Why does Sidious want Queen/Padme to sign treaty?

Hi there,


Ok, lets just say that the Trade Federation and Sidious got the Queen to sign that treaty....what would that of done? I don't understand how that fits into the master plan of Sidious, plus in the beginning of Episode II now she is trying to me killed....why? Lets say she would of died, what would be different that would help out Sidious?

confused,

-matt

 

Sidious wanted the Queen to sign the treaty so that Naboo would be totally handed over to the Federation. Then as Palpatine (we assume), he would be able to call for a vote of no confidence in the Senate to remove Valorum - he would have evidence of the Federation invasion, by way of the signed treaty. He never expected the Queen to escape, or for it to escalate into full-scale war on Naboo. But when the Queen got to Coruscant, Palpatine took advantage of the situation to ask HER to call for the vote of no confidence, convincing her that the Senate would be unable to act unless it had a stronger leader. He never intended it to happen like that, but he's very crafty and quick-thinking, and turned everything to his advantage.

As for killing Padme in AotC, first of all it was Nute Gunray who wanted her killed before he would join Dooku's Seperatist movement, and since the Federation battle droids were important to Dooku, the Sith decided it would be best to kill her. Also, of course, Padme was the leader of the opposition to the creation of the Republic Army, and Palpatine secretly wants the army to be created - by having Padme killed, he would eliminate a major obstacle to that.

 

Maybe I'm just stupid, but I have to admit that I was hoping to find the answers to those same questions when I found this topic. I think the films should have been more clear on Palpatine/Sidious' motives for the things he did. Maybe Palpatine will have a classic Bond villain "explain how it all makes sense to the victim before you kill it" moment and in ROTS, and that way it will all be clearer.

 

Yeah, Palpatine's plan is a bit too... I dunno, random? I really don't see how the treaty would have helped things, unless he was going for a gradual military take over instead of a political take over.

 

DMM is right here. All it requires is a little thinking and then you get it. It doesn't have to be in the movie. If it was, it would also reveal too early who Palpatine really is.

 

Yeah, Palpatine's plan is a bit too... I dunno, random? I really don't see how the treaty would have helped things, unless he was going for a gradual military take over instead of a political take over.

Palpatine always planned a political take-over. His original plan was for the Federation to blockade Naboo, then invade and force Amidala to sign a treaty. This would leave the Senate in total shock and disarray, Palpatine would call for a vote of no confidence in Valorum, and more than likely be elected because of the sympathy vote - he would have evidence of the illegal occupation of Naboo in the treaty that had been signed, and would use it as an example of Valorum's weakness. However, what Palpatine never expected was for the Queen to escape and to come to Coruscant - he had to adapt to the situation, and instead made the Queen call for the vote.

 

wow great thanks to everyone for their quick responses, that cleared a lot up for me. But man, i feel sorry for the common movie go er or maybe a kid, this stuff is kinda hard to figure out. But thats what these boards are here for

 

wow great thanks to everyone for their quick responses, that cleared a lot up for me. But man, i feel sorry for the common movie go er or maybe a kid, this stuff is kinda hard to figure out. But thats what these boards are here for

It is very complex, isn't it? It took until about the fifth time I'd seen the movie for me to finally understand Palpatine's plan in full, and I went through the same thing with AotC - I really had to think about it a lot to put it all together. Hopefully it won't get much more complicated in RotS, and fingers crossed we'll get some kind of clear explanation from Palpatine about exactly how he's done all this. Perhaps one reason some people don't like the prequels as much as the originals is because all of this political intruige is very complicated and not easy to understand at all - there's nothing even close to it in the originals. The average movie goer or film critic probably wouldn't take the time to try and work it out piece-by-piece like we do, and all they see is a big mess of politics that they think doesn't belong in a Sw movie, when in fact, the way George has set out Palpatine's rise to power is nothing short of genius, in my opinion. One of the most fun things about the prequels for me has been figuring out Palpatine's plot, and when you suddenly realise and understand something new about it, and everything falls into place and makes sense, it's a wonderful feeling.

 

But man, i feel sorry for the common movie go er or maybe a kid, this stuff is kinda hard to figure out.

Well you know, common movie goers and kids don't know that Sidious and Palpatine are the same person, so it shouldn't confuse them at all. When they finally learn the truth in ROTS, they'll have forgotten all about the treaty plot in TPM. Though if they do remember, they'll have some thinking to do.
This is why I love Star Wars. It gets you to think!


