Your all thats left of that dead religion

Hey all,

In ANH there is an emperial officer who refers to Vader as "this Sith Lord". I always felt that this inferred that there were other Sith Lords around, and that the idea of one master and apprentice wasn't in mind until th PT. I know tarkin mentions Vader being the last of that religion, but i had always felt he meant the Sith, rather than Vader himself. Does anynone else remember feeling this before they watched the PT?

Thad

 

Grand Moff Tarkin made the statement, and he meant the Force in general, not Jedi or Sith, because it was made in reference to Vader feeling a disturbance in the Force. ("the presence of my old master")

 

Grand Moff Tarkin never called Vader a Sith Lord in the film.
By saying he is all that is left of the Force-users, he is saying that Vader is the only one, the only Jedi left.

-Seldon

 

This statement shows that only Vader and a select few knew that Palpatine was a Sith Lord. Tarkin was not in that select few, though.

 

They were two different comments people..The moff that referred to Vader as sith lord was the one who got force choked by Vader. The comment about "all that's left of that ancient religion" was Tarkin talking to Vader in a seperate scene, when the Falcon was already on the Death Star. This was after the stormtrooper tells Vader it was the same ship that blasted out of Mos Eisley, etc..Vader gets all wierd and says "I feel a presence I haven't felt since.." and turns away. He then goes to tell Tarkin "HE is here"..Tarkin says "Obi-Wan Kenobi? Surely he must be dead by now. My friend, you are all that's left of that ancient religion".

 

I disagree.
Ancient Religion probably refers to the Jedi Order...which Palpatine was never part of.
So Tarkin saying that Vader is all that is left, is still a valid comment.
He may know about Palpatine and he may not.
Considering that Mas Amedda knows, it seems logical to conclude that Tarkin probably knows as well.

-Seldon

 

Everyone of any rank that was an imperial officer knew Vader worked under the Emperor, and feared him more than Vader. Tarkin of course knows this. So does the Imperial who's in charge of the construction of the 2nd Death Star: "The Emperor coming here?!? we shall double our efforts!"

 

If you want to drag PT into this, that's a young Grand Moff Tarkin on the bridge of the Star Destroyer overseeing the construction of the Death Star that Vader and Palpatine walk towards at the end of ROTS. Again, reference to "that ancient religion" is the Force. Jedi and Sith both believe in the Force, but differ on how they use it.

 

I still feel that in ANH it was inferred that there was more than one sith left. I know it was two differnt quotes, that was the point, the quote that referred to "this sith lord" made me feel like the officer had had experience of other sith lords, when its said that vader is all thats left, i just felt he meant that the sith were all that was left of force users. The reason for this is that i felt that Tarkin was referring to the fact that vader was the only existing Jedi, because it had already been set up in the film that he was once a Jedi student, any thoughts?


Thad

 

Where does anyone use the phrase "this Sith Lord" in the movies?

I take it that's from the novel?

 

Anyone who's heard of the Sith knows the rule of two. Tarkin knows Vader is Sith, and obviously knows who the Master is, seeing them both and knowing that Vader reports to the Emperor. Also Jedi were good, Sith evil. There's no mistaking which side Vader's on!

 

In the novilization of Star Wars, written in 1977 by George Lucas (with a ghost writer)there are indeed many Sith Lords. The idea of Vader and the Sith changed over time and the rule of two was indeed invented during the prequels.

 

The rule of two came about during the OT. EU took care of the "many sith lords" theory by saying they grew so hungry for power, they destroyed themselves; to save their group they came up with the rule of 2. By ROTJ, we knew there were only two: that was Vader and the Emperor's point in trying to turn Luke. Vader could use him to destroy the Emperor, and Palpatine could replace Vader with Luke. And my point about knowing about Vader and Palps being sith was that Tarkin knew Vader was sith, and answered only to Palpatine. 1+1+2 sith in this case. I forgot about the sith reference in the original novel..I read that a long time ago, pardon the pun.

 

"..all that's left of that ancient religion"

in light of rots, I'd be almost certian that vader doesn't consider himself a 'former' jedi, after all in his mind they some how betrayed him, some time before or after he slaughtered all those children, so he might see himself as the last real jedi, and all those other guys were just posers..
..of course he must have matured a bit since the PT, since he doesn't seem nearly as dumb in the OT, so perhapps he realizes he was duped, and those doesn't consider himself a jedi at all, realizing that he betrayed them, not the other way around,
who knows? I certianly don't, of course I don't care either

 

The point i'm making is that when ANH was made Lucas believed that there were more Sith, and that perhaps we would get to see them.


Thad

 

perhaps, ...if he had mentioned the word sith somewhere other than the movie poster

 

Tarkin was a fool. He had no idea that Yoda or Obi-Wan were still alive.
He was also so sure of himself that he even turned down an escape shuttle.

 

I love people who come on these boards who clearly know nothing about the subject they are writing about..

It was NEVER said in ANH 'This Sith Lord'. Where are you getting that from? Admiral Motti says to Vader 'Your sad devotion to that Ancient religion'. He NEVER calls Vader a Sith Lord. Check your facts before starting threads.

And to clarify:
The ANH Script refers to Vader when he enters the film like this:
'The awesome seven foot tall Dark Lord of the Sith makes his way into the blinding light of the main passageway This is Darth Vader, right hand of the Emperor'. Tarkin may NOT have known Palpatine was a Sith Lord. No-one else does, why should he?