LOTR-FOTR - NOW DISCUSSING Chapter 28: Gilraen's Memorial*

Feel bad for Billy, but it makes for a great scene. I hope the flies were real too

 

Ch 16 - I love this chapter. The Nazgul gliding into the inn (as the keeper hides behind his podiun) - amazing creepiness. Also love the trick the hobbits pull with the feathers. And kudos to the awesome Strider speech about the Nazgul.

The entire elevenses scene is great too. I love Strider's and the hobbits' reactions to each other. The look on Strider's face when he says they've already had breakfast and Pippin replies with 'We've had one yes, what about second breakfast?' - priceless.

Oh, and did anyone else notice that when Strider's apple strikes Pippin in the head, Pippin looks up in the sky? I've always chuckled at the thought Pippin believed the apple fell out of the air.

CH 17 - Nice addition. I can see why it was cut, but I think it was well done and adds to the story.

Frodo: Who is she? This woman you sing of?
Strider: Tis the Lay of Luthien. The Elf-maiden who gave her love to Beren, a mortal.
Frodo: What happened to her?
Strider: She died.

IMHO Viggo just nails that final line. For me, it just conveys so many levels of how how Strider feels about the story (and it's application to his own situation): it's sad, but not exactly tragic either - it's the inevitable result of Luthien's choice.

 

slightly off-topic, but related: I always heard of the story of Beren and Luthien and, mostly based on this scene, thought it was just a lame song about this oh-so-tragic romance.

Then I read their chapter in the Silmarillion last year - boy, was I wrong. They kick some serious Angmar-ass

 

It's a cool way to work in one of the great things from the books, namely the culture of songs that Tolkien built . . . I can understand that this wasn't a musical, but as a music lover, I get chills at moments like Bilbo singing the Road Goes Ever On as he strolls away from Hobbiton.

And this is a similar moment. An easy cut; but a likeable scene on its own terms.

 

Thank you for all your participation in CBC (Chapter by Chapter). LOTR-FOTR Chapter 18: The Spoiling of Isengard DISCUSSION will be made available 9:20 PM EST. Although the discussion timeframe has passed, you may still discuss this chapter at your convienience. However, we will be moving on to the next chapter.

-Moleman1138

 

Due to the success of the PT and CT CBC discussions, I would like to discuss LOTR: FOTR (The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring ? Extended Edition) chapter by chapter on the DVD. There are 46 chapters to discuss over the next eight months, excluding Chapter 47: Credits and Chapter 48: Official Fan Club Credits*

Each discussion will last 5 days. At the end of 5 days, the following chapter will be posted.

Chapter 18: The Spoiling of Isengard
DISCUSSION: June 25, 2006 ? June 29, 2006
DVD TIME INDEX: 68:47 ? 70:28

Synopsis:
Saruman is inside Orthanc consoling his palantir. Sauron wants his underling to build him an army worthy of Mordor. An Orc enters. Saruman says they have work to do. On the pinnacle of Orthanc, Gandalf wakes up as the forests of Isengard are being destroyed. Saruman does not care if the roots go deep, everything must be put toward the army. END OF CHAPTER

Opinion:
After following the journey of the hobbits and Strider, we wonder what has happened to the wizard. He didn?t show at Bree and Strider has replaced Gandalf as the leader figure to some degree. This chapter ultimately sets up the vengeance of transcendentalism as well as Gandalf?s inability to combat evil at this time, due to the situation.

After the old man duel earlier, you can assume that Saruman is the bad guy and you really didn?t need to delay the inevitable that he was in league with Sauron. This is more seen in Two Towers, but this scene gets the ball rolling as the Uruk-Hai are born. This is the better of the two Isengard scenes in the next few minutes only because it has more of a real feel to it.

At this point in the series we don?t know about the Ents, but it hits you hard in Two Towers when the Ents unleash hell upon the once friend Saruman. Chris Lee does a great job here. He himself is even playing both sides with Sauron. He is in league with Sauron but is infested with greed that he is blinded by his own ambition.

Not a lot of dialogue here, but actions speaks larger than words. The war for Middle-earth has begun. There?s so much we don?t know. No Ents and no Rohan give Saruman one less dimension, but it?ll pay off later. Good chapter.

 

For those who are just joining us or would like to review past discussions:

Chapter 1: Prologue: One Ring to Rule Them All?**
Chapter 2: Concerning Hobbits*
Chapter 3: The Shire**
Chapter 4: Very Old Friends**
Chapter 5: A Long-expected Party**
Chapter 6: Farewell, Dear Bilbo
Chapter 7: Keep It Secret, Keep It Safe
Chapter 8: The Account of Isildur
Chapter 9: At the Green Dragon*
Chapter 10: The Shadow of the Past
Chapter 11: The Passing of the Elves*
Chapter 12: Saruman the White
Chapter 13: A Short Cut to Mushrooms
Chapter 14: Buckleberry Ferry
Chapter 15: At the Sign of the Prancing Pony
Chapter 16: The Nazgul**
Chapter 17: The Midgewater Marshes*
Chapter 18: The Spoiling of Isengard

Don't forget we are still discussing ROTS and HP-TSS in the PT forum and SFF Film and Television forum

 

Good chapter. Saruman's comtempt for nature really shows. Poor Gandalf. The sadness on his face as he realises he cannot stop this from happening. Despite how cool the fight between Gandalf and Saruman was this is more of a favourite scene as it is more story based and gets the ball rolling.

