How do you think Yoda felt about training Anakin?

In The Phantom Menace, Mace Windu initially refuses to train Anakin. Qui-Gon takes him with to Naboo, and Anakin ends up saving the day by inadvertantly destroying the Droid Control Ship. When they get back, Yoda and Obi-Wan talk about it:

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[b]YODA:[/b] Confer on you, the level of Jedi Knight the Council does. But agree on you taking this boy as your Padawan learner, I do not.

[b]OBI-WAN:[/b] Qui-Gon believed in him.

[b]YODA:[/b] The Chosen One the boy may be; nevertheless, grave danger I fear in his training.

[b]OBI-WAN:[/b] Master Yoda, I gave Qui-Gon my word. I will train Anakin. Without the approval of the Council if I must.

[b]YODA:[/b] Qui-Gon's defiance I sense in you. Need that, you do not. Agree, the council does. Your apprentice, young Skywalker will be.[hr][/blockquote]Okay, obviously, it turns out that Obi-Wan was given permission by the Jedi Council to train Anakin, my question is was Yoda for it, or against it? Did he change his mind? Or was he out voted by the council?

 

Seems pretty clear to me that Yoda was against it. I got the idea he was out-voted. However, it also seems that by AOTC, he had changed his mind. Probably peer-pressure by Mace.

 

I must agree, Yoda says flatout that he doesn't want the boy changed, and initially the Council agrees. However the rest of the Council including Mace change thier minds. Now if Mace was also against it, it would not have passed, if both 1st & 2nd Council Members were against. I think there might be one of two reasons for their change in approach:

1. At of respect to Qui-Jonn's dying wishes. Heck even Obi-Wan changed in deference to QJ's last wishes.

2. B/c of what he was able to do in the starfighter through the force.

 

I think Yoda just allowed it because he was out voted and he knew Obi-Wan would have done it anyway.

-Jedi Master Zax Starwalker

 

Yoda was not keen in getting Anakin trained no doubt.

However, Yoda seems to acknowledge that defiance isn't a good trait to have and the repercussions of that, maybe worse than his feelings about Anakin and that time, especially since Anakin's future was clouded.

In other words, he can't see Anakin's future but a defiant attitude is unacceptable. So he states that Obi Wan doesn't need that.

Finally, Yoda probably knew that the Sith were indeed back, and having Anakin showing up at the similar time, Yoda could risk allowing the training. Something had to be done about the Sith's appearance in anycase. Better to get Anakin trained with the hope of countering the threat.

 

I've never understood why everyone thinks Mace was the cause of it all.

When talking to Qui-gon about it, he seemed against it for the most part as well, and very doubtful. And we saw no evidence of him thinking Anakin was the Chosen One in AOTC either.

The only thing I've seen is the ending to Shatterpoint, which I think is rather overwrought/over the top.

So is there soemthing I'm missing here?

 

Perhaps Yoda saw the entire fall of Anakin in great detail, but knowing that the future is always in motion, decided not to reveal his discovery to anyone. Maybe after Anakin falls to the Dark Side Yoda admits to knowing all along it would happen and is banned to Dagobah by the Jedi Council. Kind of far-fetched, but why else would Yoda live on a slimy mudhole?

 

>>>However, it also seems that by AOTC, he had changed his mind.

What makes you say that?

I'd say that he'd accepted that Anakin was going to be trained, but there's nothing in AOTC (or the OT, come to that) that suggests to me that Yoda ever thought that Anakin's training was a good idea.

Once his training started, that's it- there's no way to "un-train" him in the Jedi Arts; all they can do is to try to help him finish what he's started and become a proper Jedi.

>>>However the rest of the Council including Mace change thier minds.

And again, I don't think anything suggests that they change their minds. Look at the quote that Go-Mer posted- I will train Anakin. Without the approval of the Council if I must. Similarly, when Qui Gon says he'll train Anakin, the reason Mace tells him he can't is simply because he already has a Padawan, and the code forbids more than one at a time. If he was forbidding it because the Jedi Council didn't want him trained, surely he would have brought him up on that instead of the fine print of the code?

 

It has to be more than a little intimidating, even for a Jedi like Yoda. This kid has the potential to be even more in tune with the Force than he is, and considering the problems with a former apprentice like Dooku...

If it hadn't been such a well-repected and powerful Jedi as Qui-Gon, I wonder if they would've agreed to let Obi-Wan be Anakin's teacher.

But then again, it seems like Mace and Yoda offer Obi-Wan advice as well, so it's more of a collaborative process than some think.

 

I'd say that he'd accepted that Anakin was going to be trained, but there's nothing in AOTC (or the OT, come to that) that suggests to me that Yoda ever thought that Anakin's training was a good idea.

LOL! Why do we only get in continuity arguments, Scott, even when I'm not arguing continuity? Ten years is plenty of time to change his mind. I see nothing wrong with this assumption. But you ask why I would make it? Well, Obi-wan had his doubts, expressed them to Yoda and Mace, Mace blew them off, Yoda said nothing. Silence is one of the loudest forms of agreement - agreement in this case with the council.

 

Once the council out voted Yoda, it was up to the entire Jedi Order to train Anakin as best they could.

Yoda couldn't just wash his hands of the situation simply because he was against it.

When Obi-Wan showed concern about Anakin's arrogance, Yoda aknowledged that it was a problem that was becoming more and more common amongst the Jedi, even with their older, more experienced members.

The reason they still allowed Anakin to go on his mission by himself is because at some point, they have to allow Anakin to make his own choices, and see how he does.

There is a line cut from the film where Mace tells Obi-Wan that they have to trust that Anakin will make the right choice.

So at the very least it isn't clear whether Yoda ever changed his mind about training Anakin or not.

 

There is a line cut from the film where Mace tells Obi-Wan that they have to trust that Anakin will make the right choice.

That was cut? Seems I remember it being in the film. Mmm, oh well.

But anyway, the obvious error of the mission wasn't sending him out on his own, but sending him out with Padme - alone. Obi-wan points this out, too, and Yoda also doesn't seem to have a problem with it.

 

When did he point out anything about Padme to Yoda and Mace?

 

In the scene where they're discussing sending him off. He mentions him having feelings for her.

 

Obi-Wan does voice his concern about Anakin and Padme together.

"...he has an emotional connection to her."

Or something like that.

 

When does that happen?

 

Deleted scenes for AOTC.

 

That's funny. I was just thinking about this the other day. It seems Yoda doesn't want Anakin changed. This seems to be Lucas showing how ahead and wise Yoda is compared to the other Jedi. Then again, since Anakin is the "chosen one" now, it shows how behind Yoda was...

 

Yoda thought Anakin was too old. He thought the same thing about Luke also. According to the novel, the whole Jedi Council except for Yoda was pulling for young Skywalker to be trained and it also said they had oddly gone against the advice of Yoda.

 

I think that Yoda was fully against it in his mind and knew of Anakin's evil future. But "You must keep your friends close, your enemies closer"- Godfather

He gives permission of Anakin to be trained simply so Anakin doesn't go against the Jedi.

 

He gives permission of Anakin to be trained simply so Anakin doesn't go against the Jedi.

Yeah, that sure worked out alright ...