Who was Jedi Master Sifo-Dyas???????

There have been people who say Sifo-Dyas is actually Sidious but Obi-Wan mentions that there was a Jedi Master Sifo-Dyas. According to Kenobi, he died around the time of TPM. So, who was he and why is he mentioned in AOTC when he is never seen in the PT?

Is he:
- Sidious?
- Sidious's former master?
- a plot hole?
- just a name?

 

He was once a Jedi, as Obi-Wan said, but was killed and his name was used by either Dooku or Qui-Gon to order the clone army.


Yes, I said Qui-Gon.

 

Its Dooku. It all points to Dooku.

and I dont mean he's dead & Dooku used his name, I mean - Dooku was once known as Sifo-Dyas. Just as Ben was once Obi-Wan.
Name change is pretty standard in Star Wars.

"It's like a symphony. I use repeating themes."- GL

 

I disagree arrowhead,
You must take into consideration that Obi-Wan, Yoda, and Mace all know who Sifo-Dyas was, and they all knew he died ten years earlier. At the same time, all the jedi are aware of the current existence of Count Dooku leading the Separatist armies. While I agree that Dooku might've used Sifo-Dyas' name in ordering the clone army, I really don't think Dooku himself is Sifo-Dyas.
Whoever Sifo-Dyas was, I think we will find out a lot of importance about him in Episode III. For one reason, Lucas creates this huge shroud of mystery around this jedi that no one knows about or has seen (as far as the audience is concerned). And secondly, I don't think it's a coincidence that Sifo-Dyas died 10 years earlier, the same time the events of The Phantom Menance were taking place. Who knows, maybe Qui-Gon was Sifo-Dyas. Qui-Gon will also play somewhat of a role in Episode III, so who knows?

 

Sifo Dyas is not Sidious, Qui-Gon, or Dooku. Lama Su mentioned that Sifo Dyas was on the Jedi Council, and a leading member. Qui-Gon was never on the Council as we know. Although Jango Fett told Obi-Wan that he was recruited by a man called Tyranus, it only points to Dooku using his name to order the clones, not Dooku being Sifo-Dyas. Dooku couldn't have served on the Council either because if he had he would have crossed paths with Obi-Wan long before AOTC. And Sidious would only be interested in keeping his identity a secret...

 

"Lama Su mentioned that Sifo Dyas was on the Jedi Council, and a leading member. "
Have you ever heared of thing called "a lie"?? Palps or Dooku could have just called the Kaminoans and said stuff. "Oh, yes, I'm the Jedi Council leader. Build me some clones. Great. Bye." Or something...

Sifo-Dyas was killed... Maybe this could be mirrored to ANH: "your father was murdered by Darth Vader"? Perhaps the Jedi say that Dooku was killed, instead of admitting that he had left the Jedi Order.

I don't really believe in this, I'm just making stuff up as I go. Yes? No? Comments?

 

Obi-Wan, Yoda, and Mace all know who Sifo-Dyas was, and they all knew he died ten years earlier

really?- when does anyone say that?
I know Obi-Wan is "under the impression he was killed" and he ASKS about it, but Mace & Yoda dont even confirm it, they just kinda look at each other.

Sifo-Dyas was killed... Maybe this could be mirrored to ANH: "your father was murdered by Darth Vader"? Perhaps the Jedi say that Dooku was killed, instead of admitting that he had left the Jedi Order.


Thats exactly what Im saying. Thats what we've seen already, anyway.
according to Owen, BEN - "that wizard is just a crazy old man."
when Obi-Wan- "died around the same time as your father."


I think name change is symbolic and GL will do it again.

We already know Dooku was involved, why not place the order? He WAS a Jedi. if his name was sifo-dyas it all fits perfectly.

he hooked up with sidious
he erased the files
he placed the clone order
he officially left the jedi
he changed his name
he started the seperatist movement

simple as that.

 

My thoughts.

Sifo-Dyas was the first Jedi who was in league with Sidious. Sifo-Dyas ordered the clones to Lama Su, and then came Dooku, wishing to follow Sidious in the dark side. Dooku killed Sifo-Dyas, but the Jedi never found out who killed the Jedi Master.

