*OFFICIAL THREAD* RotS Discrepancies, Gaping Plot Holes and Continuity Problems

VERY spoiler Heavy.

OK, is there anyone else who is disappointed by some of the unanswered questions in this movie. Please tell me I'm not being overtly picky. One of the things that upsets me the most in movies are plot holes and crappy writing, which is why I'm so bugged by this. Rots was a great movie in and of itself, but these plot holes left by it s diminishes the appeal of the series as a whole.
Here ya go:

1: in ANH, obi-wan claims to have never seen R2-D2 before. Clearly he has. Why would he lie? It serves no purpose to lie, and since he's a jedi, he shouldn't be lying unless he absolutely has to.

2: in ROTS, only C3P0's memory is wiped. R2's is not. So at any time from that point until ANH, R2, as C3PO's constantly bickering counterpoint, could come back with, "at least I wasn't built by Darth Vader!" as a comeback to any quip from C3PO. The point I'm really making is that it's hard to believe ,since C3PO and R2 are best buds for approx. 20 years before ANH, that R2D2 didn't reveal at least once, C3PO's origin, especially considering how much they bicker. And if it was revealed to C3P0, how come he didn't say to Luke when he first met him, "Skywalker. I've heard that name before. R2, where did I hear that name? Oh that's right! Your father."

3: This is the one that bugs me the most. The jedi who commissioned the clones is only mentioned in AOTC, but we never see him. To me, this is forshadowing for something to happen in the next film. Yet, it doesn't. This guy isn't even mentioned in ROTS. I, for one, would have liked to know more about him and what caused him to commission the clones in the first place. Now, I do not read any of the novels or comics, nor should a fan or movie-goer be required to do so, just to understand the series as a whole. Every plot point should be satisifed by the end of a story, otherwise it's incomplete.

4: What is Uncle Owen's story? Why was this Owen guy chosen to raise Luke.? They say he's Luke's family. In what way is he related? According to back-story i read somwhere, he's Obi-wan's brother. That's not clearly shown in the movie. Is he related to Shmi? It would be nice to know.

5: Speaking of Tattoine, it seems like an obvious choice to look for luke, considering Darth Vader is from there himself. Why did good 'ol Darth overlook this. If I were a mean 'ol lord of the sith, the first thing I would have done is to go tattoine, kill this Owen guy, and take my new Sith trainee son home. Good-bye rebellion. Now, I know Palpatine told him that he killed Padme, and so he may have thought the child died with her. That makes sense. Wait no it doesn't. He's possibly the most powerful jedi/sith ever. Also, he knew exactly who luke was in ESB.

6: Was Anakin really immaculately concepted? That's really, really cheezy if that's the case. Now that's just a matter of opinion, I agree. It would have been nice if it was clearly indicated that Palpatine himself or his ex-master actually created Anakin. But, it's just briefly mentioned that some guy at some time knew how to influence midichlorians. Thats all we get. Yawn....

So, as a movie by itself, Rots was fantastic. However these gaping plot holes lead me to like the entire series less. In that way, it was a huge disappointment.

 

In before teh lock...

These are all discussed elsewhere, bro.

 

ARRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGG

sorry, no meds today.

watch and enjoy. let go.
not every damn thing needs to be explained.
and there have been 10000 threads on this already.

 

I don't want to hear NEGATIVES right now, i haven't even seen it yet.

 

"in ANH, obi-wan claims to have never seen R2-D2 before. Clearly he has. Why would he lie? It serves no purpose to lie, and since he's a jedi, he shouldn't be lying unless he absolutely has to."


He claims to never remembering owning a droid. Plus he is trying to keep the awful truth away from Luke.

 

<<<<<1: in ANH, obi-wan claims to have never seen R2-D2 before. Clearly he has. Why would he lie? It serves no purpose to lie, and since he's a jedi, he shouldn't be lying unless he absolutely has to.>>>>>

He said he's never owned a droid. Big difference.

