Full Series Rebels 2.03 - The Lost Commanders - Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Eh Curing Meat isnt a new idea, lots and lots of Salt. Of course the bigger issue is meat does not supply all the nutrients a human needs.

 

This was a very workmanlike episode. The opening was very straightforward and some of the bigger moments were rushed.

However, there is still plenty to love about the episode. The clones are both fascinating and fun. The modified AT-TE is wonderfully imaginative. A lot of interesting divisions and friendships are being set up between the clones and the Ghost Crew. And the episode itself still has some cool twists and turns.

The next episode should be really good.

 

No because we get to see AT AT in action and clones kick storm trooper ass.

 

So, in the Lost Commanders Rebel Recon, I saw this. Think it means anything or am I just reading too much into it?

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Dinos4Ever

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That...sort of looks like Ahsoka's lightsaber?

 

It ain't blue that's all I am saying.

 

^^^ a quick google search can be enlightening.

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tis just swag.

 

Shhhhhh

 

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That was a good episode. Kanan telling Ezra about Order 66 was heartwrencing as well as the Ryloth music playing while Hera and him talked about the Clones.

 

So, Lost Commanders...

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Ahsoka is gushing about Rex, Kanan is not impressed tho.
Zeb finds a buddy in Gregor.
Wolffe is super paranoid and not letting Rex answer his voicemails.
Lots of technical errors, the Ghost/the Phantom/the power regulator/etc.
Rex is still the best shot in the galaxy.
Hera reassures Kanan...again.
Sabine is in charge.

Episode should've been called The Found Exposition. 7.5/10

 

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"I betrayed you all to the Empire. And now they're coming to kill us. But I changed my mind a few seconds after you confronted me."

"Lol, that's okay."

Sometimes I hate these writers.

On the positive side, I stumbled upon this cancelled Star Wars: First Assault theme, which is like an an Empire/Republic mashup. Glorious.

 

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Yeah, the whole episode feels a bit rushed and probably would've worked better as a two-parter. But it is interesting that Wolffe seems to be the most damaged clone- he fires on Kanan, takes more talking to to calm down, doesn't want to involve them with the Ghost crew at all, sends the message to the Empire, and doesn't really get friendly like Rex and Gregor.

But like Rex says in this episode and Kanan said in SoL, the war changed everyone and some scars are more apparent than others.

Wolffe wants to protect his squad, it's really sad because Rex and Gregor and their mobilehome walker are all the guy has left. It's clear Wolffe is paranoid and scared that Kanan and the Ghost crew are going to take all that away from him, so he did what he thought would protect his squad-his brothers.

But Wolffe also doesn't want Rex and Gregor to hate him or leave him, so when Rex is all 'I don't want to live in fear of the Empire' he agrees. And they forgive him because they know what he was trying to do, even though they didn't agree with him.

So that turned into a huge ramble about Wolffe... I am just glad that Gregor truly escaped his clingyjealouswannabeboyfriend former employer Borkus.

 

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My issue isn't really motivation, it's with consequences. Regardless of how much issues both sides have and how much they've been through, Wolffe endangered everyone and not even a wrist slap was earned. What's to stop his unstable mind from selling out Kanan & co again?

 

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It seems like Kanan and co are, at first at least, going to leave the clones to deal with the Empire themselves. Kallus I am sure will not be pleased when he finds out they let the Jedi escape.

Maybe Wolffe's unstable mind is why we haven't seen him in the future with the Ghost crew or rebellion, he dies or doesn't join with Rex.

If a mod wants to combine the two posts, please do so. After my ramble about Wolffe, I feel Rex needs one too.

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Rex in this episode is lost as well. Where Wolffe is scared, Rex feels useless. Like he has outlived his purpose.

We see shades of Rex from Umbara here, questioning the cost of the war. Weighing the lives of his dead brothers, much much heavier than what their lives bought(Order66, the Empire). And subsequently, to Rex, his own pound of flesh wasn't worth it either. A much different outlook than he had in the beginning of TCW.

So when Ahsoka sends Ezra to him to ask for help, on some level he doesn't think he would be useful at all. He flat out tells Ezra this, like being useful is the only thing he is good for.

Rex, here's to finding your purpose again.

 

Decent episode. Nothing to thrilling but at least the story had something to do with the overall plot (one of my biggest complaints about TCW).

In anycase why did they feel the need to give Sabine a new hair color?

 

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Kinda agree about the Ghost crew forgiving too fast. Zeb forgiving after getting eaten by the worm I could kinda swallow given his "cool bro" personality (Side note- Does anyone else find it odd that Zeb is supposed to be an adult from some elite honor-guard and yet acts like a teenager that is arguably less mature than Ezra and Sabine?) Getting betrayed to the Empire should have more weight to it, especially in tandem with the worm hunt nearly killing Zeb and the Kanan/order 66 thing. Would have preferred that the Empire swooped in mid-squabble and then have any forgiving done after the clones prove their loyalty in battle. More of a stuff is hitting the fan, no time to argue situation analogous to Lando and the Falcon crew at the end of Empire. Other than that liked the episode. Especially Kanan's tension with the clones. I hope that he doesn't full swing accept them by the next episode. If there is one complaint I could make about the show overall it is that character arcs happen too fast. Ezra started off the show as a loner but is fully selfless by the the end of the pilot and has never shown any hint of a relapse to his street-rat past. Last episode Kanan doesn't want to join an army, but seems eager to expand their forces to other systems by the beginning of this episode. Good t.v. shows have more of a slow burn in character evolution, I hope they start veering more in that direction. Otherwise these sources of conflict will start to seem less like defining character moments and more like fodder for a little drama of the week.

