New Republic Capital Ships - still sorting out the mess... (Fleet Junkies- HO!)

Well, it is practically impossible to keep track of many of Rebellion's ships since most of them were heavily modified. They practically put guns on anything they could find.

Do you know what type of ships took out the ISD at the Jedi Academy Game? (If you did the light side) They looked like MC80's but a bit small. They could not have been MC40 since 3 of them could not have taken an ISD. Plus the ISD died a bit too fast and no fighters from either side were launched. (If I remember correctly)

 

They were probably just misrepresentations of MC80s.

 

Remember that all Mon Cal cruisers of the MC-80, MC-80a, and MC-80b variant were all different designs. It was not until the MC-90 that we see some degree of standardization in Star Cruiser design.

Of course, the first Mon Cal warship that was built as an identical line was the Mediator class battlecruiser.

--Adm. Nick

 

That's completely untrue; there were over a dozen cruisers at Endor, and they only belonged to one of three distinct types.

 

The vessels in question:

http://www.theforce.net/swtc/Pix/laserdisk/sw6/h1side02.jpg

-The supposed Y-Head is in the top right.
-The Mon Cal vessel... might just fit being an MC80a ( http://www.theforce.net/swtc/Pix/books/weg/rasbmc80a1.gif a WEG Pic)
- The Dread-like vessel is the closest to the center
-And what is below the Falcon, is it a Gallofree?

 

Same pic twice; and the MC80a, not to mention being an invention of WEG and did not exist when ROTJ was filmed, in-universe, it is a post-ROTJ vessel.

No dice.

 

L_D_B: That's completely untrue; there were over a dozen cruisers at Endor, and they only belonged to one of three distinct types.

If you're meaning Mon Cals, then I guess I basically agree with you...

Of the ships we see, there's Home One, and perhaps half a dozen ships (minimum?) representing two variants of what WEG would call an MC80, one with wings, and one without... these lack the large hangars that WEG says that the typical MC80 has - and Home One doesn't have space for all those fighters, either...

Then there are, IIRC, two WEG-derived versions that have more ostentatiously different wings, but the same basic bow-keel-stern configuration...

We've already had to retconn half of what we thought we knew about the Mon Cals as slightly skewed Reb propaganda... should we rephrase "unique works of art" to "built to an adaptable modular design, similar to that employed by the Empire"?

Not that I'm knocking the squids, of course - they make damn good ships, as fictional tech goes...

- The Imperial Ewok

 

Lord_Darth_Bob:

Well, going by what we see in the movies, I totally agree with you.

Of course, as you are no doubt aware, the powers at be over at WEG decided that each Mon Cal cruiser was unique. Now, obviously, going by what we see at Endor there are three distinct types- the Home One style, the winged Liberty style and the wingless cruiser that Dr. Saxton first brought to everyones attention.

Now, the only way I can see that we can try to reconcile these two ideas is to say that the Mon Cal cruiser types at Endor were almost entirely identical, but that smaller features were unique, like arrangement of bumps and blisters. Obviously this is not true in the sense that three were only three models that were built and shot in the movies, but I suppose we could just say that the cruisers in the background were slightly different.

In fact, IIRC, Saxton came up with a similar theory. Been awhile since I viewed his Mon Cal pages, but I think that is were I first got this idea.

Granted this is just a theory of mine. I just throw it out there in hopes of trying to kludge the two concepts together in order to make a workable idea.

BTW, while I do not always see eye to eye with some of Saxton's views, he has a absolutely amazing section on Warships of the Mon Calamari. I enjoy it so much that I have even emailed him in the past telling him how well done it was.

ThrawnMcEwok:

Its true that Mon Cal history has changed thanks to the Clone Wars and Episode III, but I think that on the whole the vast majority is still ok with a little retconning. Basically we now know that the Calamari became isolationist after the Clone Wars until the Empire came in and invaded their world. After that, all the history is the same.

As to the Mon Cals warships, you will here no argument from me about them being damn fine warships. IMO, I happen to find them amongst the best warships in Star Wars and one of the best looking.

