Skeleton Crew Jod Na Nawood

I remember OT fans being a bunch etlist when it came to what a jedi should be

 

OT fans generally hadn't expected that being a Jedi meant you had to renounce all romantic relationships, and also be taken away from your parents at infancy and never allowed to contact them again. Stuff like that is extremely unhealthy behavior - and, like I said, arguably verging on the cultlike.

To get back to Jod, he's clearly warping stuff about the Jedi philosophy to suit his own damaged self and cynical outlook on life. But in doing so, he does echo some of the worst excesses of Lucas' own writing of the Jedi on occasion.

I'm thinking particularly of the ending of ESB, where Lucas thought Luke should return to Yoda immediately after the film's end. Because he thought Yoda was right earlier to say that Luke should stay on Dagobah and continue training, even if his friends died at the hands of the Empire. But Irvin Kershner thought this was callous and unheroic, and argued strongly enough to Lucas that Yoda was wrong that Lucas had to back down. Which is why Luke commits again to rescuing Han at the end of ESB, and why that plot point is the first act of ROTJ.

 

Some now are already 15

 

Well the irony is that it didn't really work out well for Luke when he did try and help his friends. he ended up being the one who needed help in the end while his friends escaped. But then Vader was trying to get Luke there, so it was part of Vaders plan.

Luke saving Han in ROTJ isn't really the same thing. Although it did take Luke and Co a few years to save Han

I mean the irony there, which Lucas was getting at, is that unhealthy behavior is fear, anger and obsession. Stuff that attachment can potentially bring. While anyone whose trained against it doesn't have to fear any weakness.

Its like holding your breath underwater. is it healthy to hold your breath underwater? No, by nature we have to breath or we die. But there are people who can learn to hold their breaths for very long periods. Which could be beneficial for survival. I couldn't do that, but then i haven't been trained to do it. Id probably need to breath and drown after 10 seconds.

Sometimes survival may require training past certain weakness's. Doesn't make you lesser because of it. Infact it might make you more.

 

Oh good, let's have this argument again. We're sure to solve it to everyone's satisfaction this time.

 

The point was only about a misreading of what the Jedi meant by “attachment.” To me the PT Jedi were colossal bores delivering bad lines. So I wasn’t too impressed by them. But their approach to attachments was about discouraging possessive relationships, not squashing love or compassion.

 

With all due respect to the maker, I think the underlying issue is that George simply isn’t the best screenwriter.
As others have already pointed out, the whole ‘no-attachments” thing is frequently misunderstood by fans as being a call to emotional repression, when it actually means not clinging to objects, people ect. in a way that is unhealthy. This philosophy is found in real life belief systems like Buddhism and Stoicism.

The problem is that Lucas, not being that great of a writer, unintentionally presents these philosophies in a way that makes them seem closer to the former than the latter.
If he didn’t want the audience to think Anakin’s separation from his mother is cruel, Lucas could (for instance) simply have had all new Jedi recruits be young adults (lets say 16-18), this way it would be much more clear that Anakin’s downfall is his inability to move on from the past, not childhood trauma via speciation anxiety.
Additionally, it might have also been a good idea to end TPM with Shmi living comfortably on a safe planet like Naboo or Alderan, rather than having the Jedi simply depart with her (extremely powerful) son, abandoning her to suffer poverty and indignity as a slave in the outer-rim. This is the other problem with the manner in which Lucas presents non-attachment, because audience already knows Tatooine is dangerous we perceive Anakin’s fears over his nightmares in AOTC as perfectly valid, rather than as the result of unhealthy clinging. If Shmi were somewhere safe this problem wouldn’t exist.

While I personally do find the continual fandom misunderstanding over the Jedi’s non-attachment philosophy rather frustrating at times, I also think it’s worth point out that these ideas aren’t really all that well explained in the actual Star Wars movies that George Lucas wrote and directed himself.
Therefore I conclude it isn’t really surprising there is so much confusion to being with.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

End of rant.

 

Im not sure what you are trying to say with that as its not really separation anxiety thats the issue. Did he miss his mother? probably. But at the same time it was her dying that impacted anakin the most. He could pretty much keep going as long as he felt she was alive and still out there.

I actually don't think its bad writing at all. If you question the Jedi ways i don't think that makes it bad writing. Its just Lucas is a very grey minded person when it comes to life. Its not all unicorns and rainbows.

For example. the Jedi train them young because it helps form their minds mentally to non-attachments. Thats reasonable and is something that does happen in real life. Kids get educated young because their brains are still forming. So the Jedi could train these kids without fear of the dark side. Now does it seem unfair to take kids away from their parents? Maybe. But the Jedi don't force kids away from their parents. The parents have to agree. We don't see Qui-Gon taking anakin away without Shmi agreeing. Presumbaly some parents feeling their kids will go on to do good things as Jedi.

Course the whole idea of Anakin being a slave was likely done so there would be an obstacle to get around before Qui-gon could take Anakin to be trained. And the reason his mother remained on tatooine was likely to a way to say the Jedi are peace keepers who have to respect how the galaxy works. Jedi will try and find a way to help as Qui-Gon did try and negotate Anakins mothers freedom too, but was refused. So if they can't find a solution, then thats it. they won't get their sabers out and start threatening them. Which thats not bad writing. thats just the grey area of the galaxy Lucas was writing for and how he perceived the Jedi's involvement.

But then should the Jedi be above the laws of the galaxy? Would they still be the Jedi?

When Lucas made the non-attachment rule its likely he put a lot of thought into how our emotions work during times of loss or potential threat, and he realised that we ain't in the greatest frame of mind during times of emotional stress. Which again is reasonable even if people don't really want to think about psychology

So i feel like what you may be seeing as bad writing Lucas is seeing as life being fairly tragic in terms of options and just living in general.

 

Exactly. While I agree that parts of Anakin's story could have been handled better, he has to remain relatable for the lesson to have any impact. Otherwise it's just "Wow, this dude freaked out and turned to the dark side over literally nothing." We the audience should hopefully understand that Anakin's reaction is not justified, but we have to understand why he reacts that way. I think Revenge of the Sith does this best— there's no actual guarantee that Padmé will die just because Anakin dreams about it, but we can see how an answer like that wouldn't satisfy Anakin, who has a very difficult time accepting the reality of death, the uncertainty of the future, and the impermanence of all things. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. There's no way of knowing that Padmé would have died in childbirth if Anakin had simply made peace with the possibility (and sought professional medical help instead of trying to hide his relationship,) but it's pretty clear that his actions did contribute pretty heavily to her eventual death in childbirth.

 

I did not in any way think ROTS presented Anakin's turn as either believable or relatable.

 

Well, I did. So…now what?

 

Now we continue on with our lives.

 

No, I demand you two fight to the death for my entertainment.

 

DILLY DILLY!!!!

 

If you insist.