<<<<<2: in ROTS, only C3P0's memory is wiped. R2's is not. So at any time from that point until ANH, R2, as C3PO's constantly bickering counterpoint, could come back with, "at least I wasn't built by Darth Vader!" as a comeback to any quip from C3PO. The point I'm really making is that it's hard to believe ,since C3PO and R2 are best buds for approx. 20 years before ANH, that R2D2 didn't reveal at least once, C3PO's origin, especially considering how much they bicker. And if it was revealed to C3P0, how come he didn't say to Luke when he first met him, "Skywalker. I've heard that name before. R2, where did I hear that name? Oh that's right! Your father.">>>>>

You know, this is actually something to be enjoyed. It's no damn plot hole.

<<<<<3: This is the one that bugs me the most. The jedi who commissioned the clones is only mentioned in AOTC, but we never see him. To me, this is forshadowing for something to happen in the next film. Yet, it doesn't. This guy isn't even mentioned in ROTS. I, for one, would have liked to know more about him and what caused him to commission the clones in the first place. Now, I do not read any of the novels or comics, nor should a fan or movie-goer be required to do so, just to understand the series as a whole. Every plot point should be satisifed by the end of a story, otherwise it's incomplete.>>>>>

I agree with this one.

<<<<<4: What is Uncle Owen's story? Why was this Owen guy chosen to raise Luke.? They say he's Luke's family. In what way is he related? According to back-story i read somwhere, he's Obi-wan's brother. That's not clearly shown in the movie. Is he related to Shmi? It would be nice to know.>>>>>

From ATTACK OF THE CLONES (2002):

OWEN
I guess I'm your STEPBROTHER. I had a feeling you'd show up someday.

<<<<<5: Speaking of Tattoine, it seems like an obvious choice to look for luke, considering Darth Vader is from there himself. Why did good 'ol Darth overlook this. If I were a mean 'ol lord of the sith, the first thing I would have done is to go tattoine, kill this Owen guy, and take my new Sith trainee son home. Good-bye rebellion. Now, I know Palpatine told him that he killed Padme, and so he may have thought the child died with her. That makes sense. Wait no it doesn't. He's possibly the most powerful jedi/sith ever. Also, he knew exactly who luke was in ESB.>>>>>

It worked, didn't it? Vader knew who Luke was because he learned that the dude who destroyed the Death Star last name was "Skywalker".

<<<<<6: Was Anakin really immaculately concepted? That's really, really cheezy if that's the case. Now that's just a matter of opinion, I agree. It would have been nice if it was clearly indicated that Palpatine himself or his ex-master actually created Anakin. But, it's just briefly mentioned that some guy at some time knew how to influence midichlorians. Thats all we get. Yawn....>>>>>

Deleted concept. I'm glad it's not there. Don't want a rehash of I'm your daddy...


Glad that you enjoyed the movie...

 

you know there is a SEARCH feture for a reason......

 

and yes, you are being overly picky

 

1. He claims not to remember owning a droid. There's a huge difference.

2. R2 is programmed not to tell Threepio, so he won't. So he would never say your dumb "At least I wasn't built by Darth Vader" line. Threepio doesn't remember the name Skywalker because it was ERASED. Droids aren't like humans, once you erase something it is ERASED, gone forever. It's not like he forgot and needs reminding, he doesn't have that memory altogether.

3. Sifo-Dyas isn't mentioned, and that does annoy me a little, but it isn't necessary to hear every detail about how the clones were created, just as long as we know there was some plot.

4. Are you serious? Watch AOTC again, and listen to the name "UNCLE." Shmi was sold to Lars, and then he freed her and married her, and they had Owen, who's girlfriend was Beru. So he was Anakin's step-brother, which makes him Luke's uncle. This is all clearly explained in AOTC. He has no family ties to Obi-Wan.

5. How does Vader even know that Luke is alive? He knew Padme died, and so he would immediately think that his child(ren) had died. Why doesn't this make sense? Once he sees that the force is strong with him, and hears about him, he figures it out by ESB.

6. He was, get used to it. The prophecy said he would, and he did. That's what happened.

 

1: in ANH, obi-wan claims to have never seen R2-D2 before. Clearly he has. Why would he lie? It serves no purpose to lie, and since he's a jedi, he shouldn't be lying unless he absolutely has to.

