Why is Han Solo so dumb in ROTJ?

Maybe it's because he spent a year frozen in carbonite, but Han Solo didn't seem too quick in Return of the Jedi. There is a clear change in his characterization.

In ANH, he's a little cocky but rightfully so. In ESB he's very clever, and evades the entire Imperial Fleet. However, in Return of the Jedi, he's a bumbling fool. He's borderline incompetent. He's stepping on sticks, saying things like like "Chewie and Me" and closing the doors when he's trying to open them. Half the fleet is also destroyed because he didn't disable the generators in time.

The other change is his interaction with characters. His slow realization of what it means when he finds out that Luke and Leia are related ... he looks like an idiot. Also his behavior when they're trying to use the stolen code. I'd say the only competent thing he did in the whole movie was to use the AT-ST to get the Imperials to open the door.

What do people think? Am I going too far here, or did everyone notice?

 

Yes, you are going too far.

 

He may be dumb in ROTJ, but he also grabs Leia's chest. He can't be completely brainless.

 

Harrison Ford was bored with the character by then.

Han was cooler in ANH and TESB.

 

He's stepping on sticks
Nobody's perfect. It's a dramatic vehicle to start the bike scene.

saying things like like "Chewie and Me"
Han's grammar and method of speech has always been poor. That was part of his charcterization since ANH. Rough around the edges, etc...

closing the doors when he's trying to open them

How about "it's not my fault" when the Falcon's hyperdrive is down in ESB (when he was so clever). It's not bumbling, it's a mistake at a bad, high pressure moment. Also a dramatic device to propel the story forward.

Half the fleet is also destroyed because he didn't disable the generators in time.

I'd say the only competent thing he did in the whole movie was to use the AT-ST to get the Imperials to open the door.


The generator almost isn't blown and the fleet is destroyed because all of the rebel forces walked into a trap. This is the big point. Palaptine orchestrated the entire DS2 battle to lure the Rebels in ands wipe out the rebel forces once and for all. with the exception of the twig snapping, all of Han's "bumbling" moments are meant to accentuate how bad the situation is for the Rebels. they are all dupped by Palps. That doesn't make them bumbling. It makes palps and evil genious, who loses in the end.

He is a huge hero in RoTJ. After walking into an intense ambush and against overwhelming odds, he leads the Rebel ground forces to victory at the critical moment for the entire assault.

 

JediSF

I understand your counterpoints. Your strongest point is the Emperor's trap. Fine, I'll cut Han some slack for that one.

However, I still think there's enough examples to make a case. The simple fact that they're using him as a story device so often forces him to make mistakes and do things we wouldn't expect Han Solo to do.

As for the "It's not my fault" in ESB ... the ship was damaged by the Imperial Attack in Hoth. He patched it up as best as possible, but with a broken part, no light speed. This is the same problem in TPM. I'd hardly call him bumbling for that.

I am not a Han Solo hater. I'm just dissapointed that he's not as cool as he was in ESB or even ANH. The same is probably true of Vader. He is watered down as well and just doesn't seem as threatening. But that's a discussion for another thread

 

Harrison Ford was bored with the character by then.

you took the words right outta my zombie mouth!

i love all the OT, but clearly ROTJ is the weakest of the three. if you notice, it seems just about all of the actors are tired / bored with the whole concept. it's like they are sleepwalking. but, eh, it's still alot better than either of the prequels. at least you care about these characters even if the actors don't...

 

Why is Han Solo so dumb in ROTJ?

To add onto this: Why is Luke so dumb in TESB? I mean, he let his hand be cut off. What an idiot!

 

Bri, got where you're coming from. But...

Solo is supposed to be a different person in RoTJ. From beginning to end, he is not the out for himself smuggler we met in ANH. Even in ESB, he still had a certain amount of self-involvement. That's why we see a change in his demeanor. Luke, Leia and the Rebel Alliance have rubbed off on him. He's more compassionate and self-sacrificing.