 

I too noticed the Jaws music.

 

It has been quite a long I wrote here. Well Rebels is back so let's get to business

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As trailer already spoiled- clones are back and this time they're old men living on a modified at-te hunting big worms on salt desert planet. Nice episode and good that they somehow comment this entire "what happened to clones?"- issue and giving sort of backstory what happened, but I'm not happy with this- they should definitely make a story about Rex- what exactly happened between TCW, during ROTS and after that before Rebels- there is no clear sensible scenario how loyal soldier of the republic could still be alive during the Empire and not taking part to order 66 or anyway trying to prevent it.

-So Rex and his buddies Wolffe and Gregor removed their chips at some point. How they were able to do it after Fives incident and why they are not killed already by the Empire? What about all those 501st that marched to the temple with Anakin- where was Rex then and how he was able to leave the military before ROTS or not take part to order 66 if he was still part of clone army- without being labeled traitor to the Empire? Too many unanswered questions.

-And what is Siege of Mandalore and why it was not shown in TCW? If Ahsoka was still commander it happened before Battle of Cato Neimoidia and Barriss' bombings but TCW didn't show it while it sounds interesting and important event.

- Also didn't like it that they created another planet that looks like Abafar and even placed Gregor there to be more confusing- this could've been Abafar still but for some reason they created another salt desert world. Of course there could be hundreds of them but why Gregor needs to be involved? He could've just died on Abafar and there could've been some other clone with these two instead of Gregor...

+I liked the Jaws-homage and design of the worm- clones are like intergalactic whalers now.

-And seriously Wolffe's betrayal and the way they forgave immediately was not good writing as many have pointed out.

+ That AT-Te mod is nice

- And then this all talk about stormtroopers being worse than clones even recognized in-universe makes very little sense. If clones are good soldiers why Empire- that needs a lot of soldiers don't use them at all anymore. Makes sense that they start recruiting people to get more soldiers fast and cheap, but why to give up elite troops like clones completely? Is Death Star so expensive that they need to save money by stopping the production of clones? Or did clones do something that made them unreliable? Is discrimination of clones part of some imperial ideology? No sensible explanation has been given by Filoni or anyone else.

Seems that they just love the clones so much they cannot make them bad guys even a little bit. At least Pablo Hidalgo said that some clones serve as trainers for the stormtroopers. That would be nice to see. TFU2 (while not canon anymore) had mention of Cody training stormtroopers and thinking that they suck as soldiers- would be nice to see him in TCW- as bad guy.

 

I just saw the new episode and I must say, since I am not the biggest clone fan I found

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Gregor wackiness really refreshing, his facial expression when the Joopa came out was perfect and better yet, he has one the best lines of the episode with his general/commander and his dynamic with Zeb changes from the overused Zeb/Ezra.
Hera/Kanan conversation was heartwarming, he really sees her as his confident and that music, do they finally have a theme ?
That sunset was gorgeous, nuff said.
Glad Kanan's issues with the clones weren't resolved in one episode unlike another character
the bad:
-Still, I disliked how hera was sidelined in this episode it felt like "sorry, it is not your time to shine, yet" and worse, apart from their short argument we nearly got no Chopper.
-Wolffe betrayal and turnaround in literally five minutes, and he kept Ahsoka's messages from Rex. Do i need to explain myself here ?
-Ezra trying (too hard) to be the voice of reason

Is it still agent kallus or is it commander ? I am a little confused.
The Siege of Mandalore, I don't think it is happening during ROTS and I don't think Ahsoka killed Maul there because they spent so much effort to explain his return that I don't see them just killing him so easily unfortunately.

But yeah, definitively a set up episode for the action packed (I hope) next episode.
Overall, I give this episode 7/10, not a lot happened and some characters get on my nerves but some really nice moments of laugh kept it entertaining. Now, onto the next episode!

 

I thought the clones came off as massive ******; I mean not only did they

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actually betray every one, but they put someone's life in danger!

I liked this episode, but I found everyone's reaction to the clones to be way off.

 

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A years supply of worm jerky.

*Zeb emerging from the dead worm reminded me of Ron Perlman coming outve the Kaiju in Pacific Rim.

 

loved the "jaws" feeling.

 

moonjump05

I combined both your posts.

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Gregor being all wacky was one of my favorite parts this episode. Also I wonder if we will get to see Ryloth this season?

 

I mean

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we are seeingCham so I would assume so. [\spoiler]

 

Okay just saw the episode. Was a good reintroduction episode for the Clones as well as just an easy way to return to the series after being away for awhile as obviously we had our big reintroduction with Siege of Lothal.

