GL1 vs GL2

What might be easiest to make the decision is to see if you can find a place where you can rent out each type of GL camera and see what you like.

-Crimsus

 

how does the JVC's 3CCD Everio HD camcorder hold up against the GL1 or GL2?

 

I think that would be comparing apples to oranges (or maybe just apples with better resolution). HD is a whole new level compared to most non-HD cameras. I have not tried an Everio yet. You will get better picture quality with the Everio HD but that is assuming you shoot the scene correctly. It's like some of the folks that think just because they can rule the game Guitar Heroe 2 means that they can play guitar. They usually can't. The same thing applies here. Just because a camera is HD does not make it better because if you don't have the foundation to stand on your films are going to suffer a lot and that is something that is avoidable if you take your time and start small.

If the camera is to help you step into film-making, just get an inexpensive-handy cam. The one problem I always see people running into is purchasing a camera with a bunch of features. The issue is that they have a difficult time starting out because they just don't know what to do or how to use all the features of a camera. They end up driving themselves nuts. Save yourself the trouble and start out simple.

The best thing to do in my opinion is start small and inexpensive. Once you have built up a some experience and you understand your camera then upgrade, but only upgrade to a camera that is a reasonable upgrade. Don't turn around and buy and handy-cam and then a week later take a loan out to purchase a camera that is leagues beyond your experience.

In my experience, my GL2 has served me well. No it doesn't have the ability to change lenses like with the XL series, but it has some good features to play with so you can learn more. One tidbit of advice: If you are going for a "film look" with a camera, don't do a bunch of blurring and stuff in post-pro. For $12 you can buy a Neutral-Density filter and adjust the settings on the GL2 so that when you rip the footage to a hard drive it already has a "film look". I almost put a hole in my wall when I first started playing with video cameras and I would always do the "film look" effect in post-pro and then a friend of mine told me how to adjust the camera and use a Neutral-Density filter. I was SOOOOO upset because I wasted many hours waiting for a post-pro scene to finish processing when I could have just filmed the scene with the GL2 and the filter attached and the footage wouldn't need any post-pro time for getting the "film look" effect.

v/r
Crimsus

 

Why i ask is the JVC looks like a normal family camcorder with a lenz cover and 16:9 widescreen. Will it look as good as a GL1 or 2?

 

Again, the picture quality on an HD will be better but that is only if you shoot the scene correctly. Don't buy a Cadillac Escalade if you haven't mastered the go-cart yet. The camera manufacturers post all kinds of pretty pictures taken with their camcorders to make the cameras seem like they will fix all the problems of a film maker but those pictures were all done by professionals that knew what they were doing. Don't run out and buy an HD camera just because it is HD. Most of the family style camcorders (either DV or HD) don't have half of the features of a GL1 or GL2.

I think maybe you are getting ahead of yourself. I understand why and I have been in that same position before. I made the mistake 10 years ago of moving over from my old VHS camera to one of the new "top of the line" DV cams that had everything except a key to the city. I wasted a lot of money on it because I did not understand the basics of filming with DV and the secrets of how to shoot with DV. Today I am a bit more disciplined when it comes to buying a new, well, anything, but that's because I learned from my mistake.

v/r
Crimsus

 

So GL1 or 2 has more feattures than the JVC.

 

First, the GL2 is kind of a turbo-charged version of the GL1. It is an upgraded version that takes features from some of Canon's other higher end XL cameras. The GL1 also has very few manual controls, the GL2 has full manual control options for almost every function it has.

The GL2 has more options you can set manually hence giving you more control. The JVC HD is of course HD so you get a better picture resolution, but you sacrifice some of the control you get with a GL2...control that is something you can benefit from because it lets you experiment more with different shooting styles and of course basic functions that all future film-makers need to understand (such as shutter speed, zoom speed, etc.).

Forgive me for saying but it sounds like you are asking a lot of questions hoping the forums can make the decision for you. The problem is your questions are very specific so there is a large margin of unintentional error there since there are many other questions you may not have thought about asking that you should be asking. Take some time and read the manuals and reviews for the two cameras. I did some legwork and posted the links for the GL2 and Everio User Manual pages as well as reviews from a very good camcorder review site.

Here is the link for the Canon GL2: Canon GL2

Here is the link for the JVC Everio: Everio HD GZ-HD Models

Here is a very thorough review of the GL2: Canon GL2 Camcorder Review

Here is a review of the JVC Everio GZ-HD7: JVC GZ-HD7 Camcorder Review

Features aside, you will notice that the review of the JVC is not as long or as in-depth as the Canon GL2 review. This small detail is an indicator to take note of. Typically if a review doesn't have much to say compared to another product of the same type, it means the product with the shorter review may be limited compared to the other product. Add to that the fact that for an HD camera to have such a small review due to less features compared to an older camera with more features I'd say the JVC isn't worth the investment. I downloaded the manual for the JVC and read it. The picture resolution beats the GL2, but that is about the only advantage the Everio has over the GL2. The GL2 is a well designed upgrade to the Canon GL1, it has many features that are used in the more expensive XL-1S, and it has more manual control features than the Everio (many many MANY more). In my opinion, I would get the GL2. It is a good camera with some features that are perfect for someone looking to learn more about filming and experimenting with shots.

v/r
Crimsus

 

Well it looks like i'm gonna get a GL1. This is my first nice camera and i don't want to get to much manual control, so that works out with GL1 as it seems to be right in the middle. Plus it's in my price range.

