ST Carrie Fisher (Leia Organa) in Episode IX

Well, if you are saying that Driver is alive and Fisher is dead and putting them face to face on screen would be weird, I'd agree. Their shot reverse shot in the Raddus scene would thus remain the closest thing to a physical reunion. Although, of course, closeness-in-the-force could be enhanced between in IX them using the magic powders of cinema (2019 Carrie Fisher would probably have done a joke about 1978 Carrie Fisher at this line)

'Tell the story they originally had in mind' applies more strongly to the backstory, I think. That, like the ending of the saga, are relatively fixed; the films themselves were designed to be less rigid in comparison.

So perhaps they will tell something close to what was originally intended by taking a roundabout route through the force and/or backstory.

(For example, Im curious to know if that line in the TLJ novel written from Ben/Kylo POV, 'Han Solo days of cheating and disappointing people' came from something specific. 'Disappointing' does. Is the word he uses in TFA. In the TLJ novel hes attacking the Raddus and thinking about his teenage self and Han and Leia...and the last time he saw Han before TFA he was into legal shipping and races, so 'cheating' would not be in the smuggler sense. Also, cheating and disappointing 'people'. Is he talking about himself (disappointed) and Leia (cheated)?)

 

Here in the novelization, Han and Leia knew Ben was ****** up before sending him away to Luke's boarding school. Too bad Luke was portrayed as clueless until he started sensing the darkness while training him and invading his mind while he slept.

 

@oncafar watching it now after the event you can see a natural progression in the narrative but at the time there was absolutely nothing to suggest Leia was anything other than the last princess of Alderaan, she was a female Flash Gordon who the heroes were meant to save but she ends up saving them. She was the first female action hero, 2 years before Ellen Ripley took on an alien Leia was shooting Stormtroopers from the hip. Nothing more, nothing less.

The most ironic thing was when TESB came out everybody I knew guessed Leia was related to Luke when he communicated with her telepathically, may be it was given away when Vader communicated with Luke after Vader was revealed to be Luke's father.

Now it seems so natural, you watch ANH and take Obi-Wan stroking his beard watching Leia's hologram and it feels like it has much more depth. What's the odds if TESB novelization is rewrote, they have Obi-Wan or Yoda bridging Luke and Leia's minds? But it opens up some questions, such as why didn't Obi-Wan sense Leia's presence on DS1? They're there if you look for them just people would look for the goofs if Rey was retconned into being related to a hero from the previous trilogy.

 

i just read the plot summary for batman v superman on wikipedia: maybe leia's taken hostage by hux somehow. hux comes up with a proposition for the resistance: leias life/freedom and negotiations if the resistance, i.e. rey, eliminates kylo. what do you think?

 

I wondered about that. I just thought it might seem obvious when Yoda says there is another, and oh look Luke and Leia can communicate in the Force (kind of like how Luke and Vader can communicate in the Force)... It's good to hear many predicted it though I guess that it wasn't a done deal even then as they could have brought in Luke's sister/mother/brother/uncle/cousin/whoever from elsewhere in the third film.

Anyway part of why I commented was that when it flows so well in the end product, it makes it seem like "retcon" is a "point of view."

 

GL was looking to tie up loose ends and trim the story down as he went into the final months of production of TESB, it is believed and I tend to agree with it, that running over budget and over schedule on TESB made up GLs mind to initially end the saga with a second sequel (ROTJ) instead of continuing on. It's been speculated that whilst when GL thought up the telepathy scene he hadn't yet made Leia Luke's twin but in the final days of shooting seeing the footage of the scene gave him the idea, so the retcon may have originated earlier than people actually know. One thing that makes this possible is in his prescript notes and scribbles, GL reveals Leia to be Luke's sister, that was documented in Rinzler's The Making of Return of the Jedi.

 

In the Rinzler book there is no documentation to when Leia is decided to be Luke’s sister, it just appears in like the third or fourth draft, I believe.
Funny in the olden days the memory of the movies was more reinforced for me by the comic book adaptations or the storybooks. And the Leia hearing Luke never carried the same weight as it did in the actual film, so it was never really reinforced to me. Same with “I love you”/ “i know.”
And besides our cherished action figures, the story was continued in those three years through the Marvel comics. I’ll search to see if I can find it, but the best would be the comments in the back in Star Words... a few would debate who The Other would be... some said someone new, some thought Han, but quite a few said Leia. But I don’t ever remember any rumblings about Luke and her being related. It seemed more like the love triangle.
Oh fun memories!