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Not all the characters were given a lot to do but what they were given worked well enough. Hera had a funny moment with Chopper and then an effective emotional moment with Kanan regarding Order 66 and both definitely have different responses. In that she knows it effected him but she can't deny what they did for Ryloth and the rest of the galaxy. The hunt for the Jaloobas (or however that's spelt) was fun very Jaws like and Zeb's reactions were great angry one minute then a 180 of eh not so bad once he realised he caught them their biggest catch. Sabine didn't do much but she does have her own story coming up so I can't be expecting big for every episode but having her fix stuff and then Rex being observant of her mechanics was a good thing because its clear he hasn't lost a keen sense of judging character.

Obviously the Clones, Kanan and Ezra were the main focus in terms of character development. The Clones represent a different reaction someone has to war and how it can effect a person which I thought was interesting and effective.

Gregor represents those who have been through so much they just completely become unhinged and snap (understandably so he lost his memory only to be involved in an explosion) but he's not entirely bad he knows where he is too a point. Dee (who does great as always in this episode) described him as a "Wacky Uncle" and that's not a bad description.

Wolffe is unhinged but in a different way. He's clearly psychologically damaged by the war and is determined to protect his squad of Rex and Gregor and feels Kanan and the others will take that away from him even Ahsoka might do so if she finds them hence keeping the messages from Rex. It's sort of like Christopher Walken in the Deer Hunter not quite as bad yet but he could have gone there or could go there. The guilt he faces over betraying them was handled fast like some said but its not like everybody entirely forgives him really only Rex tries reassure him of their freedom and they don't have to be afraid he doesn't even say apology accepted but he probably does.

And Rex himself I felt was a good combination of Rex in his younger years but also a Rex who's more older and wiser beyond his years and he represents another side to those effected by war and that's the soldier who comes back and questions what was it all worth in the end? It really harkens back to times in the Clone Wars when he questioned his loyalty to the Republic and ultimate free will. The Deserter episode comes to mind instantly and the Krell arc too. You almost feel sorry for him because you can tell he doesn't want to turn down Ezra and the crew but he knows their time has passed. He's really just a lost soldier in many ways without a purpose in the world again a lot of people involved in war feel that way when they've returned and seen so much suffering. That bit where he says was it all worth it in the end all those men killed and how he understands why Kanan doesn't like him and he can't blame him for doing so. Good stuff there and well acted by Dee Bradley Baker. Like Pablo said its clear Fives' sacrifice effected him and something happened that made him come to the conclusion of removing his inhibitor chip and he somehow managed to convince Wolffe to do the same thing and wherever they found Gregor they managed to convince him as well. To quote Ahsoka "There are questions. Questions that need answering" in regards to what happened to Rex before this. But yeah good stuff with the Clones.

Ezra obviously is oblivious to why Kanan hates the Clones but isn't angry about it he just wants him to try. The way he bonds with Rex taking the place of a father that's been absent from his life was kind of nice to see and the way Rex referred to him as son and his overall demeanour and his arc in this also sort of gave off a Captain America vibe well Cap when he's in the future. Ezra represents the children who haven't seen war well he has but not in the way Kanan went through so when people like Kanan and Rex mention the casualties he feels their pain but its still lost on him. I don't know if ignorant is the right word but I guess there's a certain naivety he has to the Clone Wars.

And finally Kanan represents someone who lived through war. Someone who's seen so much death and suffering all because of the Clones. Some people would say why can't he trust them if they aren't killing him? Well they aren't now but they could especially when you have two who are unhinged. If you saw someone or something that caused you grief you're first instinct is not to trust them and I like that he isn't entirely there to trusting them yet but he's trying at least once he talks to Hera. The best moment is when he lashes out a little at Ezra saying you weren't there you weren't even born as he explains Order 66. Very powerful stuff again like the Rex dialogue very reminiscent of a soldier recounting something that happened in war all you need is the sound effects and flashback but they won't do that and it's very well delivered by Freddy Prince Jr. and Rex's line of "we all have a choice" again some good character stuff here for the ones who need it in this one. Ultimately the Clones though they are allies their emotional connection to the others who were side lined in this one doesn't matter as much that's why Kanan and Ezra are focused on in the way they are because this does mean something too them Ezra learning about something he doesn't know and Kanan reliving what was ultimately the author of all his pain.

Overall a good reintroduction for the Clones and a good way to build to the action next episode and a good easy going way to come back after the action packed thrill of The Siege Of Lothal that still isn't entirely devoid of substance and subtext. People can call it filler honestly I say its important and will be important and even then sometimes the filler episodes do come back and mean something later on which are usually the good filler episodes. People throw around that word like its a bad thing and true not every filler episode works but there are some that do and sometimes they can surprise you in how they mean something later Avatar The Last Airbender was good at doing this and even Clone Wars had certain filler episodes come back like I said the ideals of the Deserter episode one that most people would write off as filler came back for Rebels as Rex is now in the same position as Cut a soldier lost from the war who ultimately is wondering was it all worth it? Anyway good episode looking forward to more. Good to have Rebels back.