Is there any sort of adapters or add ons i should buy that would help me as a film maker.

You must remember i'm a newbie film maker and i'm going to ask for wisdom where ever i can get it.

 

You WANT manual control. Especially if you're going to be doing any kind of effect. You want as much of the picture to be in your control as possible. Manual control will help you so much more than any adapters or anything that you could get.

 

Yeah, I posted the info for mostly the GL2 just because of the fact that it has more control than the GL1.

The GL2 is the smart buy, the GL1 is a purchase which will be good for a moment but then you try a GL2 and ask yourself why you didn't buy a GL2 to begin with.

-Crimsus

 

Plus the GL2 has a 30fps "progressive" mode. The GL1 does not. I'd go with the GL2 over the GL1 for that feature alone.

 

Thanks for helping me threw this buy guys!

I'm sill looking for a gl2 to pop up on craigs list. There was a couple here in Arizona that poped up in my price range ($1300) but was gobbled.

Any tips on where to buy in that price range?

 

In that price range it may be difficult to find one for two reasons. Availability and integrity. By integrity I mean someone selling a GL2 that was only "Used Once", but that's because they tried to make it walk down wood stairs like a slinky.

I would be patient and just a bit more cash and get one using PriceGrabber.com. I order most of my camera equipment from B&H Photo but they are not always the lowest priced online store.

-Crimsus

 

I guess you already made up your mind, but I was able to use a GL2 for class on Friday, and I REALLY liked it. Very cool camera. The LCD screen felt sorta small but maybe that was just me.

 

Should i externally record my sound with a GL2? Also i always wanted to use a moniter to watch my shots on something bigger than the LCD screen what should i use?

 

You should always externally record sound, and when possible always ADR it.

Yeah, just get a small old TV for a preview monitor. Get an AV to composite cable, done.

 

Wait, always ADR? What? Why?

 

ADR?

 

ADR is automatic dialouge replacement, in a perfect world it would actually be automatic. Its the thing you always see in the behind the scenes clips with people in booths with microphones resaying their lines.

The reason you should is because you get a much nicer quality of voice, you also have a little bit of wiggle room in case you need to change a line. When all the voices are the same volume its also much earier to believe and doesnt distract as much. Plus, if you are out in the woods or something with uncontrollable nature sounds you gain that control back. In fact, i always toss away the sound from whatever i film and completly reconstruct the sound from scratch.

 

I'm going to...disagree. If you've got a good sound setup and a good boom mic, you can get very decent location sound. Foley and ADR have their place, but that just seems like overkill.

 

ADR is not a method that is used to totally take the place of normal sound recording. In most scenes, a simple shotgun mic on a boom and a good boom operator is all you'll need. ADR is a method used more for scenes where there will be a lot of different audio elements in a scene, some already present and some that are added in the post-production process. A good example of when to use ADR is the duel in Episode III between Anakin and Obi-wan. The music from the film is largely responsible for the overall mood of the scene but in order for the scene to be successful you need all the grunts and stuff. Those were done during filming but depending on the shot they had the actors do the stuff ADR-style so they could gaurantee those sounds would be correctly balanced with the score. A good example of when to use a basic boom setup is just about any other time during the film when it was just dialogue.

There is a major problem if you use ADR for everything. You will be adding a TON of extra tasks to be performed in post-production since you will have to sit there and literally place all your sound by watching the footage. This also means that if you are off by so much as a tenth of a second in placing the audio, the audience will know it straight out. To the audience it would be like watching the film in a theater where the guy in the camera booth started the audio track out of sync. Dialogue that starts with things like "m" and "n" would showcase this problem because they are sounds that don't generally start the moment the actor moves his/her mouth like with "t" or "d".

IndyFan89, I would recommend just getting the GL2 and learning the camera first. Don't go all "kid in a candy store" and buy a bunch of film making equipment all at once until you understand the camera. Sound is a whole other ball of wax.

v/r
Crimsus

 

Is there a adpter for shooting widescreen avalible for these cameras? That would make it alot easyer then croping in post.

 

The GL2 has fake widescreen build-in. Fake as in it give the picture a "squeeze" horizontally. then you can pull it out in post.

Try looking for this http://www.buydig.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=CEANAGL somewhere.

 

Could i make one?

 

I actually own one of those adapters. It is nice. The only drawback is that it limits your zoom slightly due the mechanics of how it attaches to the camera. This isn't a major problem though, I haven't had any situations where I couldn't do a shoot because of the zoom limitation, which is very minor.

You could pick up a lens system for cameras that have non-interchangeable lenses, but that would be uber-expensive. The Century Optics 16:9 is a bit pricey but it is a very well made add-on.

v/r
Crimsus