ST The Romantic Future of Kylo Ren and Rey

Hello Klara and welcome! I've enjoyed your posts very much. I fully agree with what you're saying here though I did not quote your full post because of the length.

To me there is no question that Kylo Ren can be redeemed, and it can be done well at that. I also agree with you and others that the story itself as far as TFA seems to be pointing in that direction.

Leia's faith, Kylo's obvious conflict and horror at what he has done, and Han's hand on the face of his son are the strongest hints imo. That and the fact that in the junior novelization it is apparently spelled out that Han forgave his son just before dying. I think it would be weird to tell little kids that believing in people and forgiving them makes no never mind because once you do something evil you're done for. I feel like there's too much pointing to Ren's redemption for it to be any other way. (This is based on speculation/wishful thinking on my part, I'll admit that.)

Now the REAL question: how will they go about this redemption, and what happens after he is redeemed? That's what I'm worried about. I'd love to hear your take on this.

As for me, I'd love to see Ren team up with Rey to take down Snoke. And I believe that self-imposed exile and Grey Jedi-dom-ish with Rey by his side is the best possible outcome, but idk how likely that is.

Lol that IS freaky because I'm NOT watching Cast Away right now. XD
And I cried when he lost Wilson.


Penny Crayon
The song that immediately makes me think of budding/early stages Reylo, especially if Kylo Ren thinks that she might be into Finn:
Genghis Khan - Miike Snow

 

Wait, didn't we just hit 900 this morning? This thread is moving so fast. You have to try your best to keep up, or you'll get swept under the current. Still, this is brositively the most fun thread on this site.

 

Wilson is BB8's Granddaddy

 

Disclaimer: all images used in this post are LEGAL whether they are gifs from Blue Ray trailer or fan art, which substitute for lack of particular legal image.


When the Dark and the Light Switch Places



Dark Lord Kylo Ren looks seduced by Rey of Light while she appears full of anger that leads to the Dark Side

Arguably the most iconic moment in TFA is when Rey calls Kylo Ren's legacy lightsaber. On the surface, the moment appears to be a triumph of Light (Rey catches the lightaber or lightsaber chooses her for she is worthy) over Darkness (Kylo misses the lightsaber or lightsaber rejects him for he is unworthy). But like all interaction between these fascinating characters, there's an inversion and twist on classic roles. Here, I'd like to present a different perspective on the defining moment for Rey and Kylo - who was really Dark and who was really Light in the iconic fight that followed this scene?



When Rey catches the saber, that Kylo is desperately trying to call, he has every reason to be angry. And anger would be completely in his character. After all, Rey catching HIS lightsaber is a blow to his ego and humiliation to his pride. And we've seen just moments before when he's fought Finn, that jealousy turns him into a sadistic, vicious fighter. Yet none of this happens following the scene above. Instead, Kylo's reaction is this:

The Face of Light (please do not embed this image):

https://40.media.tumblr.com/2e7422c643a8adb0197a675d49885bf1/tumblr_o1y4d1nkxt1v5hh1vo1_500.jpg

There's nothing negative, angry, hateful, fearful, jealous in his facial expression. It's sheer awe, almost happiness, some sort of a stupid nerd-crushing-on-prom-queen boyish grin forming at the corner of his mouth, love at first sight. You can use any of these positive descriptions for what I simply call the Face of Light. Because it's Light on his face and in his eyes. All those jumbled feelings are Light. None of them Dark.

The fight that follows starts with Rey taking charge while Kylo's moves are all defensive, without any desire to hurt her. Then the ground opens ahead of them and they find themselves at the edge of a precipice, with Kylo having clear tactical advantage. However, instead of exploiting Rey's weaker position, Kylo opens up to her disclosing his most intimate desire to be with her, though words "You need a teacher. I can show you the ways of the Force." The Force. Not the Dark Side. The world is crumbling around them and instead of looking to get himself out, Kylo, who's also severely wounded and bleeding, stays with Rey,offering to show her the Force which is a betrayal of Darkness and his master Snoke, neither of which is mentioned. Hearing the word Force, Rey closes her eyes in concentration. This is a moment of complete vulnerability on her part - she's standing with her back to the ravine, her eyes are closed, and she is at the mercy of a man whom she has seen killing his own father and than wounding or killing Finn. Some 30 years earlier, another man closed his eyes to draw onto the Force, Obi Wan Kenobi, and his Dark Side opponent, Darth Vader, used the opportunity to strike him. But Kylo doesn't do any of that. He's looking at her, at the light playing on her face, and he calms. This is one of rare moments when Kylo is calm and it's, again, when he is with Rey. Calmness is associated with the Light Side of the Force. But when Rey opens her eyes, we get:

