Goldenrod

I recently have been on a Star Wars EU reading binge. I wanted to wait for the rest of the series to be released, and now I am halfway through The Unifying Force.

The reason for this topic is such:

Does it bother anyone else that the only thing Han calls C-3PO (or 9 times out of 10) is Goldenrod. It annoys me. It was funny that time in ESB but every author has Han call 3PO that. And almost only that.

Especially true in The Force Heretic trilogy and now in TUF.

Does this bother anyone else?

and can we PLEASE stop mentioned the damn cave on Dagobah! And going to it, too........

And I noticed no one says "I've got a bad feeling about this" - is that intentional?

These links to the movies, while interesting the first time they do it, have gotten to the point where they have cheapened the occurance in the movie. Like Anderson's books with TOO MANY links to the movies.

Anyone else agree with me here? Especially about the Goldenrod thing?

Madine out

 

I love "Goldenrod." And I love links to the movies. When you have such an enormous universe of stories spreading out over years and years, I like stuff that makes me recall past events.

 

I agree that it is a bit annoying at times. But It isnt really a slang Han uses for 3P0 anymore, It seems more like a nickname. Sure Han get aggrevated with the Droid, but who doesent? After all, it is a Protocol droid....

I think Han and 3PO have alot different relationship than they did 25 years before, as is evidenced in TUF.

-Jabba out

 

I agree with GenMadine. It's not just "Goldenrod": there is, among many authors, a tendency to overuse quotes from the films to give a sense of familiarity. To me it's a cop-out. They're neglecting authentic characterization by substituting familiar dialogue, in the hopes we'll read it and think "Oh, yeah. That's something Han would say. Good old Han. I remember on Hoth when he said..." Sometimes, it's appropriate, but most of the time I find it annoying and out of place. It betrays a lack of imagination on behalf of the author.

 

I agree cooker, thanks for putting it in another way.

While writing the Virtual Sequels, we ran into a similar problem with people over quoting or doing a derivitive quote and it is so unoriginal. I had to really push to get all references besides completely appropriate ones out because of the same reason - to me it is unoriginal and hack.

Anyone else see what I mean?

Madine out

 

understandably so. i agree. i would venture to think that 'goldenrod' is more of a nickname now...so i usually let that slide. but as for the '...got a bad feeling...' part, that is overused. the problems arise mainly in the FH trilogy....the worst.

 

Yeah, doesn't bother me. I go by my nickname, Pdixie to a lot of my friends. Hey, it's better then Han calling Threepio "Bronze Britches".

 

Ha! I get called "Jabba" by my friends, so it could be worse...

I guess you can figure out why Im called that!

 

Rarely does CoK call his dog by his full name. Rather the context dictates what he may be called and there are lots of affectionate nicknames. CoK thinks that Goldenrod has taken on an affectionate tone in the years since Empire and is now just a nickname.

 

Because you're fat? Or do you bite the heads of of frogs as snack fiids? Wait I know. You chain half naked females to your bed don't you.

 

I think the nickname just got stuck to the point where it's a second name for C-3P0.

 

and I think it reeks of "cheapness"

If it is a nickname, then he has been calling him that FOR THIRTY YEARS! Please, eventually, he would move on to another name.

He called 3PO Professor also - they do not use that one very much.

I think the writers want the familiarity from the movie, not because it is a nickname.

EU readers I guess are now immune to noticing it as anything else but a nickname, and not Hack writing.

But as far as complaints about EU go, this is prety minor. The major compalint of too many movie references is what really irks me.

Like that dang cave at Dagobah.
PLEASE STOP GOING THERE!

And stop using Goldenrod. It is old. It has been done.

What is next, we go back to Hoth and ew run into the EXACT SAME WAMPA LUKE DID, WITH ONLY ONE ARM?

Oh, wait... that did happen, Darksaber....

[never mind a Wampa with arm probably could not last that long in Hoth's harsh climate, hunting with one arm, eating with one arm, but who cares! It was in the novie, let's bring it back!)

Am I making more sense now?

Madine out

 

People don't just come up with nicknames and then always move onto a new one.

In my experience people find one really good nickname and they use it forever.

Also nicknames also tend to change when the person they are talking about change. They gain 400 pounds, grow 12 foot, etc. With a droid you don't get much change.

