Would Vader have killed Luke and Leia if he found them as children?

If Vader had found either of the twins before ANH, would he have killed them?
Vader was very reluctant to kill Luke on Bespin even when Luke was trying to kill him. I think that he would try and keep them secret from the Emporer (which is what he tried to do in ESB and failed) and would have used them as a tool against Palpatine.

However, if he found, say, Leia when she was two-years-old, concealing her would probably be difficult and Vader knows that Palpatine is displeased with his reduced powers.

What does everyone else think?

 

My guess he would raise them in the hope that he can use them against Palpatine when they grow older. Whereas if the Emperor found them first he would raise them to become his new apprentice/s. I doubt they'd be killed outright, depending on their age and what they have been taught before hand of course.

 

"always two there are,no more-no less!"

 

He would then made them fight each other, the stronger one would become his apprentice.

 

I agree, I figure after awhile either they would fight each other or Over power them. Then Fight each other for control of the galaxy.

 

But Palpatine had known that Padme will have a baby. Have you ever think WHY he didn't do antyhing with them?

 

Palpatine as well as Anakin as well as everyone else thought that Padme died pregnant.

 

I don't think Vader would have killed either twin, but Palpatine might have.

 

There are several hypotheticals to discuss here:

1. Vader discovers one or both children by himself.

2. The Emperor discovers one or both children by himself.

3. Vader and the Emperor both discover the existence of the children.

In scenario 1, I think that Vader tries to keep his children a secret from the Emperor. And their continued existence creates a division within him, which may tip the Emperor off to their existence. Vader keeps an eye on his children to learn about their well being but does not reveal to them his true nature. This scenario makes you wonder if Vader actually knew about Luke and tried to keep his identity from the Emperor a secret. (the theory would include a cat and mouse game between Obi Wan and Vader where Obi Wan does his best to hide his presence from Vader)

In scenario 2, the kids are toast.

In scenario 3, the Emperor takes the children and raises and trains them in the ways of the dark side of the force, The Emperor would have the same confidence as he had in ESB and ROTJ that if the kids were turned to the dark side, they would obey his commands.

 

If Vader was to discover that his offspring had survived, i believe he would not kill them. The theory of him training them to challenge the Emperor, yeah i could believe it, he tried it against Luke in ESB.
If anyone has read Dark Lord - The Rise of Darth Vader (I wont spoil anything if you haven't), there is alot of conflict inside him. It points out he would never revisit Tatooine or Naboo, simply because it would remind him of Padme, his mother, and Anakin Skywalker. If he was to discover Luke and Leia, would it mess with his mind? Would it show him a path to the light? Or would Palpatine notice change in Vader, discover the children and kill him? I suppose alot could happen if he had discovered them earlier. Who knows what would of happened!

 

I agree. But I do think Vader might have killed Luke or Leia if Palpatine wanted him to.

 

"Would Vader have killed Luke and Leia if he found them as children?

I think that is the dumbest question I've ever heard, no offence. I mean the guy became a Sith to save his wife and his baby, now when he finds his kids the first thing you think he's going to do is kill them? That makes no sense. They're his kids, Sith or no Sith. Rule of two? Easy, find out which is stronger and they will succeed Vader after Sidious is gone. The other won't need to be trained in the ways of the Force in the first place.

As for Vader trying to kill Luke...when was that? On Bespin he was doing nothing more but toying with him, on the Death Star II he was mostly being defensive to put on a show for the Emperor. I don't remember Vader ever actually trying to kill Luke.

 

Well, knowing that vader had just killed children....maybe. But his own children? Thats a tough question. Like previous posts, i would have to agree that vader would probably raise them and teach them the ways of the darkside to unleash them on palpatine. Although, if he raised his kids and tought them the in the ways of the darkside, after they killed Palpatine they just might turn on their own father as well. Treachery is the way of the sith...

 

It's not a dumb question to me, at that point in ROTS Vader was willing to do anything to please Palpatine and submerge himself in the darkside, he was willing to kill children all too easy, so to speak. His mind was already tormented and confused after mustafar and his unstableness makes him unpredicable.