The Face of Darkness (please do not embed this image)

http://41.media.tumblr.com/2eae37fdc4b59185c8379bb41cc62227/tumblr_inline_o36f2i2KU41qjtxsg_500.jpg

You can see the contrast between Kylo's calm face and Rey's forming angry/hateful snarl here (again, please no embeding):

https://38.media.tumblr.com/90e979de34b4fbe0535c5dc2cb76e921/tumblr_inline_o2kahpvszn1sdb40u_500.gif

She looks animalistic or just like Kylo when he fought Finn. Anger, hate, sadism, intent to hurt. The Face of Darkness. All of this becomes evident in the way she fights from that moment forward. Stabbing moves, kicking the opponent in the stomach (Kylo punched Finn in the face). Kylo is visibly weaker but that seems to rile her up to become even more vicious. She circles around him when he is down, like a predator around the prey, also exactly what Kylo did in the previous fight.

The Face of Darkness - anger, hate, sadism




Since Kylo won't stay down, even though he can barely stand on his feat, Rey extinguishes his lightsaber



leaving him defenseless and then



slashes his face, with a very characteristic Kylo spin, leaving him with a big scar


Actual scar in the movie is even bigger, running from his collar bone across his jaw and cheek to his forehead




What happened here? Some may celebrate the moment as "You go, girl!" but this is essentially a dark victory. Hero(ine) is not supposed to stoop to villain's level because heroes are driven by compassion and defenseless, weak opponent should draw compassion. There's no glory in defeating weak and defenseless, which is what Finn was when Kylo slashed his back, and what Kylo was when Rey slashed his face. But Kylo isn't a hero so Rey acted just like the man she hated and thought was beneath her ("You are a monster!"). She acted like a villain.

However, this is major development in Rey and Kylo's relationship. She tasted what it means to be like him and acted just like him, not better, not worse, but exactly like him. All dark feelings he poured into the fight with Finn she poured into the fight with him. He slashed Finn's back when Finn was disarmed, she slashed Kylo's face when he was disarmed. She let the Darkness in, while he let the Light in, so much so that his scarred face showed no hate or anger. And that's the path to understanding each other and bridging the gap that symbolically opened between them when Star Killer began to break.

So what the future holds for Rey and Kylo in the wake of switching Dark and Light side at least for a moment, and therefore experiencing what it is to be like on the other side? For Rey to become the ultimate hero, she has to find in her heart compassion for Kylo. That's something that distinguishes really great heroes from heroes and mere mortals - ability to sympathize with those who cannot ignite anyone's sympathy. In Star Wars Saga, those ultimate heroes are Luke and Han. Luke showed compassion for his fallen father Darth Vader, when there was no evidence of any good in him, and when disclosure of their familial relationship should have brought shame and anger to Luke. But Luke believed in Vader's good, when even Yoda and Obi Wan (who showed no compassion for slowly burning, dismembered young Anakin) didn't, and his unconditional love ignited light within Vader. Likewise, Han forgave and showed love for his fallen son, moments before dying from son's fatal stab, with a simple touch of a hand on his son's cheek. In short, sympathy for monsters, that restores monster's humanity, is the ultimate heroism and real triumph of Light over Darkness, not blowing up star bases.

Now, I want to clarify a very common mistake which is that heroes are viewed as redeemers in the sense that the redeemed don't have to do anything because redeemer does everything for them. This is not true. The role of hero-as-a-redeemer is to challenge the negative POV and stimulate the will to change. So redemption is very active process on the redeemed part that's only triggered by someone's faith in their goodness when everyone else lost faith in them. Therefore, Kylo will have to take steps that take him away from darkness in order to redeem himself, thanks to faith in him that Han had and Rey must find within herself in order to become the ultimate heroine.

 

This thread has converted me into a believer and that Rey Kenobi theory, hands down the best i've heard.

 

Switching places, you say? Well, I thought I should brobably visualize that. Here's what I came up with:

 

I watched the scene were Rey grabs the saber before Kylo Ren and the music that plays when the camera shows the look on his face is amazing. Not only does his face give away his admiration for Rey but the music even high lights the moment. It's so amazing!

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Brootifully done!

 

Thanks. I'm broud of it!