No, he said that he never owned a droid. He never said that he had never seen Artoo. In the PT, Obi-wan does not own a droid. He uses the ones that are handed out to him, at the Temple.

2: in ROTS, only C3P0's memory is wiped. R2's is not. So at any time from that point until ANH, R2, as C3PO's constantly bickering counterpoint, could come back with, "at least I wasn't built by Darth Vader!" as a comeback to any quip from C3PO. The point I'm really making is that it's hard to believe ,since C3PO and R2 are best buds for approx. 20 years before ANH, that R2D2 didn't reveal at least once, C3PO's origin, especially considering how much they bicker. And if it was revealed to C3P0, how come he didn't say to Luke when he first met him, "Skywalker. I've heard that name before. R2, where did I hear that name? Oh that's right! Your father."

Artoo is much smarter and craftier than Threepio. He knows that he got off lucky by not having his memory wiped. He doesn't want to risk endangering the twins by accidently spilling the beans to Threepio. He's the biggest blabbermouth there is.

3: This is the one that bugs me the most. The jedi who commissioned the clones is only mentioned in AOTC, but we never see him. To me, this is forshadowing for something to happen in the next film. Yet, it doesn't. This guy isn't even mentioned in ROTS. I, for one, would have liked to know more about him and what caused him to commission the clones in the first place. Now, I do not read any of the novels or comics, nor should a fan or movie-goer be required to do so, just to understand the series as a whole. Every plot point should be satisifed by the end of a story, otherwise it's incomplete.

It's a plot point that got way out of hand. It was always going to be Sidious that ordered the clones. Lucas just wanted it to be not so obvious in AOTC. Unfortunately, the fans took it way too seriously as a major plot point. It goes back to the revelation in TESB. A lot of fans wanted a big twist.

4: What is Uncle Owen's story? Why was this Owen guy chosen to raise Luke.? They say he's Luke's family. In what way is he related? According to back-story i read somwhere, he's Obi-wan's brother. That's not clearly shown in the movie. Is he related to Shmi? It would be nice to know.

The official and current backstory is that Shmi was freed by Cliegg, who she then married. Owen is Anakin's step brother. Larry Kasdan came up with Obi-wan being related to Owen. Lucas just went back to his original idea from the early drafts of ANH. That Owen Lars was related to Anakin.

5: Speaking of Tattoine, it seems like an obvious choice to look for luke, considering Darth Vader is from there himself. Why did good 'ol Darth overlook this. If I were a mean 'ol lord of the sith, the first thing I would have done is to go tattoine, kill this Owen guy, and take my new Sith trainee son home. Good-bye rebellion. Now, I know Palpatine told him that he killed Padme, and so he may have thought the child died with her. That makes sense. Wait no it doesn't. He's possibly the most powerful jedi/sith ever. Also, he knew exactly who luke was in ESB.

Both Jedi Masters thought Vader was dead on Mustafar. They don't know he's alive. And both Jedi made Padme appear pregnant, when her body was shipped home. Vader just assumes that she never got to give birth. It isn't until TESB that Palpatine makes him realize that Obi-wan covered it up.

6: Was Anakin really immaculately concepted? That's really, really cheezy if that's the case. Now that's just a matter of opinion, I agree. It would have been nice if it was clearly indicated that Palpatine himself or his ex-master actually created Anakin. But, it's just briefly mentioned that some guy at some time knew how to influence midichlorians. Thats all we get. Yawn....

Anakin is, though som

 

I agree the plot holes are gaping, i think it is GL's joke on us.

 

I finally joined the board today just to refute the sheer idiocy in "NegativeWord's" post....

But Bacon beat me to it!


Damn you Bacoooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!!!!

 

Just for the sake of knowledge, not trying to nitpick, "immaculate conception" refers to Mary, and not Jesus. It has nothing to do with being conceived without a father.

 

My turn to answer...

"1: in ANH, obi-wan claims to have never seen R2-D2 before. Clearly he has. Why would he lie? It serves no purpose to lie, and since he's a jedi, he shouldn't be lying unless he absolutely has to."