--Adm. Nick

 

Sorry about the links, fixed them.

L_D_B

I realize that WEG released the MC80a post-ROTJ. But by the same token, when did we learn the MC80 was infact an MC80? Was it an original in-house name? Or was it coined by another source?

If the MC80 and MC80a were both WEG terms, the background vessel just might be a MC80a. And of course, any discrepencies when compared with the picture I provided are obviously due to the nonstandardized Mon Cal designs .

 

If only the blisters are different, they still belong to the same design and class; modern warships have more differences than that between vessels.

And the MC80a still must be a post-Endor design according to WEG, and it only has meaning pertaining to WEG and post-WEG. Its not in the film.

-Warning: Shameless Plug-

Read my fanfic: The Eve of a New Order

Definitely goodness for war and fleet junkiees; the early starfleet from a Rational Canonist perspective (as opposed to the self-styled "Traditionalists").

 

A few more - the Toff flagship Merriweather, the YV domain worldship and seedship, the TaggeCorp Modular Star Hauler (if you have the Star Galleon, you ought to have it, too), the Zorba's Express, and, um, the Moffship...


174. Merriweather-class Flagship, Tof Empire
175. Moffship, KDY (???)

Let's discuss the others. First, some more info on the Zorba's Express, is it really a warship, or just a luxury cruiser/yacht? Second, why would I include the Modular Star Hauler, it is just a transport? Star Galleons actually serve a dual role as transports and capital ships, if I understand the word "galleon" correctly (feel free to correct).

I am pretty sure the worldship and seedcship are transport vessels, not capital ships or starfighter carriers.

 

Saxton quoted the author of The Dark Empire Sourcebook as saying the following:

....the modular taskforce ship is smaller than a destroyer and as such doesn't qualify as a cruiser, but the name "Modular Taskforce Cruiser" is the copyrighted and trademarked brand name for the ship (which would have been a mainstay of the CSA [Corporate Sector Authority] picket fleet in my unpublished materials for WEG) and as such isn't a cruiser per se, but is a cargo ship technically (and as such is scaled for House of Tagge internal military fleet protocols as a cruiser, but not in Imperial terms).

 

Senator Cilghal: What about the Chiss corvette in FHII? (the one Irolia was on)

 

Good list, Cilghal.

This ragtag:
[image=http://www20.brinkster.com/pariahpress/ragtags/chron4.JPG]

Bears uncanny resemblence to this:
[image=http://www.cswu.cz/swgames/forcecom/units/shot20.jpg]

The Rusty Eagle, a troop transporter from the game Force Commander (when taking off it reverts to a vertical position, such as in the picture).

Could these in fact be the same ship?

 

well, if it is used in a PICKET fleet that would indicate a military function, so we'll add it.

We can add the Chiss crv, and the CEDF gunship (or gunboat?) that Thrawn commanded when he took out Palpatine's exploratory fleet.

 

TAM ELGRIN: Thank you for your kind words.

Well, I may have to retract that ISD III, if I can't find the quote I'm thinking of. All EGV actually said was that in addition to the Mark I and Mark II ISDs, there were numerous mission-specific ISD variants. I wonder if these might include the two mysterious Star Destroyers in ROTJ? Or some of the Sark Empire and other Comics ships?

According to Rogue Planet, the converted HKD cargo hauler Rim Merchant Einem, used as Tarkin's flagship, is larger than the heavy munitions cruiser Admiral Horvin (Sienar's flagship) but smaller than the Lucrehulk. The Einem is similar in design and appearance to the Lucrehulk, just scaled down. If it is smaller than the Lucrehulk BATTLESHIP, and larger than the heavy munitions CRUISER, I suggest it should be referred to as the Trade Federation Battlecruiser. ?

The swrpgnetwork stats for the heavy munitions cruiser are wrong, as they list the ship as LARGER than a Lucrehulk.

The book also indicates that neither type of vessel would be a match for a Dreadnaught-class cruiser in a fight.

BTW, does anyone know what type of ship Thrawn commanded when he destroyed Palpatine's taskforce that Palpatine sent to destroy Outbound Flight? Wasn't it a Chiss Gunship or Gunboat?

