Hiding Evidence, or Thin-Skinned Administrators

I think that only people who have the insight into creating "administration threads" and controlling them, who are able to deal with troublemakers privately, keep threads on topic without offending, but recognise and tolerate people who wish to be treated with some common dignity and repect when seriously expressing an opinion should become administrators. It can be and often is done with economy and common sense.

 

Obi Wan and Only, I posted a "me three" after your post, and I think I saw one other post after me before I went to bed. I'll have to check my history files at home tonight. (I use aohell at home, so I'm not sure if the file will exist.)

Where are all the phantom administrators, and what's their take on this issue?

 

Funny, this just reminded me of a similar incident, not too long ago. I was banned, by the way...

I am seriously thinking of leaving TFN and these forums behind me. I think it is pathetic. I think there need to be new admins and mods that aren't part of the 'incrowd'.

I will no longer participate in this discussion. PM me if you like, but this is IT as far as I'm concerned.

 

On a lighter note, I was looking at Padme Bra's links to the threads, and I got all excited when I saw that I had an unread private message (rare for me). It quickly dissipated, though, when I saw a Geocities "file not found" page and realized it was PB's private message, not mine. Hahaha, me so stupid.

Okay, back on topic. I just thought it was slightly amusing and somewhat related.

 

I agreee with you 101%.

 

LOL...I've done that everytime I've looked at that thread, Norman

 

I wouldn't get rid of the admins, just educate them on what to do exactly.

 

I will have to agree with Senator epic and the rest of the crew. How you say something is just as important as the idea of the post. Being tactful with words makes it that much easier to take. Looking at what we as members need to do is basically what has been requested. And work from there. Either that or request that the admins in question basically tone down the language used to a respectable level. One in which it is clearly understood and cannot be taken as overbearing. There are some admins who do that, but for the most part most of the admins talk with a lot softer voice. What is that famous quote of Teddy Roosevelt?

"Talk softly, but carry a big stick."


How can that be brought into the discussion here. Or how can that be used by the admins in question?

 

Hmmm...I wasn't around last night until after this all happened, so I'm not going to pretend I know the full story. I will say that I've put a face on this issue and hopefully we can all come to a mutual understanding soon. But let's not resort to "kill the wabbitt!" tactics, folks. Give us a chance to work it out first.

Until then, this thread will continue under my personal protection. It will NOT be removed...

 

With all due respect, we've given you all at least THREE chances to do something about this behaviour....

 

Greetings.

I've been monitering the events here on the JC for some weeks now, and I think these problems are all due to the same cause.

Some of the admins feel this place is out of control.

Too much flaming, too much trolling, too much off-topic, redundant, etc. This must be curtailed! We can't have this sort of behavior!

So there's deleting, banning, and other acts of restraint by admins of posters. Then there's argument of same, of the kind we've all heard:

"That's not fair! I wasn't doing anything!"
"Yeah, well, them's the rules!"

And so it happens when the admin is tired of being defamed just for doing his or her job as he or she sees it, that someone gets banned. Sometimes this ban is retracted, sometimes not. Friends of the banned howl from beyond and the admins retreat further into a single-minded determination to keep order at all costs.

Now, restraining forum members is part what admins are for. Keeping order IS important. But what KIND of order?

This is a discussion board. In our minds "discussion board" is the same as an 18th century Parisian salon, but we should all be capable of seeing that's not the case. A BB is one part after-school hangout, one part Platonic Academy, a dash of meat market and a generous dollop of dueling green. Personalities clash. Noise is made. This is inevitable, and no alleviation of it should be imposed from above.

Several threads about flaming, appropriate language and general civilized behavior, started by admins, have had a salutary effect of inspiring others to be more reasonable, and write less incendiary threads (at least, that's what I've noticed). Here is an example of admins encouraging rather than culling. It works.

My point is that we should all just relax, especially the admins. This is not a nation of malcontented rebels seeking to overthrow you. We're just posters. Let us post. Encourage us to an ideal and leave us alone. Step in only when there's obvious trouble that's becoming a problem, not at the first hint of danger. There isn't any danger here. IT'S THE INTERNET. The only danger is a bruised ego, which grows back, and besides, is it really *your* ego? I am not "Sith Acolyte". "Sith Acolyte" is the name of user 230305. He's only a fraction of me. If he were to disappear, my life would go on. So it should be if someone sneers at anyon else, including "Iron Parrot", "Vertical", "Preacherboy", "jasman", "Lord Chewy", "BoB", or "(insert name of forgotten admin here)".

Now, I happen to know that issues like this are as old as the forum itself. Well back in the "Golden Days of the JC" posters and admins were sniping over stuff just like this. There's no need to replace the current admins, or convince them to step down, provided we can all agree to let the currents and ebbs of the forum flow as they will. When there's serious trouble, then we can do something different.