As a way to hide who he really is, to stop R2 from saying too much about the past. You don't want R2 to go saying stuff about Luke's father, and then have stupid C3PO start translating him.

"2: in ROTS, only C3P0's memory is wiped. R2's is not. So at any time from that point until ANH, R2, as C3PO's constantly bickering counterpoint, could come back with, "at least I wasn't built by Darth Vader!" as a comeback to any quip from C3PO. The point I'm really making is that it's hard to believe ,since C3PO and R2 are best buds for approx. 20 years before ANH, that R2D2 didn't reveal at least once, C3PO's origin, especially considering how much they bicker. And if it was revealed to C3P0, how come he didn't say to Luke when he first met him, "Skywalker. I've heard that name before. R2, where did I hear that name? Oh that's right! Your father.""

Like it was impossible for R2 to have been told by his previous owner, Captain Antilles, to keep his mouth shut about the past? They might have figured they'd need one of the droids, preferrably one no one (not even Luke) could understand without an interpretor so too much info wouldn't be leaked at the wrong time, to keep a record of what happened in the past.

"3: This is the one that bugs me the most. The jedi who commissioned the clones is only mentioned in AOTC, but we never see him. To me, this is forshadowing for something to happen in the next film. Yet, it doesn't. This guy isn't even mentioned in ROTS. I, for one, would have liked to know more about him and what caused him to commission the clones in the first place. Now, I do not read any of the novels or comics, nor should a fan or movie-goer be required to do so, just to understand the series as a whole. Every plot point should be satisifed by the end of a story, otherwise it's incomplete."

The answer is pretty much in the same scene as the question. Just do the math yourself. Sifo ordered the clones, Dooku left the Order and joined Sidious, Dooku took Sifo's place in the clone order. Dooku got Jango to be the clone template. Palpatine instructed the Kaminoans to program the clones with special orders. That's it. It answers itself in AotC and RotS if you just think.

"4: What is Uncle Owen's story? Why was this Owen guy chosen to raise Luke.? They say he's Luke's family. In what way is he related? According to back-story i read somwhere, he's Obi-wan's brother. That's not clearly shown in the movie. Is he related to Shmi? It would be nice to know."

He was Obi-Wan's brother in the first draft of the A New Hope screenplay, I believe. It was something from a long time ago. Lucas changed that so that now Owen's father Cliegg married Shmi, so Owen is Anakin's stepbrother.

"5: Speaking of Tattoine, it seems like an obvious choice to look for luke, considering Darth Vader is from there himself. Why did good 'ol Darth overlook this. If I were a mean 'ol lord of the sith, the first thing I would have done is to go tattoine, kill this Owen guy, and take my new Sith trainee son home. Good-bye rebellion. Now, I know Palpatine told him that he killed Padme, and so he may have thought the child died with her. That makes sense. Wait no it doesn't. He's possibly the most powerful jedi/sith ever. Also, he knew exactly who luke was in ESB."

Vader would never EVER go back to Tatooine. Would you after all that has happened there? Besides, he didn't even know he had any children, he thought they died with their mother. Why would he look for his kids on a planet that haunted him for 20 years if he barely knew they were alive and only had a hunch? And Vader knew Luke existed because of his encounter with him during the Battle of Yavin. He struck down Obi-Wan, and everyone thought Yoda was killed by Sidious, so what other Jedi would he think it was? Especially with the Fo

 

<<<<<5: Speaking of Tattoine, it seems like an obvious choice to look for luke, considering Darth Vader is from there himself. Why did good 'ol Darth overlook this. If I were a mean 'ol lord of the sith, the first thing I would have done is to go tattoine, kill this Owen guy, and take my new Sith trainee son home. Good-bye rebellion. Now, I know Palpatine told him that he killed Padme, and so he may have thought the child died with her. That makes sense. Wait no it doesn't. He's possibly the most powerful jedi/sith ever. Also, he knew exactly who luke was in ESB.>>>>>


because he is told by Palpatine that Padme is dead, so Anakin assumes that his unborn children are dead too, soooooo for about 20 years or so, he thinks that his children are dead, until Luke destroys the death star, vader is then like "whoa my kid is still alive!"