 

Brobi Wan's instant switch work. Brotastic and brotiful and brotific!

 

Okay I don't get why people act liked Obi Wan is some minor character the audience won't know? He is one of the frachises most well known and popular characters. Even before I watched Star Wars I knew who he was. You can ask any casual fan or even someone who has never watched any of the movies to name a person and most will say Obi. He is just as essential, to the past two trilogies, as any of the Skywalkers. The entire story up to Episode VII couldn't have happened without him, last time I checked.

Hmm what contributions did he make you ask that makes him so vital:

• He trained Anakin Skywalker. Without him The man who would become Vader would never have left his home planet and learned the ways of the Force;

• Speaking of Darth Vader who do you think put him in his iconic suit, that he is known for to this day.

• Obi trained Luke and started him on his path to learning the Force and convicned Yoda to teach the young protaganist when he was reluctant to do so.

In fact the whole series starts off with Princess Leia trying to find Obi Wan. Those things, alone, make him crucial to the story both past and present. The only way any one would have no clue who Kenobi is is if they, for some reason, choose not to watch any of the previous six movies. If you HAVE seen any of exsisting movies then how can you not know who he is? In fact without a Kenobi present you could argue the new trilogy is missing a vital part of its soul?

 

Don't stop!
Brolievin'!
Hold on to that feelin'!

 

Or maybe they'll manage to really address some of these things that will go over a lot of viewers heads, but still keep the nondiscriminating viewer happy. I was talking about how some people I know missed *a lot* of things in a post over the weekend, but they were still very pleased with the movie. I think the team knows how to play with layers like that ... at least I hope!!!

 

Especially the BOLD-ITALIC-UNDERLINE sentences
Not to mention, the eyes that he looks at her at that moment, there're light in that eyes, he's in awe just like a blind man see the world in full colors and brightness for the first time, I see hope in those eyes as well as anticipation, as if he's waiting for her to able to feel the Force. I think subconsciously, he's giving her full advantage
As for Rey, it's logical for her to maybe fall for the Dark Side on a short amount of time, because technically speaking she still have a lot to learn about the Force and she may not control her emotions well but Luke could help her, he may even be the one who encourage her to save Ben. Imagine after the training section, Luke sit down and tell Rey about all the stories of Ben's childhood and how he is loved, that could impact her in some way so that, the next time Kylo and Rey meet again, she might look at him differently because there is a man Ben Solo and he's somewhere beneath this "Kylo Ren"

 

Yes, that's incredibly interesting. Where does this Jedaii symbol come from? Is it a canon source?

 

Thank you! I really hope Luke talks about Ben Solo with Rey. Oh, and bolded and underscored is so incredibly beautifully said and describes his look to a T.

 

No thank you,it was just a back up with some of my opinions to what you wrote. And yes, I too, hope Luke talks to Rey about Ben

 

The Je'daii are part of the EU....hopefully they'll bring it into canon using this trilogy..... there have been grey jedi in the Jedi Order itself but they have not been a part of a separate group till now.

 

I came to the conclusion that he wasn't because his face wasn't covered with some kind of mask unlike all the other KOR. And the context with which the vision shows him is he presumably was fighting alongside the other dead bodies. Still he could've been a former KOR who defected out of love for someone and had Rey as a child with that someone (at least that's a speculation of mine).

 

I just want to say..... I am completely in love with your avatar (cat lover here!!!)

 

I'd say that the KoR scene is from the future. because Vision Kylo appears aware of Rey and one of 2 scenes with him was Vision Kylo on SK. No other vision character reacts at Rey's presence, even Vision Clan Leader/KoR/Whatever doesn't strike with his weapon towards her (she's on the ground) but above. It's only Vision Kylo who looks at her as if he sees her and walks towards her.

Also, in the vision, after Vision Kylo kills Vision Clan Leader/KoR/Whatever, there are 6 Vision KoR behind him. KoR are called the Seven and that number includes Kylo. So no KoR is missing unless there's some significant change where Kylo is Snow White and KoR are 7 dwarves so one is missing after the stab.

 

We can't post bootleg material, but if that is actually Rey in the KOR rain scene, the "clan leader" is swinging down at her before Kylo stabs him in the back. If that is her future/past, I don't think that guy would be her father.

 

Why do I love that "Face of Darkness" so much?

 

That worked! Thank you for your help!

 

I DEFINITELY want to see Kylo hug/break down in Leia's arms! I think a lot of people do.