Concerning the Sabaoth Destroyer: the art from the JEDI STARFIGHTER website, which can also be found on swrpgnetwork.com, shows a picture of the Sabaoth Destroyer drawn to scale with an AAT-1 tank. Using the official length of the AAT-1, I cross-multiplied and calculate the Sabaoth Destroyer to be 547.2188 metres long. Seems about the right size for a destroyer. This also provides a rare example of a DESTROYER as opposed to a STAR DESTROYER.

 

Additions: Y-Head Corvette, Merriweather, Ishori Warship, Modular Taskforce Cruiser, Moffship, Chiss Corvette, Chiss Gunship, Corellian Light Cruiser from Rogue Planet (said to serve as escorts for Dreadnaught-class, I hope these aren't just the Consular-class!), Kalla's Stanchion-type Carrier
Subtraction: ISD Mk III
Change: Changed "TF modified cargo hauler" to "TF converted cargo hauler," the exact term used in Rogue Planet

89lc Akorec Strike Cruiser, Scillal Designs
A-vek Iiluunu, YV
Acclamator Troopship, RHE
Adz Patrol Destroyer
Agave Picket, REC
Alderaanian War Frigate [ie, Another Chance], ARE
Allegiance Star Cruiser, KDY
Aramadia "Thrusthip" Patrol Destroyer, Nazfar
Aramand System Cruiser III, Aramandi
Assassin Corvette, CEC
Bakura Destroyer, Bakuran
Battle Dragon, Olanjii/Charubah
Battle Horn Bulk Cruiser, RSD
Bayonet Light Cruiser, SFS
Belarus Medium Cruiser, Loronar
Beta Cruiser, Hapes Consortium
Black Hole Dreadnaught, Ugor Salvage Company
Blackhawk Destroyer
Bothan Assault Carrier, Bothan
Buccaneer Corvette, CEC
Bulwark Battlecruiser, TGMI
Cal Battleship, Kumauri
Carrack Light Cruiser, DMC
CC-7700 Frigate, CEC
CC-9600 Frigate, CEC
Chiss Corvette, Chiss Empire
Chiss Gunship, Chiss Empire
Chuun M'arh, YV
Class 1000 Cruiser, KDY
Class II Frigate, RHE
Class C Frigate, KDY
Corellian Light Cruiser, CEC
Corona Line Frigate, KDY
CR90 Corvette, CEC
Cruiser Carrier [modified Quasar Fire], SoroSuub
Crusader XX-777 Droid Frigate, CEC/Loronar
Dauntless Cruiser, Mon Cal?
Defender Assault Carrier, REC
Desolate Flagship, Charon
Dimel Attack Ship, Ulig Abaha Ltd.
Discril Attack Cruiser, Daupherm
Dovin Basal Launcher, YV
DP20 Gunship, CEC
Dragon Heavy Star Cruiser [Dragon Mag--not canon], KDY
Dreadnaught Heavy Cruiser, RSD
Eclipse Mark I Star Dreadnought, KDY
Eclipse Mark II Star Dreadnought, KDY
EF76B Nebulon-B Frigate, KDY
EF76B-2 Nebulon B-2 Frigate, KDY
Endar Spire-type Republic Starship
Endurance Fleet Carrier, REC
Enforcer One type Dreadnaught, CGS
Enforcer Picket Cruiser, SFS/KDY
Executor Mark I Star Dreadnought, KDY
Executor Mark II Star Dreadnought, KDY
Eye of Palpatine Superdreadnought, IDMR
Geonosian Corvette, HPTSC
Geonosian Dreadnaught, HPTSC
Grey Damsel-type Star Cruiser, Mon Cal
Hapes Nova Battlecruiser, Hapes Consortium
Hex Deployer
Home One-type Star Cruiser, Mon Cal
Hornet Carrier, SoroSuub
I'Friil Ma-Nat, YV
Immobilizer-418 Interdictor Heavy Cruiser, SFS
Immobilizer-418A Interdictor Heavy Cruiser, SFS
Imperial Assault Frigate
Imperial Communications Star Destroyer, KDY
Imperial Customs Corvette, RSD
Imperial Escort Carrier, KDY
Imperial Interdictor Star Destroyer, KDY
Imperial Mark I Star Destroyer, KDY
Imperial Mark II Star Destroyer, KDY
Imperial Research Carrier, SFS
Invincible Dreadnaught, RSD/Vaufthau Shipyards Ltd.
IPV-1 Patrol Craft, SFS
IPV/4 Patrol Craft, SFS
IPV/h Patrol Craft, SFS
IR-3F Patrol Craft, SFS
IrizMark-8 Sentinel Military Cruiser, Koensayr
Ishori Warship, Ishori Confederation
Iskalloni Frigate, Iskalloni
Kalla's Stanchion Carrier, KDY
Kaloth Battlecruiser
Kor Chokk, YV
Kruk Battle-wagon
Lancer Frigate, KDY
Leresen Warship, Leresai
Leviathan Indictor
Lianna Corvette, Santhe/Sienar Fleet Technologies
Liberator Cruiser, SoroSuub
Liftwing Carrier
Lwhekk Heavy Cruiser, Ssi-Ruuvi Imperium
Majestic Heavy Cruiser, REC
Mandator Star Dreadnought, KDY
Mansk Light Escort Frigate, Tallaani Shipyards
Marauder Corvette, RSS
Matalok, YV
MC40a Light Cruiser, Mon Cal
MC80 Star Cruiser, Mon Cal
MC80 Winged Star Cruiser, Mon Cal
MC80A Star Cruiser, Mon Cal
MC80B Star Cruiser, Mon Cal
MC90 Star Cruiser, Mon Cal
Mediator Battlecruiser, Mon Cal
MedStar Medical Frigate
Mere Resistance Cruiser
Merriweather Cruiser, Tof Empire
Miid Ro'ik, YV
Modular Taskforce Cruiser, Tagge Industries Shipyards
Moffship, KDY
Mon Calamari Frigate, Mon Cal
Namana Light Cruiser, Bakuran
Nebula Star Destroyer [aka

