ST Rey Skywalker/Daisy Ridley Discussion Thread

You literally just asked me to. Insert "the force" as an explanation as to why mysterious things happen that aren't talked about in the ST.

 

I don’t understand why the fact that two characters having parallels in their journeys must be “lazy” writing. That’s kind of like saying two pairs of identical window drapes on two different windows must be lazy decorating. What if it’s just something the creators liked?

 

If this trilogy was planned out in advance, and they knew ahead of time who Rey was, her background, her motivations, etc, as well as all of the other characters, as well as the dominate and consistent themes and were successful in presenting that on screen... I might be willing to go along with that.

But...that never was the case. This entire trilogy was a fly by the seat of the pants operation. They didn't know who was even was until JJ came back on board. So at best all I can assume is that it was either accidental or they were subconsciously copying both story elements for both characters because they didn't have a larger plan set up and didn't know what to do with them.

 

I literally didn't. When I said "Try using "The Force" as an explanation for anything in the Sequels though" it was an observation that when genuine use of the Force in the Sequels is used as a storytelling device (Luke's Force mind read with Kylo, Rey and Kylo's shared Force vision as examples) it is dismissed. Yet we happily accept it in the movies we like.

 

Well.. that's not what we were talking about then.

 

Fine then (I'm only posting this to see if you can resist having the last word)

(I jest - MTFBWY)

 

I don’t think that thought process is very sound.

1. The trilogy was written on the seat of their pants.
2. There are parallels between the journeys of two characters.
3. Therefore, the parallels are suboptimal.

As though if the trilogy was better planned, those parallels would be reduced or gone.

I’m saying that I don’t see why the parallels must be suboptimal, intentional or not. How similar or different the journeys of two different characters are doesn’t, to me, make a difference in storytelling quality.


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I don't agree. I think what we're seeing is randomness from not planning and lack of creativity. This is like seeing elephants in clouds. If this were planned out it would be more apparent and purposeful. There would be some larger overriding statement here. They had no clue what to do with Rey, or who she was, or what to do with her, or even Poe for that matter. They were winging both of them, and most likely inadvertently and perhaps subconsciously, gave them similar story beats.

That's not to say I'm correct. It's just stating that the logic is consistent.

 

I can see falling back on conventional storytelling as a result of insufficient planning where they don’t know what to do with the characters, so they just stick them in typical kinds of story beats, and with the very conventionality of those story beats naturally resulting in similarities. If that isn’t what you mean, then please correct me. But even in that case, Rey becoming the defining Jedi and Poe taking over for Leia in a leadership role seems like a pretty natural progression from where both characters started off, requiring, again, similar trials for becoming a leader. With all the things that actually didn’t reach their potential for me in TROS, the collection of similarities between these two wasn’t one of them.

 

Those are pretty good words. Both of these characters do have these general ... arcs... but I think giving them similar story beats doesn't really mean anything deeper towards that purpose. What's the deeper purposeful message by making their arcs similar? What's that mean symbolically? Why do this on purpose? Are they saying that leadership happens this way?

For me there's no larger answer to these story beats being similar. Saying they both lead of their respective areas in end isn't enough of an answer on its own. That's why it doesn't seem purposeful. It just seems like they're resorting or falling back on the same general beats.

Kind of like how JJ resorts to writing another map puzzle mystery to an OT Character in TROS, just like he set up a map puzzle mystery to an OT Character in TFA. I don't see a pattern there, other than, lack of creativity. There's no deeper point to those plot lines or messaging other than, hey both characters get found and are important in the force story.

 

To me, it’s more a matter of what the similarities are, rather than the fact that they are similar. Most of the similarities pointed out by the OP of this topic neither subtracted from nor added to the quality of the movies for me.


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I agree here. There are quite a few signs that this sequel trilogy wasnt planned out very intricately. Thats why there are character development issues as in odd choices, no arc or characters being reset. I found Rey simply boring. Nothing to her, IMO. Her opening scenes in TFA were great but once she got in the Falcon on Jakku it just fizzled out. Kylo was the best of the bunch. Still, it does feel thrown together on the fly, mostly.

 

That's fine. I'm just saying I don't think JJ goes for deeper meaning in his stories. At least not with parallel characters having the same-ish story line.

Like. Take the scene in TROS, where they're in the desert looking for the dagger. They're being chased by the FO at Mach 5 on the speeder. Suddenly, they get blown up and randomly land on quicksand. Which just happens to be the exact spot where the dagger is. If the FO hadn't blown up them up at the exact second when they did, they would have flown over this spot instantly, and would never have found the dagger. Is that "the Force" or just crappy writing?

Because JJ has used this set up before. It reminds of Star Trek Into Darkness. The Enterprise is desperately to reach Earth, while being chased by another Federation ship, all while in warp. The other ship is firing on them, and suddenly, they're blown out of warp speed and 'land', exactly at the moon. Right where they wanted to be in the first place. But if the other ship hadn't fired on them, at literally that exact moment they had, the Enterprise would have warped past the moon, past the Earth, and probably past our solar system. Was "the Force" working here too?

It's the same narrative .. erm.. device. And it doesn't make sense really. Right? I mean both are illogical set ups. But JJ isn't really ever concerned with plot logistics. He just cares about how you feel in that moment. Or does he? Are both of these mirrored scenes from two different franchises trying to say something deeper? Or is JJ just reaching into his conventional story-telling set ups because ... that's just it.

 

Let’s say you only know how to play a couple of chords on a guitar and when you’re band starts playing, those are the only chords you contribute with. I’m perfectly fine if it makes sense that you play those chords when you play them. I’m not fine if it doesn’t make sense to play them and I’m somewhat disappointed if it makes sense but I can come up with more harmonious chords to play. What I’m saying is the “chords” of two somewhat similar character journeys for these specific characters make enough sense to be fine with, regardless of whether or not the way they are played leaves something to be desired. I don’t see better, more appropriate chords to play, though I do feel there might be better ways of playing them.

 

"Be With Me" sounds like a Michelle Branch song from 2003.

 

I just want to thank you for introducing the word “ambulatory” to me Hard to believe I’ve reached 43 years of age without ever reading it or hearing it used before.

 

To keep on that theme... I think if the Lucas era SW was a 4 or 5 chord song, Abrams et al took the chords they liked most and created a two chord song. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with characters on similar arcs etc., but I think the ST more often defaults to cutting and pasting beats it believes popular, rather than trying to construct rhyming poetry of something it believes in etc.

 

And...Rey's ascension into goddesshood continues.
https://screenrant.com/star-wars-rey-kylo-ren-force-heal-dark-side/
Presumably this also explains why Kylo died saving Rey, but she didn't die saving him.

 

I prefer “goddess Rey” to “irrationally horny Rey,” personally.

 

Well, she never got horny with anyone did she - except perhaps BB8....

 

Happybirthday to Daisy Ridley.