Is Ben Skywalker really a Skywalker?

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I approve of this thread.

 

There's also something called abstinence. Who's to say Luke doesn't believe in marriage before sex? Akanah is the only confirmed counterexample, and I'd like to point out that we don't actually know there was no child, anyways...

Aside from being loyal to what she believes in, are we talking about the woman who had trouble letting anyone get emotionally close to her? So she went from not being able to truly let anyone close to having sex with random dudes?

She cheated on him... by accident. Not sure what you're saying here... hard to do it by accident.

If you were loyal to someone, then found irrefutable evidence that they had used you and lied to you for your entire life, is losing faith in them a sign that you're not the most loyal person? At any rate, she arguably only truly broke away from the shadow Palpatine left in TLC, five years after his death. By CotJ, three years after that, she's receiving further evidence about the depth of his lies, and she's still affected strongly by it. It seems perfectly logical that she might at first regard the person who raised her and gave her purpose in life very highly, then break away when she finds he's betrayed her for all this time. It's not as if someone told her he didn't care, and she immediately turned on Palpatine.

PPOR. Does she leave allies to die? No. Does she show unconcern for her family and friends? No. Does she put herself at risk in order to avoid hurting the feelings of those close to her? Yes (DN). Does she act unwisely in response to finding that she is responsible for stopping the Jedi from taking Caedus out earlier, and thus for putting her own son in harm's way? Yes.

Mara has a strong sense of personal responsibility (perhaps excessive when she chose to go after Caedus alone), yes. But disloyal? Evidence--opinions about Palpatine in Allegiance, loyalty to Karrde and his people throughout TTT and Jade Solitaire--strongly suggests that she is extremely loyal. If you're going to argue that "she's a different, bad person in post-NJO," the burden of proof is on you.

 

Son of this Tund?

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Me likes this theory.

 

I'd just like to point out that there a lot of people, in real life, who have lots of sex with lots of different people with and without contraceptives and somehow they manage not to have children.

My wife and I were married for 6 years before conceiving a child, and not for lack of trying.

 

I thought it was common knowledge Anakin sexed Mara up.

Who's been here long enough to remember the large topic regarding this?

 

FireJade : There's also something called abstinence. Who's to say Luke doesn't believe in marriage before sex? Akanah is the only confirmed counterexample,

I wouldn't even say that Akanah was a "confirmed counterexample". Although Luke and Akanah spent the night in the same bunk comforting one another, there is no confirmation that they actually had sex. In Tyrant's Test, it says:

Loneliness, grief, compassion, and a previously undiscovered hunger for a touch that felt like acceptance had brought them to the brink. But by silent mutual consent, something had been held back. Neither of them had asked for or offered their deepest intimacies. And, unpressured, each had allowed the other to enjoy the novelty of not being alone.

I think this *can* suggest that they didn't have a sexual relationship.

And yes, Ben is Luke's son.

 

Maybe Luke is smarter than your average ghetto dwelling idiot that knows that his spawn could do great damage to the galaxy. He probably uses condoms. Or some other form of male birth control. I think he isn't exactly a player either. He's had a few flings, but nothing serious except for two. And Callista's takeover may have done weird things to to Cray's body. A body with no midichlorians in it.


BTW, Have you noticed Ben looks like Anakin Skywalker? He didn't get that from Mara. He only got her rather accursed hair that is fine on women but for some reason reviled in men.

 

That was my interpretation when I first read it as well, but I feel that the author's opinion (that they did, off-page) is enough for me to see them having sex as the canon interpretation.

 

Better than Anakin's Force pull out method.

 

"A theory has developed among some Star Wars fans that Ben Skywalker's biological father may in fact be Luke's nephew Anakin Solo, who was training as an Apprentice with Luke and Mara at the time, and would have been sixteen at the time of his conception. This is based on a postmodernist interpretation of the novel Balance Point, rather than any clearly explicit indicators in the text: it can (as of this writing) be regarded only as a possible subtext."


http://boards.theforce.net/literature/b10003/21092717/p1

Wow there's some real gems in that thread. Highly recommend reading.

 

Could you be anymore offensive?

 

One day, if GL pushes through in EU his stance that Luke never had children, Benny boy needs to be retconned as Anakin's...

 

Hey I may be off base here but do you happen to be Shelley from that topic NelanisGhost?

 

You know something's awry with a thread when McEwok comes off as the most rational voice in the house...

In all seriousness, this thread should be required reading for anyone who takes some of the Imperial Ewok's crazier theories too seriously. He intentionally reads against the text to come up with these theories. It's more a game in playing with subtexts and subverting the passages than actually believing that, say, Jacen Solo fathered Anakin Skywalker, or that Luke is that last Sith Lord. Long story short, McEwok is excellent at trolling when he wants to. And this is why I fail to take this theory of an impotent Luke and a cheating Mara seriously at all.

Also, I can't ever read Balance Point the same way again.

