Would Yoda have defeated Dooku???

Ive always wondered if Dooku had not tipped that column over that Yoda would have defeated him. Did Dooku do it because he realized that Yoda could easily defeat him???

 

Yeah, Yoda was schooling Dooku. If the fight had gone on much longer, Yoda would have beaten him.

 

I definitely think Yoda would've taken him. He's stronger and faster for starters.

 

I wouldn't think so. They seemed very much at a draw when they stopped dueling.

As for Yoda being stronger, I'd have to say that's patently false, though. Seeing is how humans are larger animals, and have more muscle mass, I don't think it would be possible for Yoda to actually be stronger than him.

Faster? Perhaps, although arguably irrelevant. It wasn't as if Dooku's reaction time was failing to keep pace.

 

Yes, I think so. Dooku got scared and started fighting dirty.

 

As for Yoda being stronger, I'd have to say that's patently false, though. Seeing is how humans are larger animals, and have more muscle mass, I don't think it would be possible for Yoda to actually be stronger than him.

Seeing that both Jedi and Sith derive their strength from the force and not their muscles, the body size is irrelevant and Yoda really stronger. There's one aspect in every lightsaber fight that shows who's really more powerful - the saberlock. Dooku wins 2 against Obi as clearly as he loses 3 against Yoda. After rewatching the duel few times i noticed that Yoda isn't even really trying to overpower Dooku with his forceabiloties - he does nothing else than react:
blocking the pipe flying towards him, reflecting lightning 1st, absorbing it the 2nd time and pulling out his sabre only after the Count does it first. If the green goblin wasn't forced to be such a goodygoody guy and had - for example - his own force lightning, Sidious could've started to look for another apprentice once again.

 

As for Yoda being stronger, I'd have to say that's patently false, though. Seeing is how humans are larger animals, and have more muscle mass, I don't think it would be possible for Yoda to actually be stronger than him.

Yoda shoves aside Dooku's saberlock while Obi-Wan easily loses two of them. At the very least he's a lot stronger than Obi-Wan.

Size matters not, remember

 

Yes Yoda would have defeated Dooku. That's why Dooky did what he. Because he knew that Yoda was kicking his butt.

 

I don't know about schooling Dooku, but I definitely think that Yoda would have eventually won, and Dooku knew it.

 

"Yeah, Yoda was schooling Dooku. If the fight had gone on much longer, Yoda would have beaten him."

I'm with Bib on that one. Yoda had him on the ropes.

"Yoda. After rewatching the duel few times i noticed that Yoda isn't even really trying to overpower Dooku with his forceabiloties - he does nothing else than react:
blocking the pipe flying towards him, reflecting lightning 1st, absorbing it the 2nd time and pulling out his sabre only after the Count does it first. If the green goblin wasn't forced to be such a goodygoody guy and had - for example - his own force lightning, Sidious could've started to look for another apprentice once again."

You think that's what Yoda meant when he told Luke the Force is for defense, never attack?

Yoda could obvioulsy direct the lightening when he defelected it, but instead of throwing it back at Dooku he splashed it off the ceiling. Same with the machinery and ceiling bits Dooku hurled at him. I personally think Dooku wet his pants when Yoda absorbed the second lightening blast. That's the point where Dooku whipped out his saber. If you watch the fight, other than the saber locks which is a great point, Yoda is all over the place yet rarely goes on the offensive. He's all about a defensive fight. I do think Dooku would've lost but it was obvious he was more interested in escaping to further assist Palpatine than he was in fighting Yoda. And he was scared

 

If Dooku hadn't threatened Obi-Wan and Anakin, he would have.

 

Yes, Yoda is much stronger than Dooku, even though they are both masters.

 

I think so. But Dooku started realizing he was gonna get smoked and what was more important to him than beating his former master was to get those Death Star plans to Sidious and let him know about the war.

 

I don't understand where many of you are ven coming from.

For instance, ObiTwice, Jedi and Sith do derive strength from the Force but not in that literal of a sense. Lightsaber dueling is very much a phyiscal exercise that stresses the duelists actual body, not just requires lots of skill with the Force. In fact, Dooku makes the distinction himself between dueling with lightsabers and "knowledge of the Force" ("I see this contest cannot be decided by our knowledge of the Force, but by our skills with a lightsaber" or something to that effect). While it requires Force-sensitivity to wield a lightsaber, the sense is given that it's more of a "basic minimum" kind of thing than other skills, where your ability to tap into the Force correlates more directly with your ability to effectively use said power.

My point being that clearly, people have looked winded after being in lightsaber fights. Age and physical fitness do play a real role in dueling. Thus, the fact that Yoda is of a smaller-framed species with less musculature possible (and indeed, actually there) is, in fact, significant.

Along the same lines DamonD, winning a saberlock doesn't neccesarily indicate anything. Also remember that Yoda one by pushing on what was essentially the tip of Dooku's saber. A lot easier to defeat than when the sabers are both locked more towards the base, since Dooku wasn't able to use his body as very effective leverage.