A final word. Banning should only be the final resort of any admin. There have been far too many heads lopped off on Tower Green already, and for reasons to petty to warrant discussion.

Cheers,

 

Ol'val.

Not _exactly_ the usual problems, Sith Acolyte: unless you count Slackergate as the usual. This is, of course, in my opinion only -- based on over a year's worth of Communications discussions.

Kida

 

You know since I came back I have really tried to stay away from the bickering and hope that problems would work themselves out, but I guess that was naive of me.

This is what happens when some of the Administrators are younger or kids. Positions of management are not typically given to those who show certain attributes that I have seen in present administrators. I have experience as an office manager and comparing the situation to that of the one here, it is like mistreating employees. There is MICROMANAGEMENT happening in every direction.

Ok, before I give myself a headache, I am outta here.

Ciao.

 

Should it not be a desirable quality in an admin to have the ability when addressed rudely to NOT respond with rudeness?

I can not understand how an admin can do an adequate job without this talent.
Becoming an admin does not mean you've won a popularity contest. Accepting this responsibility means that a certain segment of the user population will treat you with contempt. How can an admin candidate not know this going in? It comes with the territory.

And yet I see it again and again. Folks that you would think know better, seem shocked, astounded and finally offended by the attitudes of the users.

As long as that user contempt does not cross over into the realm of personal attack, then it is part and parcel of the hazards of forum life.

It must be known that certain parties will go to great lengtht to get a 'rise' out of the Authorities- it's human nature. And what counters this behavior better than anything else is detached indifference. Unfortunately a certain level of maturity must be reached before this skilled can be wielded effectively. Some individuals will never learn to wield it. They shouldn't be admins.

The ones that can be honest with themselves and realize this, go on to become better human beings. Others... well, they'll probably only move on to be middle management somewhere.

**sigh**

 

Brilliantly said!

 

"But what I AM asking is that the other admins try to be a little more prudent in overseeing things when an admin (or two) go a step over the line."

again and again and again.

 

A lot of people keep using the phrase "It's just a message board," and for people to chill out.

Well I wish the admins would realize that! Then we would be in good shape.

 

Your opinion has been noted, and as I said before, I have put a face on this issue. I'm not happy with the situation here and I've voiced my concerns in the admin's private arena. Rest assured, there's going to be a resolution to this.

I know that some of you are very upset. I'm sorry. I'm going to have to ask you to give us a little bit of time to discuss this privately and find some administrative stance on this. It's hot on the platter and the wheels of reason are starting to roll...

K

 

Rhui Chatar made some excellent points, particularly the following: "Unfortunately a certain level of maturity must be reached before this skilled can be wielded effectively. Some individuals will never learn to wield it. They shouldn't be admins."


Thanks for turning up here, Mr K.

 

I think I speak for many here when I say thanks to Mr. K, Vertical and the other admins who decided to talk to the members about this. You guys are in a really bad spot, don't think we don't realize that. We undertand you can't say anything publically about this issue but it's good to know that there are at least a couple of you who aknowledge that there IS an issue.

 

Times like these I wish Emoticons are still functional on this board. *puts on the "indifferent" smilie*

 

If anyone is still interested, I have the complete copy of epic's deleted "For the betterment of the forum" thread from last night. (I copied the last page literally seconds before it was removed.) Please PM me if you want to have a looksie.

Vertical and Mr. K - thank you so much for responding to this. IMHO you two are - and always have - done a great job here.

 

Just to reinforce what Mr. K said, I too have brought this up with the rest of the admins. We're working on it. Hang in there, guys

Vertical

 

"But let's not resort to "kill the wabbitt!" tactics, folks..."

Mr. K, thank you for visiting this thread and posting a thoughtful response. I hope you're not accusing us of a witch hunt, though. This discussion is nothing of the sort. It's here to point out the feelings of many regular members of these Forums, some familiar with the situation, some not-so-familiar. Some that have been here for a long time, others just discovering what a great place this board could be. In other words, all sorts of members with varying levels of involvement.

This is neither a flame-fest nor a burning at the stake. We're not storming the castle with torches. What we're doing is bringing up a valid point: mistakes were made. Big mistakes. And yesterday was not the first time this happened. As others have said, how many mistakes and errors in judgement will these Administrators be allowed to make before something is done?

I guarantee you, if a member did similar things THREE or FOUR times, they would be gone in an instant. So fast it would make your head spin.

Why should the treatment of an Administrator, who has made mistakes (including flaming) on a much more global level, be exempted from rules that govern the rest of us?

It should not be.

Mr. K (and Vertical), thank you for lending an Administrative voice to this debate. However, I know I speak for many when I say that a slap on the hand will simply not suffice this time.

 

Post that bad boy, Jedi Kylenn.