 

This chapter goes right to the heart of Tolkien's writings. How nature is being washed away by the fires of industry. I remember seeing an interview with Christopher Lee explaining this very thing. I think it was on the special features of the DVD.


Jag29

 

Thank you for all your participation in CBC (Chapter by Chapter). LOTR-FOTR Chapter 19: A Knife in the Dark DISCUSSION will be made available 3:10 PM EST. Although the discussion timeframe has passed, you may still discuss this chapter at your convienience. However, we will be moving on to the next chapter.

-Moleman1138

 

Due to the success of the PT and CT CBC discussions, I would like to discuss LOTR: FOTR (The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring ? Extended Edition) chapter by chapter on the DVD. There are 46 chapters to discuss over the next eight months, excluding Chapter 47: Credits and Chapter 48: Official Fan Club Credits*

Each discussion will last 5 days. At the end of 5 days, the following chapter will be posted.

Chapter 19: A Knife in the Dark
DISCUSSION: July 5, 2006 ? July 9, 2006
DVD TIME INDEX: 70:29 ? 75:07

Synopsis:
The hobbits and Strider come to Weathertop and the Watchtower of Amon-Sul. Strider says they will stay the night. He gives them each swords as he has a look around. Later on Frodo is sleeping only to be awoken by his friends who are cooking. Frodo tries to put out the fire. It draws attention. The Nagzul shriek at the base of the tower. The hobbits go to the top of Amon-Sul. The Nazgul enter cornering the hobbits. Sam, Merry and Pippin stand in front of Frodo but it is a futile attempt. Frodo is right in their grasp. He trips backwards and puts on the ring. The Nazgul senses Frodo and stabs him. Frodo takes the ring off as Strider returns battling the Black Riders with flame and sword. He manages to chase them away. Frodo meanwhile is falling into shadow. They are six days from Rivendell. Strider carries Frodo away from Weathertop in need of Elvish assistance. END OF CHAPTER

Opinion:
The shots on Weathertop are absolutely beautiful. The skies are so brooding and beautiful at the same time that they reflect the scene and the later turmoil that takes place at the pinnacle of the tower.

The hobbits receive many weapons in the films. Frodo receives Sting later on and Merry and Pippin receive swords from Galadriel. These are from Aragorn. A plot hole here is where did Aragorn get hobbit sized swords. After Bree there are no warm stops on the way. It?s just wilderness. Regardless, they do show that the hobbits have heart.

Ironically, Frodo?s friends actually cause him pain. Because of gluttony, the Nazgul were able to sense the hobbits location and ultimately stab Frodo. It?s up to Aragorn to protect Frodo. This isn?t the first time and it sure won?t be the last that Aragorn has to do this for Frodo. It?s like a recurring theme in the movies.

The CGI of the shadow world is pretty cool. We got a glimpse of this at Bree, but here we really get to see what the Nazgul look like as does an external environment at night. Here you are pulling the veil off the real world and it isn?t a pretty sight. Visually it?s great. Good chapter.

 

For those who are just joining us or would like to review past discussions:

Chapter 1: Prologue: One Ring to Rule Them All?**
Chapter 2: Concerning Hobbits*
Chapter 3: The Shire**
Chapter 4: Very Old Friends**
Chapter 5: A Long-expected Party**
Chapter 6: Farewell, Dear Bilbo
Chapter 7: Keep It Secret, Keep It Safe
Chapter 8: The Account of Isildur
Chapter 9: At the Green Dragon*
Chapter 10: The Shadow of the Past
Chapter 11: The Passing of the Elves*
Chapter 12: Saruman the White
Chapter 13: A Short Cut to Mushrooms
Chapter 14: Buckleberry Ferry
Chapter 15: At the Sign of the Prancing Pony
Chapter 16: The Nazgul**
Chapter 17: The Midgewater Marshes*
Chapter 18: The Spoiling of Isengard
Chapter 19: A Knife in the Dark

Don't forget we are still discussing ROTS and HP-TSS in the PT forum and SFF Film and Television forum

 

The shadowworld extended sequence is the centerpiece here and it is stunning. Truly stunning.

 

They showed parts of this so much in the trailers (and pictures) and yet it still held up. Since the Nazgul are among the coolest things in the movie(s) anyway, the scene is already exciting. Add to that they are even more menacing now (creeping out of the shadows, drawing swords, advancing on the Hobbits) and it gets a whole other level.