Maybe Yoda and Mace weren't happy when they heard Dyas's name because he was one of the first Jedi in left the Order, so he was a "non grata" person. But I don't think Yoda and Mace knew that Sifo-Dyas was indeed a Sith apprentice.

I know it won't be in that way, but that's what I thought.

 

interesting theory, but my first question is.. why?
if thats what happened, who cares?
We'd never meet Sifo-Dyas. Why bother bringing him up at all?

what I mean is- why would GL do that? I just dont think it makes a good movie.

A plot twist with someone we know would make a good story, & thats what I think people forget when this topic comes up.

Consider what would work well on screen. What would people understand?
Maybe something we've seen before.

Yeah, I guess SD could be some guy that died, but that would suck, IMO.

Plus- we know Dooku recruited Jango. Why would someone else then place the order?
Especially if you're saying Sifo-Dyas supposedly left the Jedi before Dooku.

It just doesnt make sense for it to be anyone else.

It has to be Dooku.

 

What I think is Dooku finished up the task Sifo-Dyas begun. Maybe, because of Sifo-Dyas's bad reputation, the Jedi didn't care about Dooku ("it's not in his character").

Anyway, I know it's sounds silly and non sense to introduce a character only by his name and then never show him. But...

But, as I said, I'm hoping GL will show us something that'll astonish us. That is, Sifo-Dyas is indeed Sidious...

 

I dont think the supreme chancellor would risk ordering an army. especially if he isnt supposed to know about it.

I know he wears that tricky hood that baffles everyone like Clark Kents glasses, but I really dont see how or why the Supreme Chancellor would risk placing the order himself. Its not neccessary.

 

Ok, this is a loooooong shot, and I'm just having fun speculating, but it occurred to me reading everyone else's ideas...what if...Jedi Master Sifo-Dyas did not even exist, that Darth Sidious pulled the ultimate Dark Side Mind Trick on the Jedi Council, making them all believe there was a Sifo-Dyas on the Council and then using that trick to do his secret(at the time)evil deeds, and then Mind Tricking the Jedi into thinking he had been killed to cover his tracks, I dunno. OK, as I typed it out, it sounded dumber than when it rattling around in my head. Sorry!
Then again, the Dark Side supposedly clouds everything... maybe Sifo-Dyas was just one hell of a cloud.

 

You're all wrong, guys: JAR JAR BINKS is Sifo-Dyas!

Think about it... you never see them in the same room together, it's always the one you least suspect, and Dooku has a rock-solid alibi (he was busy leaving the Jedi Order).

Yep, it's Jar Jar, case closed.

 

From what i have pieced together sifo diays is gui-gon. He used the name of a fallen friend to order the clone army sensing the upcoming need.

 

ooo lilyodaboy that thought hadn't crossed my mind...wouldn't that be an neat twist?

anyway, I think that it's interesting that Sifo-Dyas and Sidious (the names) sound similar

 

sifo diays is gui-gon. He used the name of a fallen friend to order the clone army

IMO, that is the only other theory that could be true (because theres nothing to PROVE it false). I just dont like it. It requires an RotJ Ben meets Luke moment with Obi-Wan & Qui-Gon with QG explaining this all to OW. That could actually be really cool, but I dont think it fits. Qui-Gon was a rebel but thats frickin crazy. That would mean he was working with Dooku, who used a sith name to recruit Jango. Dont forget that part. We KNOW Dooku found Jango. As Tyrannus. Even if QG placed the order, do you really think its likely that he somehow let Dooku/Tyrannus pick the host? I dont.

I think that it's interesting that Sifo-Dyas and Sidious (the names) sound similar

I think thats why a lot of people think its him.
but we know Sifo-Dyas was a real guy. a jedi. Sidious was busy playing senator.
so he cant have been a senator & a jedi at the same time.
it cant be him.

 

Why wouldn't Qui-Gon have worked with Dooku in ordering the clone army?

Dooku wasn't a Sith yet (Maul was still alive), he was still that old maverick Jedi who mentored Qui-Gon back in the day. I don't have a real problem with the possibility of Qui-Gon and Dooku working together.

But I still say it's Jar Jar.