 

Given they have unused footage of Carrie as well as full body scans for digital rendering etc (as utilized in the Mary Poppins moment), it should not be that hard to have Leia standing on a bridge of a ship or in a Resistance Base or meditating somewhere and communicating telepathically with Ben across the universe. Surely there's enough ADR of Carrie to assemble something that sounds like she's reaching out to her son ("Son, there is still light in you." and "May the Force be with you," would be easy for instance), then Driver can do the heavy lifting on the more plot crucial new dialog said to his mother in response.

I'd rather see something subtle like this or even Leia appearing mystically to Kylo in a vision, then some kind of cobbled together scene where Kylo and Leia are supposed to be physically in the same room together. That might feel forced and clunky given the obvious limitations of such a sequence.

 

Why does Rey finding her place in the world with a family have to be biological? Han, Finn, BB, and eventually Leia & then Luke (guess Poe too, seems Rey & Poe have probably got to know one another well if there's a time jump here) are the family.

That doesn't mean Han & Leia are mommy & daddy.

It doesn't mean Ben's her long-lost brother. That connection between them can just be the force-chosen-one thing, and it works.

Rey finding her place in the galaxy, letting go of what went down on Jakku (with, yes, seems pretty likely legitimately "nobody" drunkards as bio-mom-and-dad) doesn't really have anything to do with bloodline. It's even sort of more potent if she's "no one" (in the way Ben envisages things, bloodline entitlement) and she was chosen, plucked from obscurity, the light selected by the Force itself to confront the dark.

Being Rey-adopted-out-or-kidnapped-by-Unkar-and-his-peeps-Solo doesn't add anything to that. All she needs is Han & Leia as guides, mentors, parental FIGURES. Luke too, even if it's more confrontational at first.

 

@Scruffy nerf if memory serves, it was only a picture of notes, no more than scribbles really and dated 80 or 81.

 

See I originally thought they’d deal with leia’s absence like this. Minimal dialogue with him and tucked away while the rest of the action happens except for a key small scene near the end of the movie. Plus i would’ve loved a recording of “I recognized your foul stench” to be played when leia “meets” hux.

 

Oh yeah, you’re right... it’s like on one of the scribbled note tablets with SISTER underlined or circled. But I know it’s after the first draft of Jedi. I think for me it was more of being surprised there was no documentation in the interviews about the date and decision about making her the other, Also no mention of why Leia was moved to the Jabba plot with the rest of the group... she was on the Endor mission from the getgo for a few drafts.

Anyway to keep on topic, Todd’s comments have me excited.

 

I agree with you that the relationship does not need to be biological, and could actually be more powerful if it isn't. The only problem I have with the current set up, though, is that she really doesn't have a particularly close bond with anyone other than Finn (and Ben, of course, although I think that fell apart by the end of TLJ.) She barely had any time with Leia, and while it's nice that they hugged, it didn't really feel earned. The Leia/Poe relationship has more weight than the Leia/Rey relationship. Leia hasn't been a mentor or mother-figure to Rey. And I don't even really mind that, but if the intention is to show that Rey finds a surrogate family through these people she meets throughout her adventure, then the films should have spent more time showing her forming bonds with them.

Anyway, I just remembered that this is the Leia thread. So, on that topic, I'm starting to get a bit worried that I might find her distracting in Episode 9, constantly thinking about how she was artificially inserted into the story. It's one of the reasons I wonder if I might have preferred a re-cast. Sure, it would be distracting to have a new actress playing the role, but at least I wouldn't always be thinking, "Oh, that must be something they filmed for TFA. And I guess that's an outtake from TLJ. Hmm, I wonder if they CGI'd her hair in this scene, since it doesn't look like TFA or TLJ. And I wonder what she was originally reacting to when she said that line," etc, etc. I'm very curious to see how they pull this off. I think this will be a case of "less is more." Put her in when it can be done seamlessly, but don't rely on her too much.