DMM: I totally agree with you. The plot with Palpatine is so well written and it fills you with joy everytime you figure something new out!

Perhaps one reason some people don't like the prequels as much as the originals is because all of this political intruige is very complicated and not easy to understand at all

Actually, my little sister(who is also a Star Wars fan, sort of) said the other day that she kind of liked the OT more because it wasn't as complicated as the PT, with politics and stuff. So you're absolutely right!

 

when you suddenly realise and understand something new about it, and everything falls into place and makes sense, it's a wonderful feeling.

Firstly great job DMM! Your explanation made considerable was spot on

Great feeling? You bet!

 

Palpatine's original plan was for Padmé to sign the treaty and discredit Valorum. As it was, Plan B worked just fine.

 

Just watched TPM last night to apply my newly learned knowledge, and you guys are pros. Thanks Darthy for clearing that up for me. You made it 10 times more enjoyable....now i have to do the same thing with AotC....

 

I invite you to read also

http://boards.theforce.net/message.asp?topic=16689231

 

Great thread guys, but I have another question. At the beginning we are told that Qui-Gon and Obi-wan have been secretly dispatched as ambassadors to deal with the blockade, but surely Valorum would have told the representative from Naboo (Senator Palpatine aka Darth Sidious)about the secret meeting since he was the planet's representative in the galactic senate, then why does Sidious act surprised when Nute Gunray informs him of the "ambassadors"(sp?) aboard the federation's ship. shouldn't he already know? Or, is he just pretending not to know like when the Jedi and Clones show up on Geonosis and Dooku "acts" surprised and angered (but as sidious' apprentice he had to know they were coming)? I can't believe that Valorum wouldn't at least tell Palpatine even if the rest of the senate couldn't be trusted.

 

but surely Valorum would have told the representative from Naboo (Senator Palpatine aka Darth Sidious)about the secret meeting since he was the planet's representative in the galactic senate....

I can't believe that Valorum wouldn't at least tell Palpatine even if the rest of the senate couldn't be trusted.

And in fact we know that Palpatine knows of Valorum's having sent the jedi because he says directly to Amidala via hologram that the Chancellor assured him the ambassadors did arrive right as the Trade Federation blocks the planet's communications.

then why does Sidious act surprised when Nute Gunray informs him of the "ambassadors"(sp?) aboard the federation's ship. shouldn't he already know? Or, is he just pretending not to know like when the Jedi and Clones show up on Geonosis and Dooku "acts" surprised and angered (but as sidious' apprentice he had to know they were coming)?

I think you pretty much answer your own question if Sidious is acting surprised in that scene, then it is indeed a fakery.

I personally don't see him being all that surprised about it though. He seems to me to just calmly tell the Viceroy that "this turn of events is unfortunate; we must accelerate our plans. Begin landing your troops." Clear, simple progression of the plan made with Sidious being aware enough ahead of time of the jedi ambassadors sent in order to think it through and arrive at the acceleration of the plan as being the best option at that point.

 

Sidious needed Amadala do sign a treaty making the blockade legal.

 

Do put out a different point of view here, I want to say this.

Based off the TPM VD, Maul's Sith Infilutrator has a clocking device. Master Jinn said to the queen that he felt the Trade Federation meant to destroy her? Could he have in fact been sensing the Sith's plan instead? Is it possible that Maul was originally going to assissinate her before the treaty could be signed? Look at the ramifications of that:

1. The Trade Federation illegeally invaded Naboo.

2. During said invasion, the legeal ruler of the planet is killed.

3. Supreme Chancellor Valoorum will look bad, companded by the fact that his staff is mostly on the payroll of the Trade Federation. Palpatine will be nominated and probably win Sumpreme Chancellory.

To deal with the aftermath, Palpatine will send in Jedi to take out the droid army and have the Republic Navy take out the fleet. I know, the Republic has an army, but they must have some sort of fleet (evidenced by the ship that transported Master Jinn and Padawan Kenobi). Doing so would probably kill Gunray and destroy any equipment that let him get in touch with Sidious.

 

I don't think Maul was intended to assassinate Amidala BEFORE she signed the treaty - I think Palpatine needs the treaty signed so he'll have evidence of the invasion, and evidence that Valorum was powerless to stop it. However, she might have been killed AFTER she signed the treaty, thus giving Palpatine even more of a sympathy vote in the Senate. It's an interesting idea, though!