Full Series Savage Opress

This article helps to answer a question for fans about whether the Nightsisters are using the Force..."The Nightsisters still live on Dathomir and they still possess mysterious Force skills, now called magicks." Like Ventress, Maul, and Savage - I always believed Talzin was force sensitive as well, especially considering she was the most powerful being from the planet. I believe she lied in season 6 to protect her true nature and power.

http://www.starwars.com/news/the-nightsisters-from-dathomir-a-history

 

When Savage blocked that knive-attack of Sugi on Maul, and when he shouldered the Duchess Satine it came into my mind that Savage is a big left-hander.

 

He's right hand dominate, training to use the other hand in combat is pretty normal occurrence. If your good hand/arm goes you need the other one to be pretty good at as well otherwise you'd be helpless or dead.

 

Opress Unleashed is an excerpt from this book, and he does not appear again afterwards. His brief inclusion and the FCBD thing was just to promote the character.

 

I just saw the episode that introduced this character. So appearly, Vantress n the horn headed aliens are of the same bred or a a cross breed of some sort. The Dooku getting ride of Ventress idea was cool, but Savage Opress seemed like a Darth Maul knockoff. I always thought the Darth Maul aliens had their own planet. All and all from what I am seeing so for, it seems a little confusing.

 

That is an interesting thought I never considered to be the reason that Talzin revealed Savage to the Jedi. But given the chance Dooku would have made a mistake and Ventress and Savage could have really killed him - couldn't Talzin still send Savage searching for Maul afterwards - together with Ventress? Then he wouldn't have been that frustrated and enraged - so alone an forlorn he was at this month-consuming mission in the Outer Rim.

Thank you! That is exactly what I presumed . And that is the reason I didn't buy "Strange Allies". And the cover of "Opress Unleashed" is appealing to me much more too
.

 

Had Talzin timed things differently, I think the Nightbrothers / Nightsisters could have wiped out the Sith. If Savage had more time and training, he and Ventress could have possibly taken Dooku. Had Dooku been killed, Ventress, Savage, Maul, and Talzin could have confronted Sidious together - and he'd be dead.

 

They can't do that since those characters are in the movies, so working inbetween movies presents an annoying problem and limitations. Plus if the writers or supervising director like a certain character over another or wants it this way over that way, despite continuity issues and even anachronisms elsewhere its problematic. Maul couldve killed Grevous alteast twice in SOD, and he couldve easily killed Dooku, but they made sure Dooku and Maul did not have a duel so they kept them apart in that regard. Talzin travels off world, so its unclear why she herself did not rescue Maul 12 years earlier, he was of her blood and she saw him through the orb. Seems the talisman could only be activated by someone of Zabrak blood and kin, hence Opress. But the story is muddled at various points. I think she only fashioned the Talisman once she felt Opress was direct kin and she later used his blood or something to find out Maul was still alive and off camera this all occured and I guess the orb vision was only known to her when we saw it for the first time along with Opress. Talzin ratted out Opress' location as if she did not want a battle or to kill Jedi, she left that part out when she told Ventress to speed up the plan.So she endangered Ventress along with the rest as well. Opress almost killed Dooku and Ventress at the same time, and once unleashed and no longer held chained worrying about a master in either Ventress or Dooku, he could have well killed them. Dooku and Ventress both fled from him. Kenobi and Skywalker showing up ruined the 3 way duel so we will never know. Opress tore through both of those two Jedi pretty easily on two occasions by himself. The writing and action/force powers are also inconsistent in TCW which is another issue.

Another problem is that each SOD comic is what 5-7 minute read and not a near half hour episode so a lot was cut obviously. Plus whatever reel footage we never got to see that was cut during the episodes we did see.

I would like to know the original storyline for Opress and the full complete storyline for Maul but it isnt likely we'll learn more cause Maul is a character that will be around again and to be used in the new continuity.

 

Obviously. It was hypothetical.

 

Yea, am just thinking and typing out loud. Guess they could've been making it as they went along and why there is issues, and Lucas couldve wanted changes and had his own idea of the storyline which was different from what Filoni and his writing group had in mind or wanted. Filoni wanted to kill Maul off(again) but was told no , cause Lucas brought him back to tell a story and all the trouble to bring the character back in the first place, so he killed off Opress instead basically.

 

Hi Vorax,

Clear that the trilogie's story must be obeyed. It is just because The Shadow Emperor wrote that Talzin wanted Savage to fail on Dooku that he is free (sic!) to search for Maul afterwards. I just don't see a contradiction between the anticipated victory over Dooku and the rescue of Maul afterwards. Or might Talzin have tought that a victorious Savage after killing Dooku wouldn't care about his roots and kin anymore?

 

I dont get the impression she wanted him to fail but who knows what the writers had in their minds. Logically it doenst make much sense. She seems to have wanted it rushed forward to either succeed or be simply scrapped in favor of another plan(which she did not inform Ventress). Maul did the same thing, once a plan failed, he came up with another quickly. That part of the story is mainly Ventress' tale which finished up in Massacre. She also wanted Ventress to give up the Sith and the absurd war between the Jedi and the Sith and become a Nightsister. Had all gone according to that plan, would she of still informed Ventress of Maul, plus Talzin got herself involved in that same absurd war she wanted ventress to get out've by trying to kill Dooku(like 3 x) and later bringing Maul back to enact his revenge.

