hide Kamino because nobody should see
that an army is being created.

Then after the army was nearly finished
Darth Sidious decided to bring the army
with the help of Dooku and Jango and this
Kamino-Dart into play. So OB1 was SUPPOSED
to find the army of course. Dooku lied to
Nute of course. He knew about all that.

Qui-Gon-Jinn is of course also the person
who helped Dooku and ordered under the name
of a dead Jedi (namely Sifo-Dyas) the clone
army. Looks like the Jedi created the army.

Other points: -Sidious needed a stronger
army.
-Jinn is heard by Yoda because he carries
guilt (like Vader and not OB1 and Yoda who
all died).
-Jinn was a rebel.
-Jinn had another view of the force than Yoda.
-It is not clear when exactly the army was
ordered. It could easily be before QGJs
death.
-QGJ didn't know that Sidious = Palpatine.
-Dooku and QGJ paid the Kaminoans with money
from this banking guy who sat near Dooku.
-Jango was hired by Dooku (Tyranus) and never
met QGJ.
-Maybe QGJ was still disappointed that
the Jedi didn't want to train the Chosen One.



O.K. It's obviously Qui-Gon Jinn.



*******Oh yes, and please mods...Don't
delete this thread as another Sifo-Dyas
discussion. It's far more than that! It
ought to be a unified picture!********

 

I know you put lots of thought into your theories, but Qui-Gon is not a traitor. Dooku left the Jedi order and became associated with Sidious after Qui-Gon's death, so Qui-Gon couldn't have possibly helped Dooku.

Besides that, if Dooku was eager to get Obi-Wan to join his side in AOTC, why would he not mention Qui-Gon's affiliation with those events? It seems like that would be the thing that would turn Obi-Wan the most.

 

How do you know so well about the timetable?
Nothing 100percent accurate is known!
From where do you know that Dooku became
associated after QGJs death? It's nowhere
in the movies.

And Dooku didn't tell OB1 the whole truth
because he didn't know how OB1 will decide.

 

For a long time I had this very same theory, because I think it would add a lot of depth and importance to Qui-Gon's character. If it were true, he would end up basically handing everything to Palpatine he needs to creat his Empire, but he would have done it with good intentions each time.


However, It doesn't quite mean anything to the overall story, and it would be hard to pack it in Ep. III without detracting from everything else.


An easier and more efficient way of explaining this plot point would be to have Anakin or Dooku be the one who erased the files.

 

Dooku erased them.

 

Dooku erased the files.

Qui-Gon may have been a rebel, but he was not a traitor.

 

Dooku erased them before he left.

Qui-Gon had nothing to do with it.

But that's just my opinion.

 

This subject is more suitable to the Episode 3 forums.

But anyway Its not Dooku, thats way way too predictable, he is more of a red herring if you ask me.

Qui-Gon Jinn? Nope, he was loyal to the Jedi and the Republic.

Now there was theory a few months ago that its actually Anakin Skywalker.
I think it makes his character more interesting and we see how far Palpatine has manipulated the young man.

 

"Qui-Gon-Jinn is of course also the person
who helped Dooku and ordered under the name
of a dead Jedi (namely Sifo-Dyas) the clone
army"

Seems like Sifo could have died after Qui-Gon.

 

I think it could have either been Qui-Gon or Mace Windu

I think mace windu is the traitor for the following reasons.

-He makes a wierd face when Obi says to yoda that the sith is controlling the republic

-He Hints on the fact of the clone army by saying to palpatine " there are not enough jedi to protet the republic, We are keepers of the peace, not soldiers"

- He keeps telling Obi wan to train anikin by saying, your aprentice is the only one who can bring ballance to the force, he says this because he knows hes a traitor

- He killed Jango because he already had the Clone army on the way to sidious and he didnt need or want anymore clones.

-he brought all the Jedi to Geonisis and they died.

