ST Knights Of Ren Discussion Thread

And the acolytes of the beyond seem like some kind of cult/formed religion of some sort.

 

So in the shooting script, in Rey's flashback, it says that the "seven" are fighting the "clan". "The seven" we know now are the Knights of Ren, and the clan is group of 6-12 students of the Jedi, the leader of which we saw get killed by Kylos fiery saber. According to Pablo Hidalgo, the clan has no affiliation with Luke Skywalker.

My theory here is that with the new generation of Jedi, force users were far and in-between. So, clans formed around the force-wielders, with only 1 or 2 of them being force sensitive, and the rest wielding weapons for combat. One day, one of these clans went to the dark side in the name of Ren, and they massacred the others. With Ben's force ability, they wiped them all out.

 

Where did you get the clan was a group of 6-12 jedi students?? i dont remember pablo hidalgo ever saying that or anyoneelse. the guy who got stabbed by kylo was described as a warrior and nothing more.

 

WookieeRage The choice of name is intriguing, and I've wondered about it for quite some time. The name--and the use of it in Kylo's pseudonym--underscore his apparent belief that he is fighting for the good side, and not running around doing evil willy-nilly.

I have wondered who the founder of the Knights of Ren was. Was it Kylo, as part of a delusion that he's bringing order to the universe? Or were they created by Snoke, perhaps, as a tool to help lure young Ben Solo over to his side?

I don't think anything is clear about the KoR, and I think it is actually very strange that they created this whole group, put them right into Kylo Ren's name, and then kept them offscreen entirely except for a tiny moment in the force vision (of the future?). Either the KoR are ridiculously unimportant (so why weren't they cut and replaced with some random Stormtroopers?) or there is something special about them that they are keeping a surprise until future episodes.

 

Here's my theory (currently -- it could change) about the whole matter.

The KOR are probably a gang of misfits (non-FS most likely) that served as his entourage, so to speak. Kylo probably formed it himself -- a small gang of worshipers of some revisionist version of the stories of the old Empire and Darth Vader (and so they wore those costumes like really serious cosplayers). It would serve as a parallel to Neo-Nazi believers who are followers of a distorted version of Nazi history (they also like wearing what their idols used to wear).

What I think is significant is why they're missing from TFA, and I've always believed (though not too strongly, since we have scan evidence) that they're probably all dead. Another possibility I've started to entertain is that they've disbanded. Since there's a lot of parallelism in TFA with the modern phenomena of teenagers leaving their Western homes to fight a holy war in the Middle East, I'm seeing the KOR as a metaphor for this. Maybe Kylo and the KOR were in their teens when we saw them in Rey's vision.

However as we know, Kylo is now 29-30 years old and this is where the KOR's absence seems significant. I'm thinking perhaps his band of misfits had outgrown their teenage-rebellion-slash-holy-war attraction stage and have moved on to other things -- as young misfits eventually do when they grow older and begin to get disenchanted with the extremist/religious movements they'd joined when they were younger and a lot more stupid. Maybe Kylo was screaming at memories of them too when he screamed "Traitor!" to Finn. Maybe Snoke had ordered Kylo to kill those who had abandoned the cause (and thus had he had passed Snoke's previous test -- making Han's killing the test that the "Master of the Knights of Ren" had never faced before).

If the other KOR have moved on to other things (or were killed because of it), why's Kylo still with Snoke? This brings me to the idea (seemingly supported by some revelations about the upcoming making of TFA documentary) that indeed, Kylo was different. Snoke snookered him most likely at a very young age, which is why the lifetime of influence is going to be harder to break, compared to if one had just been seduced by extremist/silly ideas as a teenager. That's why nothing short of Han's murder at his own hands could serve as a catalyst to his possible return.

 

Remember that the KOR pre-date Kylo's involvement with them. He joined them, rather than formed them:

“He is a character who came to the name Kylo Ren when he joined a group called the Knights of Ren,” Abrams says."

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/08/12/star-wars-force-awakens-kylo-ren/2

 

Ah yes, I couldn't recall if I dreamed of that or actually read it. Thanks. So maybe Snoke formed the group -- or maybe they just got together and formed themselves before he joined. Regardless, their absence in TFA is significant, I think.

 

If Snoke did form the KOR and we speculate Leia knew him personally, (possibly allied, or an advisor?) then perhaps the KOR were at one time on the side of Luke/Leia/Good guys?

 

It would be strange if they are never mentioned again.

