ground vehicles

does repulsor technology have places it can't go?

why do we have walkers, wheeled vehicles, and hovercraft when we have repusolor technology? what are the advantages to each?

on a slightly related note, can repulsorcraft normally travel across water?

 

I believe the only real explanation we're given is that repulsorlifts either don't work or are unreliable in certain environments; Empire at War expanded on this somewhat by introducing repulsorlift-jammers as a gimmicky way to encourage the player to use walkers.

This explanation strikes me as kinda silly, though, given how utterly reliable repulsor technology seems to be.

 

I believe its mentioned somewhere that repulsorlift vehicles are not widely used in battle because shields interact with repulsors, negating them or something. Thats why the Empire used walkers at Hoth, and not repulsor tanks.

 

Cause walkers are cool!

 

There is also the problem that certain planets have messed up magnetic fields that negate the functions of repulsorlifts. Under such conditions you are forced to use walkers or treaded/wheeled vehicles.

As for the water issue, for the most part repulsorlift vehicles appear to be able to travel over water, the only exceptions I can think of are video games like Battle for Naboo and Galactic Battlegrounds, and those instances can be written off as gameplay mechanics.

 

D'oh! I totally forgot about that.

You're absolutely right. Theater shielding can only be penetrated by objects maintaining contact with the ground, or something along those lines; this is the biggest reason why repulsorlifts aren't always used.

 

This thread makes me realize... I MISS ground vehicles in the EU! Think about it; ever since the NJO, we've been decidedly lacking in grand action sequences featuring ground-based vehicles. If the New Republic can go out of their way to retrofit X-Wings, couldn't they have taken the time to also remodify the "Walkers"?

 

One issue with repulsor craft is stability...one near miss explosion would flip or shift the track of a vehicle on a repulsor...similar issue to the hovercraft in service to militaries around the world today...low friction is great for transportation...can be disastrous in combat.

A Walker or a wheeled vehicle can hold their position...not be jarred by near misses, and be a platform for weapons with significant size and recoil...which is how we get things like the artillery platorms, the Juggernauts, and eventually the ATAT.

Repulsor tech is best used in fast moving operation...quick strikes, quick deployments, perhaps even as ambulances...but for a trudging slug-it-out battleline, give me something with it's feet (or wheels) on the ground.

EDIT: Oh, and then there is the intimidation factor, which has been documented as a theme to Imperial construction schemes...ATATs scare the dung out of people.

 

can repulsorcraft "climb" rocky terrain better than a walker? i would think a walker might work better than a wheeled vehicle on such surfaces. i know from the movies that a swoop can drop over a cliff and keep going., but can it go up that cliff?

 

It can move 1 of 2 ways:

1) it hugs the surface, which might mean dips and winding similar to a 4 wheeler, since the repulsors will be attempting to adapt to finite and changing surface areas.

or

2) the craft increases it's altitude to be enough height to avoid needing to bob and weave the uneven terrain...and then come back down ontop of the climb.

I'm confident that both methods have been used in EU, though I can't say with exactness where at the moment.

Walkers, especially the task-designed ones like AT-MTs are best suited to climbs and difficult terrains in regards to direct assaults. BUT. In difficult terrains, direct assaults aren't always the most expedient, or cost effective. Which, of course, is why most specialized walker tech seems to be the realm of the Empire and their psych-war construction mentality.

A spider walker coming up a mountain side at me would make me want to pull the white flag!

 

Could it also be that a Walker or other vehicle firmly planted on the ground is better protected from the impact of incoming fire? Sure, a Repulsorcraft could carry the same armor, but if a shot hits a repulsorcraft, is it going to throw it sideways or flip it over, potentially mission killing the vehicle?

 

I was thinkin about ground walkers and other vehicles the other day and I couldn't work out why there are so few of them in the EU. I mean, we never hear of Snow Speeders or similar and surely the Alliance would have made use of ATATs! I mean they decided to use star destroyers so surely they would want ATATs or similar, they are utterly devastating!

I want to see someone comanding a platoon/squadron or whatever of ATATs against some insurgents or sommething. But like there be hundreds of the things!

 

In addition to the concerns noted above, it's my understanding that repulser lift craft tend to travel faster than other ground vehicles. A sudden change in elevation may unbalance a vehicle, or cause it to overcompensate.

General rule of thumb.
Uneven ground = no repulser lift.
Nice flat or gently sloping terrain = repulser lift.

 

I agree with the comments about the distinct lack of ground combat in the recent post-ROTJ novels especially. The Clone Wars had its share of stories involving massive battles, recently though the big battles all seem to happen "off screen". The GA needs more Jabiims.

Admittedly ground combat has always had a big question mark over it in my head about why you don't just bomb the hell out of something from orbit... But it still exists, has featured heavily in two films, and the authors need to remember that and not allow the "why don't you just blow it up?" attitude to exclusively prevail.

I'm hoping Shadows of Mindor has some truly epic battles. While I always enjoyed the starship battles more in the films, ironically I tend to prefer the ground battles in the books, as I've always found space battles don't work as well on paper.