- he didn't kill dooku while he was up on the balcony with him (so he is responsible for the death star plans getting away)

- he didn't go help yoda kill dooku

- he sticks up for dooku when padme says that dooku is behind the assasination attacks

- he erased the kamino files so that Yoda didnt go andget them before sidious/palpatine

-he tells obiwan that it is most important that he finds who the bounty hunter is working for because he wants to see if its the one that Tyranus/dooku hired

Thats some good stuff!

 

too deep.
According to... just about everyone I know, the only people that think about this stuff is us. (people that post on a SW message board)
I think whatever happens in E3, it has to be relatively simple, so the average movie goer will get it. They cant assume everyone knows this story as well as we do. If Qui-Gon comes back 6 years after he was killed, how many people would remember him?

I think it was Dooku, but then again..... if Anakin did it, that could be a very cool twist.

could be.

 

Unfortunately I think this is simply a weak spot in the storyline. If Dooku erased the location it makes no sense.

He wants the Jedi to find Kamino so the Republic gets their Army, that is all part of the Sith plan. If he had, in fact, succeeded, then the Republic would have been overwhelmed by the Separatist Confederation. Which does not appear to be the Sith Plan.

Qui-Gonn makes no sense on several counts. Number one is why on earth would he even think of the need for an army for the republic? And certainly he was not in league with Sidious (else that whole Darth Maul duel at the end of TPM would look really silly).

In fact it could be argued that at that time Tyranus was not even in the picture. Remember Darth Maul? Remember that there are always 2, a Master and an Apprentice?

So Sidious must have recruited Dooku after Qui-Gonn's death.

Basically, the whole Kamino *mystery* seems bogus.

 

Sidious was behind it.

 

Unfortunately I think this is simply a weak spot in the storyline. If Dooku erased the location it makes no sense.

It makes no sense because he didn't. You're meant to think he did right now, it seems obvious but he is a smoke screen.
Everyone is assuming its Dooku but he surely joined with Sidious after he quit the Order, hence making it unlikely he'd be able to tamper with the Archives.
As I kinda theorised, its most probably is Anakin.

And its not a weak spot in the storyline. It already makes out that there is a traitor in the Jedi's midst. Its pretty obvious that Dooku is a traitor to his former Jedi brethen, but for a different reason.
But the Jedi have another traitor, someone within their Order.
And until Obi-Wan discovers Kamino's secrets, it makes no sense to have even deleted the system.

So this is where Anakin fits in. He does not seem to me to be a typical traitor. Why would he delete Kamino? He wouldnt do so unless he was told something which appealed to his nature and his emotions.
And Palpatine is the key man because he has been very friendly with the young Padawan, praising him, advising him and acting like a father figure towards him. It would make sense that Anakin would do something for the Chancellor if he felt it was important and appealed to who he once was.

Well anyway its a good idea, and more thought provoking that an obvious red herring in Count Dooku.

Sidious was behind it.

Well obviously
But its who he got to do it thats important.

 

What about Yoda?

Perhaps he has foreseen the clone wars, which would explain his line at the end of the movie "Begun this Clone War has!" ... like, how did he know it was THE Clone War which would make history?! If Yoda has foreseen the Clone Wars, then perhaps by deleting the Kamino file he thought he could prevent the clones from falling into the Jedi's hands.

But the damned toxic dart leads Obi Wan to finding out the truth anyway. Yoda learns that you can't stop fate ... remember Qui Gon's line from TPM: "There are no accidents," or something like that.

This makes Yoda's reaction all the more heart-breaking when the little boy Padawan guesses that someone had ERASED the Kamino file. Yoda thought he would be able to prevent the future, prevent the prophecy, but his naive ruse is spoiled by the innocence of a child.

This also makes Yoda's little speech about Jedi arrogance all the more poignant.

Mind you, I'm not convinced by my own argument, but it's an interesting proposition.

 

It doesn't make sense because there is no purpose to it. Why hide Kamino from the Jedi? Do you think out of thousands upon thousands of star systems some Jedi's going to go "Hey, I wonder what's going on out there?".

And after all they did find it. And so what? If the Clone Army were for the Separatists, THEN it would be a big secret. The army is FOR the Republic. The Sith obviously WANT the Jedi to find out about this army so they can defend the Republic against the separitists.