I don't think it is a hack for them to have Han call C3P0 goldenrod. I don't see anything wrong with authors returning to things that were in the movie. Especially since it is the Expanded Universe, so its expanding on the movies...not the totally new brand spanking new dog lickingly great universe or TNBSBDLGU for short (but not by much )

 

This is a tricky sort of thing. It really depends on how it is done. Some authors know how to use movie lines to good effect, where it brings back a memory or feeling without tossing you out of the story and back 20 years. Other times, it's done in a seemingly cynical way, going for the easy line instead of being more creative. Han could just as easily use 3PO, since he calls him that often in the films too. I do admit to occasionally being disappointed by reading film lines when I was hoping for some really smart comeback from the author.

 

What is next, we go back to Hoth and ew run into the EXACT SAME WAMPA LUKE DID, WITH ONLY ONE ARM?

I've never read Darksaber, but if this actually happens, you've just ensured I never will.

I still agree with GenMadine. The point of the Expanded Universe is to expand on the stories, characters, and locations of the films. By simply revisiting old haunts for no other purpose than to instill a sense of familiarity, an author cheapens the story.

But that's just my opinion.

 

Because you're fat? Or do you bite the heads of of frogs as snack fiids? Wait I know. You chain half naked females to your bed don't you.

Yeah, Cause Im Fat.


But..i do have a liking for Twi'leks, Blue especially...

 

What is next, we go back to Hoth and ew run into the EXACT SAME WAMPA LUKE DID, WITH ONLY ONE ARM?

Oh, wait... that did happen, Darksaber....

[never mind a Wampa with arm probably could not last that long in Hoth's harsh climate, hunting with one arm, eating with one arm, but who cares! It was in the novie, let's bring it back!)

Am I making more sense now?

GenMadine: hahahahahhahahahahahaahhahahhahhhaha..... ohhhh mannnnn! your'e right! i have completely forgotten about that! yeah, that was bad. realllll bad!

 

Why do so many supposed eu fans seem to hate it so much that this can become a major topic of whats suposedly wrong with the it?

All the times that i've read 3po called goldenrod i havent given it a second thought, it doesn't mater where it comes from, personally i'm getting into the story, not picking apart the writing style of the author.

You should try it, my way there isn't a sw book that i don't like, sure i have prefrences but ultimatly i like them all because to me it is star wars as apposed to likeing one or two because some author has re-used a location or line from the films or heaven forbid some have chosen a nick name and made it apart of the continuity of sw.

 

Didn't you know, Lord Ogli?

[sarcasm]That means you're not a real EU fan.
You don't hate the EU enough.
You can't like everything because more than half of it is garbage written by two bit hacks who ruin everything they touch and don't understand star wars. The characters aren't consistent, they're too static, not enough happens, the plots are too busy going every which way at the same time to hold my interest, I hate how they echo the movies all the time, I hate it when they do something original, I hate how there's so many Jedi, I wish they'd focus more on the Jedi characters instead of the stupid smugglers and rogue squadron all the time; the only good EU is Zahn, which is terrible. Mara Mara Mara, Mara Mara Mara Kyp; Jacen Jaina Corran. Lumiya Ken Palpatine Vergere. [/sarcasm]

There's a forum for people who do nothing but whine about the existence of the EU, people: It's called 3SA

 

I think you two are missing the point.

I like EU, that is why I continue to read it.

I like Star Wars, that is why I continue to read EU.

I post these complaints because I want the EU to continue to be better to strive for excellence, not settle for mediocrity.

Which I feel that the points I have highlighted do, they settle for the easy instead of striving for the excellence that good SW fiction allows. Like Star By Star and Traitor.

I am not bashing for bashing's sake, and I think you are the ones out of line here, perpetuating a stereotype that is not in practice here.

The very nature of a FAN FORUM is to voice opinions, and to start discussion. That is what I am attempting here.

Our opinions are not the same as your negativity. And your negativity has no place here.

So please take it elsewhere, and I urge you, if you want to have your points heard, try phrasing them in a different way, a not-so-negative way.

Thanks, I look forward to you joining the discussion.

Madine out

 

Re-reading that it came off more acid-tongued than I wanted it to.

Well, I wish it hadn't. But I think that's a good capsule statement of some people who participate in the 'eu isn't any good' discussion.

I don't think that it cheapens the franchise to re-use things.

Repetition of scenes/characters and/or archetypes/dialogue/etc. is part of what makes star wars Star Wars IMHO. Lucas, whatever problems with him I may have, has set that forth. I think (even though I'm not a KJA fan) things like the wampa further define the SW character.

People didn't like that character and they got the NJO, and some of the same people are now clamoring for the Bantam era style back.

I don't think it's cheap, or hack writing. It's genre writing that adheres to the rules of its genre.

A more civil version of my two cents.