Kreia - Neither Jedi nor Sith (KOTOR II Spoilers)

Kreia is perhaps the grayest character in Star Wars history. She would often chastise the Jedi Exile for supporting a weak or troubled person, explaining that they need to step up and solve their own problems, otherwise they may expect someone to always help them and they will never develop their independence. She was once a Jedi, but was cast out of the Order. She became a Sith, but was betrayed by that Order. She concluded that the Force was an entity that enjoyed manipulating all things, and that the ideal universe would be one in which the Force did not exist. While her plan to destroy the Force failed, she believed that the Jedi Exile's existence proved her theory that to willingly cast aside the Force made one a stronger individual and a master of one's own destiny.

What are we to make of Kreia? Are there any other characters who share her views of the Force and the universe? Most of what she taught seemed correct, and she didn't affiliate herself with either the light or dark side. Was Kreia perhaps one of the wisest, if not the wisest, character in Star Wars history?

 

i think it ceases to become a spoiler when i game has been out for 5 years. Or however long. Vergere is like her from the EU.

 

You could probably use the Index and post about it here.

 

Kreia. Not completely a Jedi and not completely a Sith, but she is completely a bitch.

 

I think she should be categorized as a Sith Lord. She claims that she's neither, but if your only goal is to wipe out the Jedi Order and the all of the Sith, you're a Sith Lord in the making.

 

I'd say she's a Sith as well. She wants to destroy the Jedi, is a Darth, and is driven largely by hate and vengeance. The question about her wisdom is an interesting one. I personally, never found her to be all that wise given that her entire world view is based on a delusion(that the Force as a malevolent deity.) I've heard many people refer to her as wise, but I think it's more that she erected a mystique around herself which gives her the appearance of wisdom.

 

I have a theory that when summer comes along people play KOTOR and therefore post about it

 

Actually, I wouldn't say that Kreia was that delusional....what she believes does make some amount of sense. I mean all those Jedi Masters are always talking about will of the Force this, will of the Force that, so I'm a little surprised that it took so long for them to come up with a character that decided to go "**** THAT".

The whole game literally revolves around Kreia. Among your party members, she's the one that stands out, even above and beyond the returning characters HK-47 and Canderous. Among the villains, she's also the one that stands out. And finally, when you get to the very end of the game and find out why she went through all the trouble with her convoluted plans involving you, the reason she gives makes her stand out from almost all Star Wars characters.

 

I strongly support your theory. I'm about to beat Kotor 1 and then I'm moving onto 2

As far as Kreia goes, She is just as much a Jedi as she is a Sith, I wouldn't classify her as a Sith lord. ""Sith" is a title, yes, but like you, the title is not who I am. It is not what I believe." For her the Sith and the Jedi alike are just tools, and she uses her knowledge to do what she wants most, to destroy the force. She uses the dark side and ancient Sith secrets, yes, but she cast that title aside when it no longer had any use for her, just as he did the title of Jedi.

 

If Obi-Wan is anything to go by, the Jedi know that "Will of the Force" is simply their way of describing something that they don't fully understand. Kreia however misses the phrase's metaphorical nature entirely and seems to believe it has an intelligence. I do agree that she's a great character. I just don't think that she's any where near as wise as she thinks she is.

 

Kreia is what Luke would have become had he killed Vader. What drives her to hate the Force is the fact that she keeps losing her apprentices, her children, to war and the dark side. Her problem is that she cannot bear to let go. As disparaging as she is, Kreia loves Sion just as much as she loves Revan and comes to love the Exile. I find her a fascinating character because she is the ultimate expression of a core value of the Jedi- the sanctity of all life.

 

Huh, that's a really interesting take on Kreia that I've never heard before.

 

Interesting. I still think she is more Sith then anything else, after all she trained some of the worst/best (depending how you look at it) Sith in th timeline the gams set in.

I've been considering playing KOTOR and KOTOR 2 again, been getting an itch to play them even though I've completed them loads lol.

Cant wait for TFU to come out.
Anyone know if they plan to bring our a KOTOR 3?

 

The only thing I know about close to KOTOR 3 is the new MMO which is apparently going to be called Star Wars: The Old Republic. That's still in such an early stage that there's no release date though.

 

making it a MMORPG is amazingly stupid. there's no way to tell the story and wrap it up. then there's the minor detail that it's not going to be accessible to anywhere near the same number of people. which i am NOT pleased with.

:snoopy

 

My guess is that's why it's not actually KOTOR 3.

 

kreia's love for the exile led to her redemption.

wookiepedia says kreia was redeemed.

 

Huh, I don't remember anything suggesting she was redeemed.

 

Neither do I. Kreia died in the end killed by the Exile to stop her killing or rather destroying the Force itself, she was Sith to the core, whether she knew it or not.

There was no way around that storyline.

 

But during the game, before her true motives were revealed that WERE sith to the core, her berating you to help innocent people and her berating you for needless killing, that is pretty much the neutral side of the force, neither jedi nor sith(or dark jedi if you will). Thats why i loved kreia as a character. Her teachings really surpass jedi/sith teachings.

 

Yeah her teachings were a bit on the fence side of things, she was a goood character though, no argument there.

Hard to please though if you helped one person she'd give you a lecture on how they need to solve their own problems etc, however if you went back and done the sme bit again with the same character but not help them this time, more often then not you'd get a lecture exactly the opposite to the one you just got.

A bit annoying at times, totally undecisive.

 

Without getting too...political I would say Kreia resembles some of the beliefs we see in the world today.

 

No... no she wasn't. First off, you are erroneously confusing Sith with Dark Side. Sith is a belief, a group who's whole purpose is to gain power. She is not Sith because that is not her goal. She wants to destroy the force. And Sith with half a mind would not want to destroy the source of their power. Now, when you correct yourself and say that Kreia was still under the influence of the Dark Side... well... yes. Yes she was. But it hadn't consumed her, she was almost completely neutral, Dark Side, Light Side, they were merely tools that she used to attain her goal, which was, in turn, killing the force.

And also, just because Kreia was kills does not mean she was foiled. The Exile had to kill her, it was the way of things, but that did not mean she failed. She had passed her teachings on to the Exile, and as long as the Exile lives, the force will never be fully healed.

 

This.

 

She's in the Sith chapter in the new KOTOR source book.