It needlessly brings up the notion of a traitor amongst the Jedi. Why foster that? That is also counterproductive to any Sith plots. Better to let them feel safe, secure and in control.

The Anakin theory? I would say fine if Palpatine asked him to. But again, what would be the purpose of Palpatine doing so (see above)? Best to not even draw attention to it.

It's weak.

 

Dooku erased the files.

 

xgeoff: Why hide Kamino from the Jedi?

Well that's the big question, isn't it? My previous post explained why.

If Yoda has foreseen (a prophecy? a vision?) that the Clone Wars ultimately lead to the destruction of the Jedi, then perhaps by erasing the file Yoda tries to prevent the Jedi from even KNOWING about Kamino, home of the cloning technology. If the Jedi don't KNOW about Kamino, then they can't go there to order a Clone Army.

But, the army has been ordered anyway by the mysterious Syfo Dias (either Sidious himself or an agent of Sidious), and CHANCE assures that Obi Wan will fly to Kamino and deliver the Clone Army into the Jedi's hands whether they want it or not. They've been completely manipulated.

And Yoda's attempt to prevent FATE by erasing the Kamino file was all in vain.

Just playing devil's advocate.

 

I highly doubt that it was Qui-Gon, because the order was placed just after his death, I think. It was Dooku. He had the means, oppertunity and probable skill to do so. Just because Qui-Gon might have been sympathetic to Dooku doesn't mean that he was the one who did it.

 

If Yoda was behind it (the hiding) in order to prevent the utilization of the army then HE wouldn't have been the one to go get the Clone Army.

Besides, how would hiding the location do anything? One would assume that if nobody showed up to pick up the Army that the Kaminoans would have placed a call:

"yeah, you're army is ready. Send someone to pick it up and have them bring the check".

 

xgeoff: If Yoda was behind it (the hiding) in order to prevent the utilization of the army then HE wouldn't have been the one to go get the Clone Army.


By that point it doesn't matter. It's all out in the open, and the Jedi's hand has been forced. By retrieving the army himself, Yoda manages to exert SOME control over the situation. He doesn't WANT the army to begin with, but the Jedi and the Republic have no choice but to take advantage of the clones in this crisis.

Besides, how would hiding the location do anything? One would assume that if nobody showed up to pick up the Army that the Kaminoans would have placed a call

You're right -- the Clone Army was going to fall into the Jedi's hands eventually. Erasing the Kamino file was a VAIN, FUTILE attempt at preventing the inevitable. It's an indication of Yoda's arrogance.

 

I think it was erased just to delay the Jedi from finding Kamino for as long as possible. If they found out too soon, they might have realized what someone was doing (setting them up) and somehow managed the situation better, possibly even avoiding the war.


But now that Dooku has advanced the seperatists movement so far, He & Sidious are ready for war & ready for the Jedi to "find" their army. So now, the Jedi do indeed need that army. Not because THEY want it, but because Sidious wants them to have it.
1- So they can fight the war he has been setting up for years & eliminate many of his enemies
2- so they can be blamed for starting that same war, as if it was all their fault & all their idea, because "they" ordered the clones.

Palpatine is a genius.

 

arrowheadpodracer: Not because THEY want it, but because Sidious wants them to have it.

Right, but remember: Obi Wan only finds out about Kamino because of the toxic dart that kills Zam. Sidious didn't set that up -- that's just CHANCE.

 

"Everything is proceeding as I have forseen. mwuahaha.. mwuauahahahaa.... MWUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA!!!..."

 

No offense but a theory based on Qui Gon Jinn being a traitor is IMHO absurd. There are litterally no facts to back it up..... From what I can gather Sifo Dyas was used as a alias for Tyrannus when he infiltrated and erased the Kamino files ten years prior, period.

His reasoning? When Sidious a.k.a Palpatine demanded the fabrication of the Clone Army be kept secret on Kamino and neighboring Rothana he needed to wipe out it's existence completely from Coruscant intelligence so no meddling Jedi would stumble upon it prematurely. . . . .

<[-]> Saber