 

My parents waited six years before having me, after getting married. I look just like my father, so...

...also, I can't imagine pregnancy scares have anything to do with the various galactic crises, so they're probably not mentioned. Also, Luke and Leia were conceived *during* a war. Also...seriously? This is an actual thread?

 

Who?

I don't prefer red headed men. I think Ewan is attractive, but mostly not overall.... IMHO.....

I really have never cared for Ben's character. The way he was written in DNT was pretty bad.

 

Just for fun ... if Luke was Anakin Solo's father which of course Mara Jade didn't know this argument gets weaker. In, IIRC, Crystal Star Luke is changing his looks with the force. He could have done before while Han was off with Chewbacca. And Luke and Leia move away from each other after Anakin's death.

 

I honestly can't believe this thread is still running?

But then we all know that witches are made of wood and weight as much as a duck...

Non excisting logics aside... In a scene in Shield of Lies Akanah points out that Luke "could have a hundred children by now. A thousand.

L: That's crazy.

A: No - that's the simple truth. There are different rules for heroes and royalty, and you're seen as a little of both. You can't be unaware of that.

L: I don't know how to be a father to one child, much less a thousand.

A: You wouldn't need to know. Their mothers wouldn't expect it. The would be grateful for the gift.

L (firmly): I'd expect it of me." (p. 160)

I think that shows pretty clearly Luke's responsible approach to the matter.

Now, still apart from the "logics" here, let's take a look at those myriad of potential mothers.

Camie - no go. We know from Union that Luke hadn't even kissed a girl before he came to the Rebellion
Leia - we-ell...
Domina Tagge - nope - heavy flirting only
Tanith Shira - a goodbuy kiss only
Shira Brie - one kiss only
Dena Tredway - might have been something there - on the other hand we've not seen her in the EU since, so we've got neither prof of sex nor lack of child
Dani - kisses only, Luke keeps her at bay
Gaeriel - one kiss only
Mary - ditto
Alex Winger - a goodbuy kiss only
Frija - not even a kiss (besides she was a HR droid)
Jem Ysanna - kisses only, they go to separate quarters
Teneniel Jo - nothing, Luke turns her down
Callista - here we can talk about an actual relationship. Still, in Darksaber it's mentioned that they've been talking about getting children one day - so while we can assume they have sex, we don't see a hint of a problem there - on the contrary there's indication they're using birth control.
Akanah - they probably have sex. But, as Firejade points out, there's no proof there isn't a child either

Now, exactly what in this makes Luke sterile or impotent?

The question isn't controversial - I could easily see it give rise to great fanfiction - it's just completely far out. Sorry

 

Kataja, apart from Leia, your one kisses onlys are one kisses only 'on screen'. Luke and his girlfriends could have snuck off somewhere while 'off screen'.

 

There was a bit more than that, if the Dark Empire II audio drama is to be believed...

EDIT: Anyway, Force Protection. Thread over.

 

DARTH MU - Naturally. But when interpreting in a serious mood, you have to rely to what's shown. Otherwise ANYTHING could happen off screen. We could have a "Why does Han Solo like to wear women's clothing" thread? f.ex.

And yes, sex is obviously so tabu in SW that nothing can be shown - but you still have the concrete text indicating where the characters are emotionally. I've read all the scenes with these gals except Alex Winger - and except that Audio Drama Rogue_Follower mentions - and to me, they all indicate what I've said above. And it's not because I hope for it to be that way - on the contrary, I've always thought Luke should have some fun.


Rogue_Follower - That's interesting - in the comic it's only pointed out that L&Yem go to separate quarters. What exactly is said in the AD?

 

Yeah well Luke's a very self contradicting fellow. He's constantly involved in war although his religious/spiritual philosophy is completely based in peace and love.

How many times has a situation comes up where a dude says he'd act in a certain way when a certain situation would come up only for them to act the opposite when time comes? Talk is cheap.

 

It's bit of dialog unique to the audio drama, right after Luke and Jem kiss on the Jedi Explorer, during the approach to Pinnacle Base.

From TFN's Dark Empire II audio drama transcript [Word Document]:

KAM: Luke!! LUKE!!!

LUKE: I'm here, Kam.

KAM: Oh. You disappeared on me for a while there. Thought I was gonna have to pilot the Jedi Explorer into Pinnacle Base myself.

LUKE: Sorry, Kam. Jem and I were, uh....

KAM: (chuckles) Yeah, spare me the details, Luke. You're not the type to kiss and tell anyway.

LUKE: (audibly red-faced) Thanks. Disengaging hyperdrive now.

Reading and listening to it again, it's not as suggestive as I had recalled. So, the ambiguity remains.

Also, off-topic, terrible pickup lines must run in the Skywalker family.

LUKE: Yes... You know, I'm getting a strange feeling like I know you from before... almost as if I've known you for thousands of years.

 

Clearly Luke is actually ancient.