"Children of Dune" Mini-series.

Hey Liz, I would summarize it, but as someone who hasn't read all the way through the second book yet, I'm not sure I'd be much of help.

Anyone who's read the series care to sum up for her?








You have my stapler.

 

Liz,
" please, someone sum it up, tell me what they did, what they changed, what they skipped over. Huge fan of the original series, killing myself over how they would combine DM and COD."

Have no fear... They did an absolutely wonderful job of telling the DM story in the first part.

The DVD (/Video?) is apparently coming out in May, so you should be able to see it then.

 

Man, it just keeps getting better and better. I don't even know where to begin. Again, great performances from everyone. Leto II and Ghanima were portrayed really well, and while I'm still a little disappointed by Saskia Reeves not coming back, I really can't complain about Alice Krige as Jessica anymore.

Daniela Amavia once again turns in an excellent performance as one of the most emotionally complex characters in the Dune-iverse.

Visuals are top-notch yet again. The scene where Leto almost lets the worm eat their 'thopter was stunning visually and pretty damned funny.

(Oh, and now I see that there's an actor even luckier than Edward Atterton. )

Can't wait for the conclusion tomorrow night. I'm really looking forward to the fight between Leto and Alia and the sandtrout skin!




Self-Appointed God Emperor of the JCC

 

Chani died! She was so hot!

Paul died! He was only slightly less hot than Chani!

The new Duncan is less hot than the the old one!

The new Jessica is less hot than the old one!

But holy crap Alia is smokin'!

 

Was I the only one upset about Jessica no longer having the blue eyes of spice addiction or am I just too picky? I don't know why, but that really bugged me.

 

Ahhhh... Alia. xPi^6.

And Ghanima is equally hot.

Man, I'd love to be the meat in an Atreides woman sandwich.

Even the men are quite attractive.

Houses Harkonnen and Corrino don't have anyone to match, save for Irulan.



EDIT: Yeah, that kind of bugged me too, but I guess I can look past it.

*shrugs*





Self-Appointed God Emperor of the JCC

 

I got over it too, but then I started thinking... why doesn't Irulan have the blue eyes too and Duncan now that he has been around for sixteen someodd years, you know?

 

So was that stone burner thing supposed to be a nuke?

 

Yes, a "stone burner" is a type of nuclear weapon.

 

Real world reason: Budget concerns. Those aren't contacts. The blue eyes are a CG effect. (still irks me though).

IC, rationalized reason: Now that Arrakis has changed so drastically, there's not as much spice in the air, and by consequence, the food as well. Alia and the twins were pre-born, so of course they have the blue eyes. We all know why Paul and Stilgar have them. But Irulan more than likely didn't really eat a Fremen diet, nor did she have much reason to take the spice. She's cut off from the Bene Gesserit and doesn't have a desire to see the future. Duncan is without the blue for pretty much the same reasons.

*shrugs*

Still, it'd be nice to see more of the fremen have blue eyes. Only the really important ones seem to have them. Although, I can kind of understand if they were under tight restraints as far as money is concerned.




Self-Appointed God Emperor of the JCC

 

Oh I know about budgets...

 

Did anyone else feel that there was a lot of sexual tension between Paul and his sister and Leto and his sister?

~PAd

 

Meh, I can kind of understand how it might seem that way...

The look on Alia's face when she said "Is that why you invaded my privacy? To disapprove of my recklessness?" almost made it seem like she was daring him to do something.

But then again, it could just as easily be interpreted as it was meant to: a look of childish defiance. I think the look she gave Duncan was more umm... predatory

As for Leto and Ghanima, in most people's eyes, it would seem like they acted more like lovers than siblings. I couldn't help thinking that myself. But if you kind of squint with your mind's eye, you really just see a brother and sister who are just more affectionate towards each other than most. And that in no way means there's any kind of sexual tension there. Then you look in the context of the story, and it's really very understandable why they're so close. They're twins, they're both pre-born, and they both have the burden of being born into the universe's most powerful (and screwed up) family. They're love for each other keeps them sane.






Self-Appointed God Emperor of the JCC

 

As for Leto and Ghanima, in most people's eyes, it would seem like they acted more like lovers than siblings.