Come ANH/ESB 19+ years later Vader's mind has probably matured and his thoughts may be very different.

Personally I don't think Vader would kill the twins if he found them, although it wouldn't surprise me. And if he hid them, I don't think he could of kept it from palps, Palpatine would of sensed it in Vader.

 

Would Vader have killed Luke and Leia if he found them as children?

i dont think so. there was good in him all along and it took his children to bring it out in him. so i dont believe he would have killed them.

 

No, he turned to the DS to protect his family in the first place, and was willing to turn away from the DS and sacrifice himself to save Luke in ROTJ. Not to mention the above posters accurate observation that Vader has never tried to kill Luke. Look, I like Luke as much as the next guy but if Vader had ever actively tried to kill him then Luke would have been dead meat.

 

If we're talking about the Vader we saw in the PT -- since when does his behavior make sense? The fact that "they're his kids" didn't stop him from trying to kill his 'beloved' wife, who in turn was pregnant with his children. He nearly killed all three in a fit of rage. Not to mention that he made a career out of slaughtering kids in general. So under the right circumstances, or if Palps suggested that it needed to be done, I think that the PT version of Vader would do it.

The OT version of Vader (no relation to the PT version IMHO) never could bring himself to kill his children of course. He even steers the Emperor away from the notion of killing Luke. But that is an altogether different character we're talking about.

 

Vader never tried to "kill" his wife... He was angry with her and just didn't want to hear anymore of what she had to say. I'm not justifying his behavior, I'm just saying he COULD NEVER and WOULD NEVER kill Padme or hurt her on purpose. He just wanted her to shut up and stop with what he perceived as all lies. If he wanted his wife dead SHE WOULD HAVE BEEN DEAD. It's not like it would have been hard for him to do. I think the "NOOOO" at the end of ROTS pretty much sums that up. Secondly, we are not talking about an all together different character. Vader WOULD have killed Luke. He definitely would rather of had him join him, but if it was Lukes "destiny" to not turn and instead be destroyed, Vader would have done so and said so to Luke. At that point he was still willing to do what Palps wanted and only in the end does Luke get through to his father.

Now if we are talking about babies only... No I do not think Vader would ever harm his own children. He would have tried to overthrow the Emperor sooner rather than later to protect them. Sith or no Sith, he would love them just as much as he loved Padme. And more. After all, his Son was able to do what his own wife couldn't....

 

I'll agree that Vader wasn't specifically trying to kill Padme -- I should have phrased my first post differently. However, you don't choke someone using the dark side of the Force if you're just trying to get them to shut up. He lost all sense of reason and lashed out with what amounted to a killing attack. Did he regret it later? Sure -- after the fact. By the same token he might also feel remorse after attacking and killing children (including his own) -- but I feel that in the PT he demonstrated that he was capable of killing both children and family if he were angered enough. The remorse would come too late. His actions spoke louder than his words.

Once again, actions speak louder than words. Obviously he threatened Luke in that scene, but he didn't kill him, did he? He could have killed Luke many times in ESB but did not. And if you believe that he "felt" something odd about Leia in ANH, he argued against Tarkin's wishes to terminate her. He had a number of opportunities to kill them both and he never does. I see a noticable difference between the OT and PT Vader in terms of their actions.

 

I agree actions speak louder than words. I also agree with you in the sense that he "threatened" Luke but didn't kill him. He was quite ready to kill Luke at the battle of Yavin when he didn't know Luke was his Son. When he found out differently, he was not as ready to, BUT WOULD HAVE FOR HIS MASTER. I also believe cutting Lukes hand off is pretty lethal. If Luke would have hung around much longer he would have had to join his father OR DIE. That same logic applies to Padme. He "threatened" her but did not kill her. The fact of the matter is: that is still the same Vader, not a different Vader for PT/OT. It is a little rediculous to say PT Vader is more crazy/evil than OT Vader. He blew up entire Planets! I'm sure there was children on them. The discussion is whether Vader would harm his children "when they were children" and my answer is still NO. He would love them as much as he loved Padme. Even more so. There is a difference between killing children (as horrible as that is) and killing your OWN children. He was just as much capable (or uncapable) of doing that in the OT as you say he was in the PT. He definitely showed capabilities to kill his GROWN children way more than he ever did as babies. He loved Padme and his unborn child. He turned to the Dark Side to save them.
Now with Leia...
He kept her alive to use her, not because he "felt" her in the Force. We all know he knew nothing about her until ROTJ. He was more than willing to "harm" her by turning her to the Dark Side.
And yes, you can use a Force Choke to try to get someone to shut up. Luke also used a Force Choke on the Gamorrean Guard at Jabba Palace. It wasn't lethal either. He just wanted the guard out of the way. It wasn't like he was a threat to Luke or anything. If Luke wanted to kill him, he would have. Same with Anakin. Padme was a sweet, loving person, who in NO WAY DESERVED THAT. As I said earlier, I am IN NO WAY justifying his actions, or "glossing it over" but if he wanted Padme dead, he would have used more than a quick Force Choke.

