Revan, the Ancient Sith Empire, and the Mandalorians. (KOTOR 2 spoilers)

MS. Stop. It.
It has been stated directly in the Source Material from the creator. AND IN THE STORY ITSELF. It's been confirmed. IT's DONE. FINITO EL MUSICO. KJA's own pen said they're dead to the last Sith.

 

Or maybe, perhaps, there was two, reserved only for the greatest Dark Lords.

Then you're ignoring the fact that the Sith learned about the Republic from the Starbreaker 12 and Jori and Dav Daragon (or whatever the hell their names are) and got hyperspace coordinates based on the tracker that was Starbreak 12. That's how they left their Empire and how they returned.

 

And Naga Sadow himself stated that there was only one route

 

They didn't say JUST the Empire was dead. they said the Sith Race was extinct. End of story

 

It has been stated directly in the Source Material from the creator.

To be honest, what the creator has to say about something doesn't mean all that much in the SW EU. If LFL decides to go take a different route with a particular character or species that one author had created, it's in their right to do so, and has already happened, I think. (Can't think off an example at the moment tho', although I can recall a few mentions of something like that happening Timothy Zahn's works)

So if LFL decided that "'oi, let's bring back those wacky Sith, and say that the historians were completely wrong about them"... well, there's very little that KJA can do against that.

So speculating about possibly escape routes is definately a possibility.

However, unlike another particular race out there, I don't really think that Kreia was talking about a bunch of monsters who continually bark, snarl and overall have a bad temper the whole time when she spoke of the True Sith Empire.

As I've mentioned, my guess is that Revan's Sith Empire was actually a part of something bigger, or perhaps meant to pave the road for the True Sith Empire's return. Either Darth Revan was part of them to take over the galaxy, or they simply taught him the necessary things to 'take over a Galaxy'(tm). Now either Darth Revan was working for them, or s/he was smarter than the True Sith expected, and took the galaxy over systematically so that when they returned, he could go all "Haha, I think I'll keep it, and take over your Empire too"(that would work for a Sith Lord, I suppose), or Darth Revan learned of the True Sith somehow, and simply decided to keep most of the defenses intact to defend HIS Galaxy.

But overall, the last thing that I expect is that Revan went to the Dark Side willingly to defend the Galaxy. There must be more to the story, and surely the True Sith are involved somehow.


When I think of the True Sith, I picture them like Sith Empire back in GAOTS and FOTS. An Empire that has quite a few systems under its rule, and wasn't found by the Republic... yet.

(and hopefully without such blokes as Ludo Kressh and Naga Sadow)

 

....Sin, you BETTER be joking...The SITH EMPIRE, destroyed utterly was made up of guys OTHER than Sith? Proof. Now.

 

The only survivors of the Sith were the Massassi and they died after the Sith War, except for the Night Beast.

 

I think it'd be cool to have a Sith Empire out in the unknown regions, but not of the Sith race. Students of the Dark Side that fled out there during the time of Freedon Nadd or before, perhaps.

 

Here's proof not...the Sith were totally isolationist, we didn't see a SINGLE race besides the Sith and Massassi in the expansive panels we saw. And the tiny little detail...
Quote: 'The Sith Empire consisted of the Dark Side users, the Sith and their slaves and warriors: The Massassi'.
And if they bring the Sith back it's an obvious continuity ERROR.

 

And if they bring the Sith back it's an obvious continuity ERROR.

How so? As I've typed, if LFL decides that the historians and source books were wrong, and the large group of Sith had escaped... so be it. Possible continuity error turned into fact.

Quote: 'The Sith Empire consisted of the Dark Side users, the Sith and their slaves and warriors: The Massassi'.

First to see wether we are talking about the right Sith Empire here... this is about the Golden Age of the Sith and Fall of the Sith Empire, right? I always thought that the rulers of this Empire were ex-Jedi exiled from the Republic, as Marka Ragnos claimed, and whom were hailed as gods when they encountered the Sith?

(which led to the whole yoo-haa where they created the Sith Empire, and the Sith became a religion, instead of a race)

And then it was surely these ex-Jedi, the Dark Side users mentioned in your quote, whom led the Sith Empire? Those weren't Sith. I always took the 'Dark Lords of the Sith' meant that they were the Lords OF THE Sith, the rulers of the Sith, their gods, their sovereigns and what other words for leadership you have.

 

Burrie, somethings just shouldn't be done and bringing back a dead race, that has been stated so many a time is an error and it strikes me as wrong there...especially when KOTOR's taken oh-so much from the TOTJ

 

They interbred with the Sith. By the time of that comic, those dark jedi were long gone and only their descendants remained.