 

Good point in your first paragraph. But I would have never wanted a recast; I think they will do it seamlessly. Otherwise I don't think they'd be doing it. I'll just be really enjoying having her in the film and so focused on the story that I really don't think I will be thinking about where each piece of footage came from until later on or on the next viewing, etc.

 

Well said. TFA sets up the its climax as Rey finding her "family" in Luke, her new Jedi mentor and presumably a father figure in her life. Her parents are gone, Han is dead, now it's Luke's turn to be Rey's "family." That didn't translate in TLJ, and Rey and Luke spent the most time together. With Carrie gone now it's not really possible to show Leia and Rey having a mother-daughter or mentor-learner kind of relationship. So it still feels like Rey has no one. That's fine for a hero or heroine to have no one, but TFA set up her character as someone who's seeking that family connection, so there has to be resolution. I guess she has Chewie. But it would help 9 if Rey and Finn spend significant time together to show a real bond etc. That'll make us care more and it'll make the TFA set up have a more tangible pay off.

 

I'd suggest Rey might find that family with the new characters. Finn, Poe, Rose.
Or she becomes the mother figure for New Jedi Padawans.
Her family doesn't have to center on old characters.

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I know they said they aren't going to do a Tarkin on dear Leia, but in a way they are.

This unused footage is a selling point of the movie. People will go in wondering how it will look and whether it is convincing. It's an editing special effect.

But that's okay.

 

They hugged because Leia just lost her husband, who Rey had gotten pretty close with over the last 48 hours or whatever. ie. Pretty much more time than Luke ever spent with Kenobi. What needs to be "earned" about that hug? Rey knows Leia by reputation, they've all just endured huge losses and simultaneously dealt a giant blow to the space-Nazis, and Rey's setting off on a journey to shake Leia's grumpy brother out of his funk.

Seems the...socially appropriate thing to do.

Keep in mind there's also apparently much more of a time jump here, it's not going to pick up right after TLJ the way TLJ did with TFA. Nothing to say Rey hasn't got to know Poe & Rose etc over this six months/a year/a couple of years, whatever they decide to go with.

We've already got some nice poignant moments between Rey & Leia, more than enough to buy into the notion of Rey being welcomed into the non-nuclear family. Han took her under her wing, she witnessed Han get killed, she's had some pretty major life experienced of her own with Ben, alongside Leia & Luke she's probably the major figure in Ben's life now. The connections are already there, you don't need to get into some convoluted "the drunkie randoms who gave her up for their next fix weren't REALLY really-for-really-reals her parents, Han & Leia gave her up at birth for _____ reasons" or "some criminals or ____ group took her from them as a baby, and Leia's recognized her the whole time through the force but hasn't said anything!" bio-family thing here. You gain nothing, and it makes a mess of relationships that are close already. Just with different dynamics/specifics than Luke/Leia/Anakin.

Which is fine.

 

The leia/Rey hug was one of my favorite quiet scenes in TFA.

I don’t see why they couldn’t repurpose the maz/leia lightsaber scene and add rey to it to give them another scene together

 

Maz' whole purpose now seems minimal, reusing that scene would make Maz' return seem forced.

 

Eh. Not necessarily. Isn’t she a pirate? She seems prime to return with lando

 

She could totally have put together some sort of pirate/scoundrel army with Lando to help the Rebellistance.

 

They could play up the pirate/rogues willing to fight the FO angle with Maz, and she could rally some aid for the Resistance that way... Or they could also play up the Force angle with her. She's clearly tuned into it. She was the first character that awakened Rey's eyes and heart to the Force, and now with Luke out of the picture (I know, I know, force ghost), Maz could have another heart-to-heart scene with Rey about the Force, destiny, life, etc. She's like a quirky, benevolent grandmother, which is why her joke about Chewie being her boyfriend was so funny. Then they went and ruined it with the master codebreaker joke in TLJ which now makes her seem just like a randy old lady who likes lots and lots of people.

 

Maz also Worships Typhojem( Force Cthulhu) so maybe she goes full evil

 

I wonder when/if we're going to get news/leaks on Leia's role in IX. It might end up being the best guarded part of the film when all is said and done, which I wouldn't really complain about. Still though, I'm extremely curious.

 

I think one of the last scenes in the movie we see is her peacefully dying.