 

Except that Luke was a powerful man in his own right, strong in the Force, and fighting against Vader with a lightsaber. Vader cut off his saber-hand in order to subdue him, but he still definitely avoided killing him. Padme was an unarmed and heavily pregnant woman with no Force abilities and carrying not just one, but two children. Luke survived Vader's attack, Padme did not. I still see a big difference in the two actions. One was calculated, the other was blind anger. One showed control, the other no control.


The fact of the matter is: that is still the same Vader, not a different Vader for PT/OT. It is a little rediculous to say PT Vader is more crazy/evil than OT Vader.

I don't think it's ridiculous at all. All you have to do is watch the films and note the differences. I see very little of the OT Vader in the PT. In general, the OT Vader is cool, calm, in control. He is charismatic, articulate, and even possesses a dark sense of humor. He only uses his lightsaber when dueling similarly-armed Jedi. You never see him use it otherwise.

The PT Vader exhibits little of those characteristics. He's far more emotional, doesn't act like he's in control of anything, and has trouble articulating or even thinking for himself. He's petulant, not very charismatic, and has no discernable sense of humor. He uses his lightsaber to kill anything, mostly unarmed types, including small children.

So other than his armor and mask being the same at the end of the PT, they seem like completely different characters to me.


He blew up entire Planets! I'm sure there was children on them.

Did Vader issue that order? No. Was it his idea? No. Did he pull the levers that activated the Death Star's superweapon? Again, no. So to say that "Vader blew up planets" is sort of like singling out a crewmember that worked on board a bomber that dropped an A-bomb on a city and saying "that guy destroyed entire cities" even though said crewmember didn't issue the order, come up with the idea, or press the "drop" button. Guilt by association is not the same as "he did it."

In the PT, however, it is made quite clear that Vader personally murdered scores of young children with his hand weapon on more than one occasion. Not to mention choking his pregnant wife. All mostly done in blind anger.


The discussion is whether Vader would harm his children "when they were children" and my answer is still NO. He would love them as much as he loved Padme. Even more so.

I'll agree that he'd love them to death, I'm sure.


He was just as much capable (or uncapable) of doing that in the OT as you say he was in the PT. He definitely showed capabilities to kill his GROWN children way more than he ever did as babies.

He never did kill them though, did he? Despite them being his sworn enemies, he repeatedly avoided it. How is that proof of what you claim?


He loved Padme and his unborn child. He turned to the Dark Side to save them.

Other than the small matter of his losing control, attacking her unprovoked, and thus bringing about her death.


And yes, you can use a Force Choke to try to get someone to shut up. Luke also used a Force Choke on the Gamorrean Guard at Jabba Palace. It wasn't lethal either. He just wanted the guard out of the way. It wasn't like he was a threat to Luke or anything. If Luke wanted to kill him, he would have. Same with Anakin. Padme was a sweet, loving person, who in NO WAY DESERVED THAT. As I said earlier, I am IN NO

 

If he had found one or both of the children i'd bet anything he wouldnt kill them. In case you didnt see the "Noooooooo" scene in ROTS he seemed pretty mad that his WIFE AND UNBORN CHILDREN died. I dont think he wouldve killed them. (Besides, under that 4 inch thick helmet and 3rd degree burns theres a good guy...)