ST Kylo Ren/Adam Driver Discussion Thread

The biggest Finn erasure from TPTB to me is when they go endlessly on about how Rey and Kylo can relate to each other because the other person is the only one who knows what it's liked to be abandoned and lonely throughout their childhoods. Because it's not as if, you know, Finn whose childhood traumas are much more similar to Rey's (Kylo's childhood has as much in common with Rey as Prince Harry does with an orphan born into poverty in a 3rd world country) isn't RIGHT THERE.

 

And here we have the secret origin of Darth Millicent! It was Luke's fault.

 

Great parents can have terrible kids. We see it in daily life. Parent with the best of intention succumbing to peer pressure. Parents have a lot of influence but not ALL the influence. There is a saying that 'it takes a village to raise a child."
From the little research I know, grandparents do influence their grandchildren's genetics a lot. Often more than parents. Traits skipping a generation is not an unknown phenomenon.

As for blood being a thicker bond than anything: there are many people who grow up without ever knowing their blood relatives. Depending onthe treatment of their family, children can also form strong bonds/attachments with outsiders. I am inclined to go with the professionals and go with the caretaker bond: children will get attached to those who will provide them with stability.That's not always the parents. I get to read enough child protection reports to know this for a fact.

 

Haha, that I have to disagree with, unfortunately. You make great points but to me their chemistry felt fake throughout the 3 movies and I found Finn almost as annoying as JarJar Binks. His story was as much a mess as almost anyone else's in the ST but he did come into his own by part 3 by which he magically developed Force sensitivity.

I agree that the chemistry between Ben and Rey wasn't immediately obvious to many. With some of my friends we did see it coming from TFA. The Force Bridge just made that suspicion stronger. But then that's our take. We all take something different away from the movies.

 

I see your grudge and it's valid. But say, if I have a childhood trauma, I meet someone similar and make a connection with them, and then meet Person 2 with a similar background, do I have to make a connection with them too in a simiar vein? Some people fall in love, some people remain friends, some just exist outside these circles.

 

Latest issue of Rise of Kylo Ren shows that Snoke/Palpatine has been literally talking through the force to Ben since he was a child.

 

The backstory that is being revealed in the comics is tragic as hell. Palpatine literally blew up the temple just as Ben was leaving the tent, where he had woken up to an ignited lightsaber. And used it to further turn him against Luke. He quite literally was a voice inside Ben's head since he was a child. How old was he here? A pre-teen?













He's coming off as more of a Bucky than an Anakin.

So of course this mess of a trilogy leaves all this very important information to tertiary material. This should be covered at the very least in a TV show.

 

I wish the voices in your head had been explored more in the film. It was like thrown out in 8 seconds.

 

^ I am taking a wild guess and say they were not explored in the film because this and Soule's tale was not the backstory they originally had in mind. If they had any backstory in mind.

I’m now convinced Charles Soule either just read some Kylo Ren fanfiction or some Tumblr fan account, because he is writing exactly everything that has been fantasized by Kylo stans.

 

When the temple went boom, he was about 24.

 

Everything interesting was tossed out in 8 seconds for TRoS...

It is too sad that this major backstory is just in comics that hardly anyone reads, perhaps if JJ had less boring trio stuff some of this could have been shown onscreen and Ben's redemption would have been that much stronger.

 

I have always been pro-redemption, but the character only sparked my interest in TLJ.

By the end of TROS, I was fully invested. Thanks in no small part to Adam Driver, who did the most with an underwritten story.






(art by @drawingreylo-szikee on tumblr)

 

How can you be sure it was Palpatine?

In the caption you didn't include (before the lightning strike you posted), look how angry Ben is at Luke. My reading is his anger manifested through Ben's raw power and subconscious and struck the Temple with lightning. I could be wrong but "And you didn't choose it" to me refers to it being accidental, but by Ben.

 

Also is issue 2 out already? I thought it was the 14th.

 

It's amazing they've gone this route.

It’s one thing to do a book like Catalyst that alters RO's opening in a cool but minimal and optional fashion, but this is major story changing material in a very niche medium.

I don't see it working the way they expect as comics are harder to obtain. There's been no signposting of its existence and even if there was? No guarantee it'll be followed.

 

Didn't Pablo Hidalgo or someone say some time ago there was a lot more we'd learn about Kylo's story? I guess they decided to open it up after the end of the movies.

I figured after TLJ that some tragic stuff happened & if Snoke could read minds, he'd been in Kylo's mind, but I wish a lot of this stuff had been more covered in the movies.

Sure is messed up how Snoke was doing the equivalent of constantly texting Ben in his head.

 

It's probably Palpatine making Ben believe he did it. Therefore his manipulation is nearly complete.

I think one of the big differences between Ben here and Rey in the ST is despite them both using the darkside in moments of peril, there aren't any real consequences for Rey. She blows up Chewie with force lighting, but it turns out he doesn't actually die. Palps dies before any real consequences can arise.

But if Ben can, or be manipulated into believing he blew up in entire temple and all his friends out of anger, well that's the real heavy stuff, your soul is basically there for the taking at that point.

 

Lol @ Ben hating his name. For some reason, "everyone" expects him to be Obi-Wan? What? How many people even know that he went by the "Ben Kenobi" alias during his exile? And it was just hilarious that he was mad that Han's last name is just a dumb made-up name. So there's something I can finally agree with him on.

You'd think Kylo would be more upset about having to live up to the Skywalkers, his mom and uncle, but that isn't in his name so they had to pick silly reasons for him to hate his actual given name.

 

Interesting.

Im not sure I agree, the comic wasn't completely clear. But the way Ben is in a rage and then the clouds start to form makes me think it was a manifestation of his subconscious desire for revenge. Like at home as a child accidentally knocking things of shelves when angry.
It is just my reading but I am quite convinced thats what is happening there. Only thing Im not sure about is why there is a secondary explosion after the lightning.

On Rey and Kylo's temptation to the dark side; I can definitely see the no consequences factor for Rey in TFA and TLJ but I think they went a more realistic route for her in TROS. She is succumbing to darker emotions at several moments in TROS.

When she is at her closest to actually pledging and becoming Palpatine's new avatar she only pulls herself back to the light when she senses Ben.
I thought it was fitting that when Ben is at his "lightest" Rey was at her darkest moment. Ben running to help her not become like he did is relatively selfless. Especially compared to earlier attempts to turn her himself.
Being the dyad, one, they kind of briefly trade places. Then they share each other's strength.

Rey dies and Ben is shown to have survived, then Ben gives up his life and trades places with her again, dying for Rey to go on living.

Yeah I like the dyad concept so maybe it is my bias.