And [b}ObiwanJohn[/b] (as well as ObiTwice again) I just plain disagree with you on the Yoda being purely defensive thing. You're clearly right when it comes to the battle of Force powers. But I would say that given Yoda swung for Dooku's head several times, you're just as clearly wrong when it comes to the saber dueling. Also keep in mind that Yoda started attacking Dooku, because prior to their engagement, Dooku was trying to get away.

 

Yoda would have taken him down, no doubts. He's the most powerful jedi ever, save for possibly Anakin Skywalker/Vader. Dooku was already worn down some by Obi-Wan's pathetic attempt and Anakin's stellar performance with two lightsabers! Besides, though Yoda is nearly 800 years old, his species is supposed to live that long. Dooku is a human in his seventies/eighties(not sure on that exact age?) I think Yoda would have overwhelmed Dooku with his furious jump, spins, strikes combinations eventually. I'm also sure Yoda could have easily picked up that solar sailer and crushed Dooku with the flick of a wrist, but that would lead to the Dark Side...

 

That's the essential problem: Jedi, as the always googygoody guys, can never truly use their full potential, and do only counterattack all those neat tricks Sith are pulling off. A shame there cannot be sort of "shadow Jedi" who could use both sides of the force to their advantage.

For SW's sake, just imagine a Darth Yoda or Lord ObiWanKenobi...Sidious could be packing his bags right away!

 

I disagree. Yoda reached his full potential. The light is stronger and defense is better than reckless offense. A Jedi is always in any circumstance greater than a Sith

 

"And [b}ObiwanJohn[/b] (as well as ObiTwice again) I just plain disagree with you on the Yoda being purely defensive thing. You're clearly right when it comes to the battle of Force powers. But I would say that given Yoda swung for Dooku's head several times, you're just as clearly wrong when it comes to the saber dueling. Also keep in mind that Yoda started attacking Dooku, because prior to their engagement, Dooku was trying to get away. "

Well I'm not sure about being clearly wrong about saber dueling, as I am practicing fencing in real life, but you do bring up some good points. Yes Yoda did try to decapitate Dooku. I did forget about that. However, from the first moment Dooku attacked, he threw the first punch, Yoda was on the defensive. The best offense is a good defense to coin a NFL phrase.

Either way, I still think Yoda can wipe the floor with Dooku.

 

It looked like Dooku was on the ropes.

 

I believe over time Yoda would of won. But that isn't the reason why Dooku bailed out. He left the way he did is because he needed to get the Death Star plans out of there and more reinforcements were coming. Dooku got there just before Padme and other clones arrived and it would of been a lot more difficult for Dooku to get out of there if he had to fight Yoda, along with Padme and the clones. And who knows who else would of shown up shortly after that.

 

"Fought well you have."

I see this a being past tense. In Yoda's mind the fight is over.

 

With Yoda how can you be sure. His native languages past tense could be completley different. For all we know he could really be saying, "Up to this point my old Padawan you have fough extrodinarily well yet I have defeated you now use the force to get yourself out of this"

 

Eventually Yoda would have worn him down, but like others have mentioned, Dooku had more to accomplish that day. If the Death Star plans were discovered or worse Dooku was captured, things would have been over for the Separatists and the Sith. The Separatists would have been without a leader and the Sith wouldn't have been able to play both sides of the war. Plus, the plans to the ultimate weapon would have been in the hands of the "good guys". It raises the question: Did Yoda make the right decision by saving Anakin and Obi-Wan ?

Anyways, that's why Dooku resorted to a cowardly act. He had to get out of there with his neck and the plans. I'm sure he realized he was no match for Yoda. But who is right?

 

My point being that clearly, people have looked winded after being in lightsaber fights.

That's where you've started to go wrong. After using the Force people get tired. See Yoda on Dagobah after lifting the X-Wing. He was not using his physical strength. So if we take the fact that someone gets winded as evidence that lightsaber fights require more physical strength than Force attunement, then it is clearly contradicted by the fact that using the Force also tends to exhaust you. You're almost saying that just because being winded is a sign of dependence on physical energy, then every time you're winded it means you've been using physical (muscle) strength, but that is clearly not the case with Force users.

In addition, all canon quotes relating to a Jedi's strength indicates that it comes directly from the Force. This one cannot be contradicted. It clearly says "strength".

Darth Vader's biomechanical suit probably possessed more physical strength than Luke's body, yet he was defeated.

Real dueling concepts cannot be blindly applied to lightsaber duels because there is a completely different component, the Force, that has no real world counterpart.

 

"In addition, all canon quotes relating to a Jedi's strength indicates that it comes directly from the Force. This one cannot be contradicted. It clearly says "strength". "

But which definition of strength? Physical? Mental? Strength of character? What context is it used in?

The Jedi derives strength from the Force no doubt. However, in a fight they are still moving thier limbs. This requirs calories. In order for calories to burn oxygen is needed. That's why the were breathing hard. Same as you and me when we work out.

Yoda was breathing hard on Dagobah because concentration also requires calories and oxygen. It's a normal reaction/function of physiology.