Discussion Daisy Ridley (Rey Skywalker) in Sharmeen Obaid-Chinoy’s Star Wars film

I actually think the director is a great choice. I haven't seen her work, but if she's interested in women empowerment and sexism in society, than there's nothing wrong with bringing a bit of that to SW. I mean...after all Lucas did the same thing in 76 with Leia, because she's not the princess in distress that everyone expected (from those kinds of movies) and basically took charge as soon as she's out of the cell.

And especially after an ST where Rey is forced to fall in love with the villain who's trying to murder her and ... well ... that's a story for another forum.

 

It should be about writing a good story with compelling characters. Rather than creating a story around an agenda.

 

You didn't say that though. Of course there should be good writing, but having a feminist pov or theme in the movie doesn't automatically negate that. And that's what you expressed.

 

All I said was that based on previous comments she has made about her work, I'm not all that enthused about her directing the next major installment in the Star Wars franchise. She has openly expressed enjoyment at making men feel uncomfortable. Having a feminist point of view is perfectly fine, assuming it is a well written story with compelling characters. But when you have the director of that story making statements like that, you have to wonder if this is really about empowering women or about tearing down men. And my point was that criticizing it for these things shouldn't be automatically negated either, especially when the director herself has openly expressed that this what she does.

 

When you experience male violence against you, and political oppression perpetrated against you by males, because you are a woman, and then you end up directing movies? You have every right to make chauvinist men a little uncomfortable with the movies you make. Including in big blockbusters. Her life experience in Pakistan coming through in her art takes precedence over pearl-clutching from potentially offended chauvinist men in the audience.

Not to mention that this perspective might lead to a fresher product.

 

The men in the audience for these big blockbusters are not the chauvinistic men who have oppressed her and committed violence against her. There is a time and a place for everything, and she has every right to express herself and her experiences through her art. But to do it in a Star Wars movie where this is clearly going to be her angle. If you enjoy, by all means, enjoy it. But it's also perfectly fine to be critical of that aspect, and to be weary ahead of time about how it's going to guide the story.

 

Just as George Lucas shouldn’t have been worried about offending neofascists in the audience, Chinoy shouldn’t be worried about offending male chauvinists in the audience. If Chinoy displays chauvinism in her Star Wars film, why should non-chauvinist men be offended? If they’re not chauvinists, it’s all be good. She’s won’t be criticizing them.

 

I would hope that being critical of this aspect of the movie doesn't immediately get somebody labeled as an offended chauvinist.

 

The mistake they make in movies when they are trying really hard to make a strong female character is often to make male characters idiots to prove some point. If men are idiots the audience will quickly connect that the female characters are strong.

People tend to forget that being strong is also to have moments of weakness. The strongest people IMO are ones that ascaped pain and darkness. Not ones who are shielded from it because they are immune to it.

 

I think we saw a bit “man dumb woman strong” in TLJ, in the scene when Leia slapped Poe for his actions. I think in that scene there are just ladies in background. Imagine if the sitation was reversed. Hot shot woman pilot gets slapped by her male leader for making a mistake in a scene full of men.

Hopefully nothing like that is in Rey’s movie. Plenty of ways to empower women without trashing the other sex.

 

She can do what she wants with this movie, and is obviously being given the green light to do so. But given how outspoken she is in her approach, it's also perfectly valid to offer criticism of that approach.

 

Who said you’re not allowed to offer criticism? (Though it should be noted that…the film hasn’t even been made yet). You’re simply being asked to justify and explain that criticism, and haven’t offered anything of substance to back it up. Including by being totally vague about what you believe Chinoy is likely to offer.

 

Yes, this. How about waiting until there’s actually something to this film other than words on paper we haven’t seen before whining about having your fragile male ego offended by the mean lady.

 

How dare anyone make a story about the oppression of women! Oppression of men? Sure! That happens daily! But the womenz? That stuff only works by making men dumb dumbs and that’s not how reality works. Try again, Star Wars.

 

Its great having a preview of the complaints which are going to come up about this movie just because of the director.

 

I hope that the movie is as good as you all seem to assume it will be. I have not yet made any criticism about the movie. All I have said is that it is perfectly acceptable to do so when the movie comes out if such criticism is warranted, and that skepticism beforehand is perfectly justified.

 

I don’t assume anything about a movie that is still over two years away. Maybe you could try the same.

 

There’s only one person making assumptions in this conversation.

 

Sure, making assumptions based off the director's own words.

Is that not okay to do?

 

Obviously it's the execution of the subject. But the film hasn't been made yet, and it's okay to be cautious ahead of its release. Let's hope that the execution is done very well and there's nothing to object to.

 

of course,

Christianity is bad,

not a surprising mindset to have in 21st century

not that I particulary want biblical themes in the new SW movies...for the precise reason people will bash the movie for having them. And I'd rather save myself the eyeroll.