 

Yes it would, Also very underwhelming... It would be the biggest disappointment for the DS since Darth Maul in the PT, I know he came back in a cartoon but never watched them.

 

You should, it's quite good (after the first season or so, which suffered from "growing pains"). And yeah, it'd be really disappointing/underwhelming to introduce such a potentially interesting/cool concept like the KOR, only to not actually do anything with them.

 

I don't think there's going to be much in this trilogy that will be left a mystery, I just don't see them leaving out the KOR, we will at least get some backstory on them showing just how B.A. they are/were. There's just so much potential in their story IMO. DS users that don't use lightsabers, I always thought of a lightsaber as a sort of plot crutch if the person with the lightsaber is fighting someone w/o a lightsaber. I would be like "That guy has no lightsaber, oh that guy's dead...."

Thrawn082
I'll have to check them out. Need something to watch while waiting for VIII

 

"Production identified that warrior as 'clan leader'."

https://twitter.com/pablohidalgo/status/682962831998730241

During the jedi initiative, a clan of Jedi younglings consisted of 6-12 younglings, like the bear clan. I'm assuming that the clan we saw in the flashback was a derivative of these Jedi clans, considering their helmets look very similar.

 

Pablo has also said that the "clan slaughter" is different from the "Jedi slaughter." Not the same event.

 

Although the actor himself said he was Knight of Ren. So that's about as clear as mud...

 

Source please? Can't find him saying that anywhere.

EDIT:

I looked to the credits to see what he was listed as and....



Mind=blown. So if Pablo is to be trusted, he's BOTH a clan leader and a Knight of Ren. Maybe the previous "leader" of the Knights of Ren? No idea what he could be.

 

From here: https://twitter.com/MarkStanley12/status/685879413737652225

Somebody earlier in this thread also confirmed that he's listed as KoR in the film credits.

 

After googling for "clan leader", I came across an interesting MSW leak from October of last year, that gives more specific information about what the flashback was originally intended to be, and who this "clan leader" really is.

• Maz leads the heroes (Han, Finn, and Rey) down a staircase into the catacombs of her castle, while she explains who Luke was, retelling the events of the original trilogy
• When they enter the chamber in the catacombs, Maz continues the story and it goes to flashbacks (the rest of what follows takes place in flashbacks)
• Luke returns to his academy and everyone is dead, they have been slaughtered
• we then see the outside shot of Luke saying goodbye to R2 from the trailers
  
  ​
• It appears it was the Knights of Ren who did this
• Maz explains that Luke retreats into private life
• We then see Naka's hand picks up the lightsaber (which is a reprise of what we saw at the beginning of the film), we then see him turn it on in his house and accidentally sets it on fire. He runs away and then has to go back to get the lightsaber
• Naka sells the Saber to a trader for next to nothing
• The Clan is lead by a prosperous rich man
• The Knights of Ren have raided the Clan before
• The Clan leader goes to the trader and buys the saber to defend against the Knights of Ren
• The Clan fights the Knights of Ren and loses
• Rey and her parents were part of the Clan, but they escape the attack
• Shot from the trailer is the Knights of Ren after having slaughtered the Clan
  
  ​
• Kylo sees Rey during the attack
• Kylo gets the Saber, but Maz steals it
• The family gets away and drops Rey off on Jakku and have never gone back for her

From this, I still don't see how he would be related to the KoR in any way.

 

So a Knight of Ren,Kylo,skewers another Knight of Ren.Maybe the KoR were divided between the good ones,like the Jedi and the bad ones like the Sith.My guess is that civil war occurred between the KoR due to Kylo Ren's affiliation with Snoke.Intriguing...


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Or Kylo killed him in order to usurp leadership (that's a very DS thing to do).

 

Oddly enough, this was sort of my theory regarding her parentage...but I don't think the timeline works....hmm.

 

And if Snoke, the dude that possibly made the KOR accepts the fact that Kylo kills their leader to become their leader, maybe Snoke is unfortunately more affiliated with the ideals of the sith than I originally thought.

 

Hmmm. Given that production names are sometimes a little tricksy to keep certain things quiet, I suspect Pablo might obfuscating on this one and he is purely a KoR.

 

He wasn't wearing a KOR style uniform (no mask, cape like animal hair or planet fibers), so he probably really was "clan leader" at the moment of his death. Very likely he used to be KOR. She's Rey's Dad I tell you!!!

 

That could give everything some depth RobbyV, truly... BUT! That would also make sense for the people who think Rey was dropped off on Jakku by Kylo (personally I don't), but that makes it more viable in my opinion