I think it's because they're so wise. In the books, they repeatedly say that they aren't children. And they aren't. The huge amount of lives they have in their heads means that the brother-sister bond is a bit insignificant compared to all of that.


Did I just make sense?

 

Liz, having recently read the books to refresh my memory prior to the mini-series, I have to honestly say they rather butchered Dune Messiah. Unlike the others here, I was not impressed with their adaptation of DM. I thought the performances were rather flat a times. The movie seriously rushed through DM and felt rather fractured. I think it would have played better as a three TV adaptation (2:30 w/o commercials?)

First off, instead of keeping Irulan as part of the conspirators in DM (Scytale, Edric, RM Mohiam), they inserted Wensicia instead. I felt that this hurt the story in two ways: that it takes away Irulan's rejection of the Bene Gesserit at the end of DM and her transformation into protectress of the twins in CoD, and second that it takes away from Paul's insistence at the end of DM that he left orders that she not be killed, no matter what happens, as all the other conspirators are killed. They left in the scene where Irulan and RM Mohiam speak to each other with their finger talking, so that bit isn't kind of out of place with Irulan not part of the conspiracy.

They juxtaposed Paul and Chani's lines in a few places. For instance, Chani tells Irulan that she will be wife in name only, no children. It is Paul who tells this to Irulan in the book, with Chani actually bringing up the issue of Paul fathering children with Irulan because she wasn't able to conceive. Again, I think this hurt the ending where Paul tells Irulan that he'd been cruel to her. The movie doesn't show Paul being cruel to her, so that remark kind of comes out of nowhere without anything shown in the movie to reinforce it.

There were some rather interesting dialogue omissions too (which is why I think it should have been a longer movie, or they should have dumped a few CGI scenes that added nothing to the plot). The scene where Paul is first introduced to Hayt, the Duncan ghola, is cut short. Paul accepts the gift from Edric, and that's pretty much the scene. They don't show the conversation between Paul and Hayt/Duncan where Paul asks the mentat why he was given as a gift and Hayt reveals that he was given to destroy Paul. I thought that took away from Paul knowing that there existed danger, but had greater faith in a former Atreides man doing what is right in the end.

Stilgar going beserk after seeing Alia fight in the nude (she fights clothes in the movie and drops her robe after the fight), saying that she needed a man/husband was left out. Everyone calls Stilgar, Stil, no seems to use his full name, but they did in the books. Chani always seem to call Paul, Muad'dib, instead of varying her names among Paul and Usul. As others mentioned, they didn't color the eyes as much as they should, and Duncan's eyes look just like any other eyes, the didn't do anything to make them look like Tleilaxu eyes. Plus I found the slow motion music video climax over the top.

Now, on the other hand, I was far more pleased and impressed with the adaptation of the first half of Children of Dune the book (part 2 of the mini-series). They've taken liberties with the story here too, but this time it flows much better from scene to scene. The twins are older, which I can live with, as having 9-year-olds is stretching things a bit. Some of the scenes from Sietch Tabr have been moved to the palace at Arrakeen, and I don't think it really hurt the story. There was a gratuitous sex scene between Alia and Javid that Duncan stumbles in on -- of course in the books Duncan only hears rumors that Alia is taking lovers. (I suspect this was put in there solely for the male audience.) Some lines were juxtaposed between characters again -- Irulan is concerned that the gifts of clothing and stillsuits from Farad'n might be sabotage, but Alia is unconcerned and mad at Irulan for thinking so and potentially causing a diplomatic problem.

The biggest change so far seems to be Leto and Ghanima and the fight with the laza tigers. This is where the movie ended last night in a cliffhanger. It appears as if Ghanima will actually believe her brother is killed by

 

I acutally wasnt that crazy about Part 2. It was good but was a little too slow moving for my tastes. I liked all of the scenes with the twins, though. Im curious to see how Part 3 turns out tonight.


I also dont know what to make of the actress playing Alia. At some points her acting is very good, especially when her possession by the Baron is at its worst, but the majority of the time she's pretty bad, coming across as very stiff, very wooden as she reads her lines. I know she's Imperial Regent, but come on now.

 

I have to agree about all the changes, some were necessary, and others weren't so much and took away from the story.