 

It's not so much that people don't know these things as much as the arrogance that often comes along with it when they call these misconeptions on their part "gaping plot holes".

Whatever happened to figuring out something you don't understand? So many people just start pointing fingers without even checking their facts.

 

Vader would never EVER go back to Tatooine. Would you after all that has happened there? Besides, he didn't even know he had any children, he thought they died with their mother. Why would he look for his kids on a planet that haunted him for 20 years if he barely knew they were alive and only had a hunch? And Vader knew Luke existed because of his encounter with him during the Battle of Yavin. He struck down Obi-Wan, and everyone thought Yoda was killed by Sidious, so what other Jedi would he think it was? Especially with the Force being so strong with him? He could tell through the Force that it was his son due to Luke's Force sensitivity and natural Force strength.
[/ei]

this is entirely possible, but i will point out that when you watch the new DVD version vader does not know that skywalker is his son.

it is pure speculation on our part to assume he does as well.

he knows at the end of ep4 that a potentialy powerful force sensitive blew up the deathstar.

he knows from the opening crawl and early dialog in esb that the last name of this force sensitive individual is skywalker, at no time does he call him: luke, son, boy, ect.

the person who blew up the deathstar in vaders mind as far as i can prove could be a girl up until palpantine reveals it's luke skywalker.

 

I'll add onto the tatooine question...


Vader doesn't even refer to himself as Anakin, in ESB, Palaptine tells him "the Son of Skywalker". When Anakin became Vader, he left his "Anakin" life behind & all that was with it. I would venture to say he doesn't really remember (maybe not the best choice of words) he was Anakin until Luke came around. (part of coming back to the "good side")



just my thoughts.

 

I just had to say this:

Shmi was sold to Lars, and then he freed her and married her, and they had Owen, who's girlfriend was Beru. So he was Anakin's step-brother, which makes him Luke's uncle. This is all clearly explained in AOTC. He has no family ties to Obi-Wan.


Ok Owen is Cliegg Lars son not Shmi's other wise they would be HALF borthers...

That jsut bugged me sorry...

 

darth-sinister:
The official and current backstory is that Shmi was freed by Cliegg, who she then married. Owen is Anakin's step brother.

Yes, they are step-brothers because Anakin's mother married Owen's father. They are not blood-related, and Owen and Anakin met exactly once in their lives, I believe. To me, that doesn't really seem much like "family". I don't know why Owen and Beru would have been willing to accept the awesome and dangerous responsibility of being Luke's guardians. Ultimately, it cost them their lives.

 

I finally joined the board today just to refute the sheer idiocy in "NegativeWord's" post....

But Bacon beat me to it!


Damn you Bacoooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnn!!!!!!!!!

Easy Cheetah! Flaming isn't nice. Anyway, sorry for the redundancy folks. I just choined the forum, and didn't feel like like searching for every single answer, especially since I'm in the Philippines right now and I'm relegated to using a really slow dial-up connection. Maybe I should have said that at the beginning. Anyway, I apologize.

As far as what some of you said

Yes, I know Obi-wan didn't specifically say he knew R2, but instead said he didn't own a droid However, Alec Guiness portrayed a complete lack of recognition when he saw R2 for the first time, and R2 himself was somewhat unwilling to get out of his hidey-hole to meet this master jedi. This, to me, implies that they never saw each other until then.

As far as Uncle Owen and that AOTC point. OK, i'll have to watch it again. I don't own the dvd, so I was going off of memory. Sorry.

Yes, I know "immaculate conception" specifically confers to the birth of jesus, but it's a good way of describing someone who was born by supernatural means with no biological father. It conveyed my point clearly, so i used it.

Have a good one guys

 

does the movie say how 3po got his gold plating?

 

Easy Cheetah! Flaming isn't nice

Flaming? Don't be so sensitive.

 

"does the movie say how 3po got his gold plating? "

Well I know Clone Wars vol. 2 does.