 

The ship known as the "Imperial destroyer Harrow" in Battleground Tatooine had the lines of a Star Destroyer, but was much smaller, gilled at the sides, and had a quartet if engines.

Only prob, it seemed to carry a bucket load of TIEs, more than it should have. I'd say it's an Adz patrol destroyer, but it had more than 6 fighters.

 

I'm inclined to believe that the Harrow is related to the VSD somehow, maybe a massive retrofitting was done to a baseline VSD a la the one seen in the Decipher cards.

The two traditional VSD nacelles are in more or less the right place on the Harrow, in spite of the two small ones in between them. Unfortunately, we don't get a good exterior shot of the bridge tower, but it certainly doesn't look like a KDY Star Destroyer bridge.

My guess would be that it was a VSD modified for fewer troops and more fighters.

 

It definitely DOES look like a KDY-style conning tower.

I really wish more people in this thread would familiarize themselves with -realistic- military and engineering facts. You simply cannot redesign a spaceframe so radically; the engines especially cannot be moved without rearranging all the structural hardpoints, which is really a rebuild, not a refit.

 

Tell that to moving planets! Talking moving planets.

 

Maybe Zenoma Sekot is an entity that just happens to resemble a hyperspace going planet?

And then there's Hethrir's worldcraft.

 

Tell that to moving planets! Talking moving planets.

When I first read about Zonama Sekot, I though, "Heck, this guy is joking right?" I can't name anything more absurd, more illogical and more boring thing in SW than a moving, talking, force using organic planet.

 

The Harrow was an interesting looking ship to say the least. It could very well be an extensively modified ship or a unique, one of a kind vessel like the one that is in Jedi Outcast.

The Rogue Squad comics do have several ships in them that are unique. IIRC, their is some extensivly modified variant of the Strike Cruiser in them as well.

--Adm. Nick

 

6000.

Yes, the Harrow is interesting, maybe a KDY spin on the Victory. Or just a Rendili remake.