Also, I don't really think Han bumbled in ESB. My point was he wasn't perfect in any of the movies. Similar scene in ANH. When he rounds the corner in the DS and is facing a team of storm troopers head on (I like the original version when it's only about a squad instead of half of the Imperial Army), he looks like a complete jacka$$. But it's in an endearing way. The scene wasn't meant to paint him out to be a complete fool. Similar intention of scens in ESB and RoTJ.

 

Leias-Love-Slave, I agree?

 

Han's not dumb, just cocky. He's fairly confident in his hotwiring abilities, but that didn't take him too far.

 

"Han's not dumb, just cocky"

Agreed, Han is not dumb in ROTJ. He is just overconfident in his abilities most of the time.

 

han did a good job. you get stuck in his position and see what you do. If most of those thing didnt happen the movie would be short and boring. and Chewie takes the at-st, han didnt really have to think hard on that one, Chewie did most of it.

 

"Half the fleet is also destroyed because he didn't disable the generators in time"

Well even Palpatine said "An entire LEGION of his best Jengos were down there"

I think Han did well for a whole legion.

 

...why is Han Solo so dumb in ROTJ? Two words; Space Syphillis.

 

[DarthLassic007]: "Harrison Ford was bored with the character by then."

I wonder about that. I know it has been said that Ford was tired of playing the character and wanted him killed off in RotJ. But it does seem ironic that Ford basically made a career out of playing that same character over and over again. Maybe he was just tired of Star Wars.

And ya, Han was a basically bumbling fool in all of the films, but he acted very cool while doing it. That's one reason why he's my favourite character of the OT.

 

I think because he's been on a block of ice for a year. He'd obviously be a little slow.

 

I don't see how Ford becomming bored with the character would affect how he is written in any way.

'I'm bored with Solo.'

'Ok! We'll make him real dumb in the next movie and that'll show you!'

I mean... sometimes I don't think people have the slightest ideas on how movies are made.

And as others have said, he wasn't dumb in just RotJ. You were most likely watching RotJ, or thinking about it and seeing viewing Solo in an unfavorable light in what may be an unfavorable movie for you and so his character flaws become more prevalent to you. But, I'm an idiot so don't trust the droid

 

The Han character just doesn't work for the ROTJ plot line.

ANH = A rogue smugler that helps the Heros on their quest and discovers the meaning of loyalty. Sounds interesting.

ESB = A rogue smugler trying to go legit on the run from the empire. Tries to hidout with his other smugler friend, gets betrayed. Sounds interesting.

ROTJ = A rouge smugler recovering form hybernation sickness half the movie who then leads a band of rebels to befreind little teddy bears and capture an imperial station. crappy.

 

In defense of Solo closing the blast doors in ROTJ instead of opening them you have to remember he is hot wiring them, and as you saw in the movie, a crap load of wires came out of that box, and although im not an expert hotwiring things is not an exact science, hes pretty good to have got any response from the doors, good or bad.

 

ROTJ = A rouge smugler recovering form hybernation sickness half the movie who then leads a band of rebels to befreind little teddy bears and capture an imperial station. crappy.

I didn't know that Han started smuggling make up. Weird. Why did the Emperor ban rouge?

 

ZombieProblems
Registered: Jul 04

i love all the OT, but clearly ROTJ is the weakest of the three. if you notice, it seems just about all of the actors are tired / bored with the whole concept. it's like they are sleepwalking. but, eh, it's still alot better than either of the prequels. at least you care about these characters even if the actors don't...

Jul 04.....clearly says enough.
So does the bashing.

ROTJ can't be called the weakest. ALL scenes with Vader, Yoda, the Emperor and Obi Wan were incredible. Same with almost every of Luke's scenes. Mark Hamill looked tired while preforming getting struck down by the Emperor's lightning??? Didn't the Vader/ Luke scene on Endor give you the creeps when Vader turns on Luke's Saber looking as if he might strike him down? The Emperor's theme??
The Battle of Endor/ DS 2- weak????? Force Ghosts reunion, Anakin's death????

I can't believe people call this the weakest of the three. ANH is weaker, from that perspective. It only featured a couple of dramatic scenes if you will.