 

When Dooku recruited Jango he was going by Darth Tyrannus so had left the Jedi & become a sith.
I dont think Qui-Gon would work with a sith.

Especially to order a clone army without telling the council. he may have been crazy, but he wasnt stupid. He would (at the very least) have been concerned that the clones would be turned on the Jedi by the sith he was partnered with.
Which I still think is out of the question to begin with.
Qui-Gon found out the sith were back & he reported it immediately. When would he have worked with Darth Tyrannus? (who didnt come along till Maul was gone, who died when QG did)
It cant have been Qui-Gon.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if it was Dooku or another fallen Jedi, as was suggested. And it may seem meaningless to some, if his position isn't made more clear in Epi 3, but really it's clear enough already. When Yoda and Mace look at each other it's saying that they know something that others dont. Sure we may never know exactly what Sifo-Dyas' role is but the fact that the two most prominent Jedi seem to be more in 'the-know' than the rest of the Jedi points to another of the failings within the Temple. Yoda and Mace dont trust the Jedi Order enough for the true news of Sifo-Dyas to be known to everyone.

It's quite possible, as was suggested, that after Dooku separated, Sifo-Dyas was close to separating and then, known to Yoda and Mace, killed by Dooku. It's very possible that Yoda thinks that Dooku is the Master of the Sith. He still may not know of Sidious. This would make sense in that they would then conclude that Dooku trained Maul behind their back and then trained Sifo-Dyas but maybe Sifo-Dyas betrayed Dooku and told Yoda about Dooku's ways. Shortly after, Sifo-Dyas goes missing and Yoda and Mace assume the Master of the Sith, Dooku, destroyed him. Again, distancing any knowledge of Sidious' existence.

Isurus the White

 

maybe Dooku tricked Qui-gon into ordering the clone army..after all he was his master and someone he would trust

 

thats possible, but that would make Qui-Gon look kinda dumb. It just doesnt seem right to me. I dont think it would come across very well on screen. Try to imagine how they would explain that to us.
Would that make a cool movie?
"Oh, the dead guy did it."

 

In all the previous SW films, each Sith has a dual identity:

Vader = Anakin

Dooku = Tyranus

Palpy = Sidious

Except for one: MAUL

Maul = Syfo-Dyas?



Maybe Syfo-Dyas is Dooku's former Master who is killed by Maul. This would be because Dyas was,in secret, a Sith Lord and Palpy was his apprentice.

Palpy had Syfo killed and then took his place as the master.

After Maul is killed, Palpious approaches Dooku making him believe he is in fact his former master, when in fact it is really Palpy under the hood.


Dooku doesn't know that is Palpy under the hood. He likely never met him as he was already "on the outs" with the JC around the time Palpy ascended to power.

Palpy is playing EVERYBODY and ALL SIDES.

 

Maybe Syfo-Dyas is Dooku's former Master
But we know Yoda was Dookus master. And if he means, "Oh a different master"- thats just too far back. I know Ben threw us all off when he talked about how Yoda was the master who trained him so when QG first came along there was alot of discussion about that, but lets be honest - The PT wasnt really written yet. GL didnt even know QG existed.
I think he PUT Sifo-Dyas in E2 to reveal him in E3. Not to tell a story about a dead guy.

Dyas was,in secret, a Sith Lord and Palpy was his apprentice
That just goes way too far back in the timeline for me. Its a Star Wars movie, not a history lesson. Now you're getting into Palpatine & how he rose to power. Maybe even how he bacame Senator.
You think GL is gonna take time out of the PT (basically, "the back story") to tell yet ANOTHER back story?
I hope not.

Dooku doesn't know that is Palpy under the hood

Ok, now you're kidding, right?


Anyway, you're theory still ends up with-
"Oh, the dead guy did it."

IMO, Not very likely, cause its just not a very good movie plot. Who would care? Why should we? And who would explain all that? I try to picture that scene.
I cant.



Something else to consider- "Count" is a title, not a name.
Do you think Jedi use titles?
I dont.


I love all these other theories, though.
This is fun.

 

"I think he PUT Sifo-Dyas in E2 to reveal him in E3. Not to tell a story about a dead guy".

I agree... (read it with a Yoda's voice)

 

Who here thinks Sifo-Dyas is alive?