 

Burrie, somethings just shouldn't be done and bringing back a dead race, that has been stated so many a time is an error and it strikes me as wrong there...especially when KOTOR's taken oh-so much from the TOTJ

To be honest, I'm reminded that a certain dead race might apparantly return soon in some book as well. Can't recall who or what at the moment, to be honest, but I really wouldn't make that big a point out of it.

And really... there are quite a few things that shouldn't have been done in the EU, and still did. The return of the Sith race would be something relatively minor, I think. Again, if LFL wants something to return, it doesn't matter what the writer says or thinks. They would be back.

Again, not that I'm advocating that the True Sith Empire consists of them. Heck, doesn't Kreia even mention that the whole 'materialistic War Empire' that is Revan's Sith Empire is really nothing compared with the True Sith Empire? That doesn't sound like them barking varmints to me.

Just curious, where are those many times that it's stated that the Sith are completely extinct? Can you give page numbers and the like? I'd like to read the examples.

Edit: Hell, what is exactly giving out the idea that the 'True Sith' ARE the Sith of Old, and not just a bunch of brilliant Dark Side users? The fact that they're referred to as the 'True Sith'? That still can mean anything.

I can't recall any sort of dialogue that even hinted that we were talking about the ancient Sith race.

 

Thank you for pointing that out, Burrie...However, I have to say I have nothing but contempt when something that's stayed in the continuity for so long has to move aside for something else.
And the Kilik (I think that's what they're called)Were only tohught extinct...they weren't 'exterminated to the last man as written in the story and in context and source stuff'

 

Mmmm, the Killiks you say? Where was it said that they were thought to be exterminated?

(again, the same with the Sith, if possible, I'd like to read the examples m'self)

 

To return back to the True Sith Empire...

I was browsing through a few scenes that were, unfortunately, cut from the game. Now, we can't really take this as an official spoiler or an explanation or anything, but it IS rather interesting.

This appears to be a scene where Mandalore was seriously hurt, and Visas Marr is healing him. Through it all, Canderous/Mandalore(honestly, if the voice and unused model wouldn't have convinced you, this conversation removes any doubt that he IS Canderous) goes on a rant about Revan, after saying that Visas reminds him of Revan, 'at the end'.

He first talks about how he was dying on the outer rim, and the final words that Revan told him. Not sure what that is all about,but I guess Canderous followed Revan, despite the fact not to, and somehow payed for it. Also, Canderous mentions that when Revan told him that the Mandalorians had died for nothing, that h/she had laughed. Sounds a bit out-of-character for Light Side Revan, if you ask me. Either there was a Light-Side version as well, or this was Dark-Side only.

Nonetheless, Revan hinted to Canderous what the Republic was about to face. Here are a few tidbit that Manderous says...

(After Revan had told him that the Mandalorians had been tricked)

S/He said that there was a war coming. That it was waiting out in the unknown regions, in the dark. Waiting for us to destroy each other.

(when Visas asks about the war)

No, not this one. Another one. More terrible. Against an evil that we couldn't begin to comprehend. A war of belief, that had been faught for thousands of years

Honestly, what to make of this? I still rather like the theory that Darth Revan was also nothing more than a mere pawn to prepare the True Sith from entering and destroying the galaxy.

Perhaps the True Sith hadn't realised that there would be Jedi who would join the fight, or had underestimated how their role would allow the Republic to win the Mandalorian War with less casualties than planned. So when this young Jedi seems to beat the Mandalorians in a fashion that the Republic could still defend itself against them, they decided to corrupt Revan to the Dark Side, gave him a few toys to play with(Star Forge), and let him have a go at it. Revan, however, was aware of the True Sith(most likely NOT according to their design), and decided to prep the galaxy to defend HIS territory against the True Sith.

But a 'war of belief', what the bloody hell is that all about?

 

How can the Sith ever die out, when there are numerous planets with Sith HQs and spirits all over waiting for an apprentice to kiss and hug? They clearly can be restored---just not with official approval.

 

Well, the Sith Empire was just a slew of worlds that just lost their entire military force, Lords, best warriors and so on and so forth...with one hyperspace route that was sort of blocked...
The thing with the Kiliks is they were thought extinct, unlike the True Sith...remember, the 'after a thousand years they emerged' thing refers to Kun and not the race...the Sith became a cult devoted to the Dark Side by the ressurection of their ideals.
It's a possibility that it's NOT the race...we'll have to see