I've come to the conlcusion that a satisfactory version of the Dune novels won't ever be made, but that doesn't take away from the fact that I loved this mini (so far...).

I think that the film is great, as was the first, but are better if you haven't read the books. To make a little more sense: it's better to take the books and the movie in a seperate light, to accept the movie on it's own without reference to the books in order to enjoy it. By seperating the connection between the books and the movies in my head, I enjoyed the mini a whole lot more.

Hope that made sense...





You have my stapler.

 

Jades Fire, thank you so much!

//cookiees

//mangos

//eternal love

 

Is it just me or was that scene between Alia and her Priest Boy-Toy rated R? My husband and I kept looking at each other while she was screaming her head off...

 

Yes, it was a little risqué. So was the scene where they took away the Fremen traitor in part 1.

And now I have to envy Edward and the actor who played Alia's lover.







Self-Appointed God Emperor of the JCC

 

Jades Fire, thanks for sharing your well-thought views. I personally think you are being a bit nitpicky about details, but at least you admit that both parts so far have had their IMO roughly equal share of inaccuracies. You just seem to have liked the adaption choices that Harrison made better in part 2.

I don't have the benefit of having read DM and COD as recently as you have, which makes me a bit foggy on some details. That may have in some ways helped my enjoyment of the series so far. But my overall philosophy when it comes to an adaptation is wether the gist or heart of the story comes across. And for me, the adaptation of DM in part 1 really flowed well. All the major parts of the plot were covered adequatly, with "real" enough performances by the principals involved to create an emotional attachement. So maybe everything didn't transpire as written in the book, but it just felt like F.H.'s Dune Messiah to me. And that is a great achievement for only 1hr and 30mins of screentime.

In a way it is similar to the LOTR films - PJ and the writers play loose with many details, but what makes the movies so beloved for the vast majority is how they capture the "feel" of the books.

To me, that is more important to me than who spoke what and wether Alia should be dressed or not during her fighting excercise.

 

>>To me, that is more important to me than who spoke what and wether Alia should be dressed or not during her fighting excercise.<<

Damn, I knew there was a reason I hoped HBO would've picked it up.

Okay, okay, enough. I think everyone gets the idea that I lust after Alia.

Anyway, I agree. I haven't read the novels in a long time.(Well, I started reading DM again recently, but stupid school kept me from getting very far). I also thought the cast and crew got the feel of the book right. Still, in a perfect world, they would've made a six hour mini for all the novels. [face_fanboy]






Self-Appointed God Emperor of the JCC

 

Thanks, Darth Euro. Perhaps I am being a bit picky about details, but Liz asked for things that were changed, so I focused on that aspect and interspersed my comments.

Part of the reason why I was so disappointed with part 1 was that the story just hit the high points of DM, almost as if they were checking off the major points (like Leto jumping from dune top to dune top) and moving on. I found the flow too fast and I was never able to really get into the flow. I was looking for a bit more character development to really get into the movie.

For example, I felt the stealing of the worm scene was just a "hey look at this cool 5 minute CGI scene" that imparted almost nothing to the story. We saw Wensicia ask for a worm, then we see one in part 2, therefore, we know they got one and seeing them get it doesn't really matter. In that 5 minutes or so, they could have extended a few dialogue scenes to build-up the characters more. Since there is no narrator or place to explore interior monologue, it is when characters speak to each other that we learn more about them and their relationships to one another and the plot.

One of the changes in CoD that I actually think works better is the switch between Irulan and Alia concerning the gifts from Farad'n. It shows Irulan's devotion to the twins and shows Alia's ever growing descent into Abomination and her selfish grab for power.

I suppose that's all a matter of personal opinion in the end. Some people like the action to keep moving, others like breaks in the action for character development. I guess that when watching a movie that's been adapted from a book, I'm looking for a fair amount of characterization to come through in the movie. I know that an adapted movie will never be as good as its book.

 

I fell asleep during the last 15 minutes of last nights episode. Would someone be so kind as to tell me what I missed?


*swoons over Leto II* I loooooooove British accents...

 

I fell asleep during the last 15 minutes of last nights episode.

That's funny, so did I. However, I was recording it so I got to see it later.

~PAd