 

You took the words right out of my mouth. The Novels, especially, seem to have completely forgotten that ground combat exists, which doesn't seem to be an affliction of the films or even the Comic series, although even they have less than they could. There seriously needs to be more ground battles and more detail about the equipment used in ground battles. Not all of us Star Wars fans are fleet junkies! Some of us are good, ol' groundpounders!

 

I dunno, I think that in an actual battle between two equally matched militaries, an AT-AT would have to be the worst thing you can field. Although I think that Isard's Revenge greatly exaggerates what starfighters can do to walkers, it isn't that much effort to put a payload of proton torpedoes onto some V-wings and fly them out to blow up these fat juicy targets.

I really think that games like EaW go too much out of their way to make the Rebel Alliance and Empire look like our own. Instead I would imagine that the New Republic's ground forces would consist mainly of infantry, commandos, and fast ground speeders....and that'd probably be it. Fire support can be provided by anything from gunships to maneuvering airspeeders and starfighters. The biggest thing they field would probably be just a medium tank roughly analogous to the Trade Federation's AAT. Any ground formation such as the one we saw on Geonosis is just asking to be carpet bombed by Star Destroyers.

Considering that the theatre of battle consists of the entire planet and the space surrounding it I don't think there's that much emphasis on ground combat. Troops can be ferried in from orbit to hit strategic points at will, rather than sending an armored battalion to do it the hard way....making the artillery siege at Muunilinst look silly. Even if there are planetary shields, these worlds can just be bypassed if they're too heavily defended (think island hopping). Just kick the enemy fleet out of orbit and they're not much of a threat anymore. If you're invading a world without having established space superiority in the first place, you're running the risk of getting ambushed and stranded on that planet (see Guadalcanal and Battle of Savo Island). If you really need to invade a shielded planet, just tractor in some asteroids and fling them at the shields en masse (think Star by Star and Fury). Most of the major Core Worlds switched sides anyway once the New Republic took Coruscant and established its legitimacy to former Imperials.

 

in real life warfare, you aren't really going to find an F-16 gunning down a tank or a jeep. You are more likely to find an A-10 or similar plane doing it. I'm not entirely certain that there is a Star Wars version of the A-10. The starfighters all seem to be fighters or bombers. no attack planes. are there? this is weird cuz there are anti-aircraft/anti-starcraft weapons and machines.

also... are there any repulsorcraft that have backup legs, wheels, or tracks?

 

Alpha-Red you've highlighted the big fat question mark I mentioned. Its one of the areas where I must admit I always feel there has to be a certain suspension of disbelief. Ground combat played a big enough role in the Clone Wars scenes in AOTC and ROTS though to raise the question why we don't see much in the books. I've always wondered why they didn't just use the Acclamators to bomb Geonosis back to the stone age, but at the end of the day, for whatever reason they chose to do it the old fashioned way.

IcePirate, I agree. I loved the LAAT from AOTC, it was nice to see a fancy atmospheric gunship to do things a starfighter blasting along at hypersonic speeds wouldn't always be capable of. I've long wanted them to design Imperial and New Republic equivalents, as right now the only thing we've got is the LAAT. Sentinel shuttles and such are okay for troop transport but don't feel as if they'd be able to do all the things the LAAT did.

 

You know, that's a really good idea. Have something use repulsorlifts to get into position quickly, then drop treads or wheels to move around in combat for the added stability.

 

i forgot about the snowspeeders on hoth. they essentially were like the A-10.... maybe a bit underpowered, though.

 

Ground combat will always be important to those who which to conquer and control territory. The Empire Strikes Back provides us with a perfectly legitimate reason for ground combat: planetary shields prevent orbital bombardment. With no way to strike a target from orbit, one must land on the surface to engage the defenders. The ground battle at Geonosis was prompted by a desire to rescue the Jedi and capture the Seperatist leaders before they escaped, a task impossible to perform using orbital bombardment. Likewise, if you don't want to reduce an entire continent to slag, you'll have to send in ground troops to get the job done.

 

Oh i have to agree. I tend to want to speed read through the space battles. Where in a ground combat im more attentive. I dont know maybe i have A.D.D. when i comes to space battles.

 

Actually I think the Battle of Hoth is an exception to the rule. The Empire is bent on destroying the Rebel Alliance and has to to it quickly, hence a ground invasion. However, if the world you're assaulting is just one of many military bases that your opponent possesses, there's no incentive to commit ground troops to taking it. Just destroy their shipyards, bomb their starfighter bases and wreck their spaceports....then move on to the next planet. Hopefully that next planet will not have a large enemy ground presence and you'll be able to set up shop there instead. That's exactly why space superiority is important, as it allows you to bypass ground battles altogether in many instances.

 

i disagree about the logic on hoth, to an extent. if i were a military leader tasked with annihilating an enemy force in the star wars galaxy and i was given a take no prisoners order... and i knew there were absolutely no civilians on the planet.... i'd do what i could to drop the planetary shields then destroy the planet asap. this to ruin any chance of survival of the enemy chain of command and infrastructure.

this may have been the initial idea with hoth.... but ozzel f'd things up by showing up too early, and then giving the rebs time to sort of prep an escape...