Also, only when Aragorn presents them the mini-swords, did I notice that Tom Bombadil was skipped earlier


and it's a joy for the ears, too. "A Knife in the Dark" (TOS) or "Weathertop" (TCR) are one of the best pieces of FotR, probably of the whole trilogy
and the Nazgul scream is so awesome my two favorites are the one earlier when the Black Rider surprised them (and us) in the woods, and here when the burning one runs off.

 

I love the look on Merry's face when Strider tosses him a sword.

And Weathertop definately met my expectations. I love when Frodo panics and stomps the fire, then the distant shot of weathertop with the shriek of the Nazgul - chilling.

 

I love the way the music works with the visuals here, the chanting, and the way the Nazgul move in; it's ritualistic. Like the servants of the Dark Lord have to conduct some dark rite before taking the Ring...


Aragorn throwing the torch in the Nazgul's face looks silly though.




ttbk

 

i loved the portrayal of the nazgul here. shows how dark and creepy they are. i remember when seeing this for the first time i clutched my chest when frodo gets stabbed

 

Update hopefully today/tomorrow

 

nice. i can't wait to comment about the upcoming chapters

 

Thank you for all your participation in CBC (Chapter by Chapter). LOTR-FOTR Chapter 20: The Caverns of Isengard DISCUSSION will be made available 2:45 PM EST. Although the discussion timeframe has passed, you may still discuss this chapter at your convienience. However, we will be moving on to the next chapter.

-Moleman1138

 

Due to the success of the PT and CT CBC discussions, I would like to discuss LOTR: FOTR (The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring ? Extended Edition) chapter by chapter on the DVD. There are 46 chapters to discuss over the next eight months, excluding Chapter 47: Credits and Chapter 48: Official Fan Club Credits*

Each discussion will last 5 days. At the end of 5 days, the following chapter will be posted.

Chapter 20: The Caverns of Isengard
DISCUSSION: July 25, 2006 ? July 29, 2006
DVD TIME INDEX: 75:08 ? 77:38

Synopsis:
Gandalf is on the pinnacle of Orthanc. A moth comes to him. Gandalf speaks to it and lets it go. We go directly into the caverns of Isengard. Weapons are being forged. Uruk-Hai are being created out of walls. Saruman watches. END OF CHAPTER

Opinion:
This chapter starts off so beautifully with Gandalf and the moth and the music is just amazing. Sadly the moth died the day after this scene. But nevertheless it is still a great opening to watch until we get to Isengard.

I love the Isengard theme and how the camera follows down into the caverns, but honestly the CGI here is pretty bad. It?s obvious green screen. They must have run out of money or something because it doesn?t measure up to the cavern scene in Two Towers. The swooping and everything has potential only if the CGI would have been better executed.

The forging of the weapons is pretty cool as it prepares you for the war early on in the trilogy. These scenes will be reused in Two Towers I think in the first Isengard scenes at the beginning of the movie. The birth of Uruk-Hai is a mixed subject. It?s pretty cool at first but then it just loses it with the last few Uruks.

This is the last time we see Saruman until the flashback at Rivendell. It?s a good holdover scene for the character and it?s without question that he is not to be taken lightly even though he is the lesser of two evils.

 

For those who are just joining us or would like to review past discussions:

Chapter 1: Prologue: One Ring to Rule Them All?**
Chapter 2: Concerning Hobbits*
Chapter 3: The Shire**
Chapter 4: Very Old Friends**
Chapter 5: A Long-expected Party**
Chapter 6: Farewell, Dear Bilbo
Chapter 7: Keep It Secret, Keep It Safe
Chapter 8: The Account of Isildur
Chapter 9: At the Green Dragon*
Chapter 10: The Shadow of the Past
Chapter 11: The Passing of the Elves*
Chapter 12: Saruman the White
Chapter 13: A Short Cut to Mushrooms
Chapter 14: Buckleberry Ferry
Chapter 15: At the Sign of the Prancing Pony
Chapter 16: The Nazgul**
Chapter 17: The Midgewater Marshes*
Chapter 18: The Spoiling of Isengard
Chapter 19: A Knife in the Dark
Chapter 20: The Caverns of Isengard

Don't forget we are still discussing ROTS and HP-TSS in the PT forum and SFF Film and Television forum

 

I love this scene escpecially the moth and how it figures into ROTK. I liked the introduction of Lurtz who's my favorite orc/uruk in the trilogy, especialy him killing the orc that was overseeing his birth. He's set up as a villian so by the time he's shooting Boromir he's been set up as a vicious baddie. Chris Lee's performance when he just holds up his hand to stop the Orc Commander from helping the one Lurtz is killing is awesome.

 

good chapter. love the scene with Gandalf at the top of the tower but as you said you could tell it was CGI

 

Orthanc didn't show signs of CGI only the caverns. Maybe in a Ultra-EE they could retouch it up.