When Talzin put her hand on Opress after Ventress brought him before her, I think she realized who he was and what he could do and when he survived the Jedi, Dooku and even Ventress, he proved himself able to break the spell which was probably a near impossible thing to accomplish. She only set Opress on the quest after he overcame all the manipulation. I think she wanted him to prove he is strong and worthy as she despises weakness in a male and any son of hers. She is also breaking Nightsister tradition by having these side missions with her sons, so she may of needed to be more indirect per her order's code. I cant make too much sense outve the story cause of the way it was written. I do think Talzin couldve taught Opress herself the ways of the darkside and she appeared to be a capable lightsaber duelist when she held her on against Windu(who is normally regarded as near as skilled as Yoda, Jinn was under Yoda before he died at the hands of Maul). If she was not permitted to teach the males, then 30-40 years ago why then didnt the Nightsisters banish her for allying with Sidious? What was the old Sith and Nightsister alliance about that Dooku spoke of and what jam did Dooku help her with years ago? Talzin hoped Ventress wouldve found her way to the clan much sooner, and she takes it personal that Dooku betrayed and tried to kill Ventress which is similar to Sidious' betrayal of her son Maul years earlier as the discarded.

However Talzin never informed Ventress of her son Maul, which makes no sense, and its one of the major flaws in the storyline. Ventress ruined her son Maul's revenge and couldve gotten her son killed or she couldve gotten herself killed and over who, Kenobi? Made 0 sense.

Plus Dooku was a very capable warrior, and to want Opress to fail would in no way guarantee either Ventress or Opress would live another day. Plus the Nightsisters and Talzin would be a target which they were. The only one that dueled Yoda to an actual equal stalemate was Dooku during AOTC , so that is major balls thinking Ventress or Savage(with 2-3 months training or whatever) would killed Dooku when her prior plan by sending Ventress and her two best warriors to kill failed. Talzin only got directly involved with the voodoo doll on Dooku after he launched an attack on Dathomir in retaliation for the attempts on his life - even then its inclear wheather or not she could kill him with it as she wanted him to call off the attack which he refused so if there was a way she shouldve just stopped playing around and killed him and pull outve the area to help Daka fight off the Droids.

The only thing I can figure in this mess of arcs, is that Talzin only got involved full fledged in SOD due to the fact that Sidious punished Maul and rejected her son's attempt at returning to his side and killed Opress. Looks like she brought him back to give him another chance at being Sidious' apprentice and kill off Dooku. If Maul's idea of building the Shadow Collective and wanting to kill Dooku just to be given another chance as being a Sith Apprentice was indeed true words to Sidious, then this is what really angered Talzin and not particularly wholly what occurred on Naboo. Only after Lawless did Maul actually break the chains of the Sith apprentice condition, he woke up after being tortured and realized his true enemy was Sidious not Kenobi. Maul in TWC was stll semi-trapped in the teachings and deluded into believing he was still Sidious' apprentice and there was hope for him to return to his side but he was replaced. Sidious took one look at Opress and Maul together and knew these two were too powerful and rivals. Had Maul been alone Sidious possibly took the offer and wouldve pinned Maul against Tyranus to see who is the strongest. Maul had by himself built the Shadow Collective and took control of Mandalore, plus killed Jedi in the process and broke Kenobi. But also by this time Sidious wanted to Anakin so he had options. Plus Sidious was truthfully surprised Maul survived, and in a deranged and deviously delighted manner felt proud. Maul was something of a son to him and to have his teachings be implemented by a student and surpassing a Masters expectations that had to instill something within Sidious and likely why he rescued Vader instead of finishing him off as another failure.

 

I think foolish Ventress herself broke her own spell by cursing on Savage and calling him names. That is not the way, an apprentice should be treated. I know that.

When I think it through, every path for Savage in the end leads to Darth Sidious. When he really would be able to kill Dooku together with Ventress, Sidious would have shown up and he would do just like Dooku did before and ask Savage to kill Ventress, for he was the one who urged Dooku to put her astray and to kill her. Then he could take Savage as his new apprentice till Anakin would be ready to replace him. Can you imagine Savage Opress being the new cover-face of the CIS? Or he could just duel both Ventress and Savage. Ventress is no match for him and Savage would have been toyed like he was toyed in the fight together with his brother Maul against his former master. Sidious just waited till he found the opportunity to deal a most sophisticated and elegant blow to stab his opponent in a lethal way.

 

Opress I think regained his memory through his will power overcoming the dark magiks, which would imply only the strongest of will and not weak mind which could imply a natural connection to the Force, however the authors remind us that Savage is on Force steroids which I guess exist in the Star Wars Universe now,lol. Dooku was not able to break the spell of Talzin with the voodoo doll alone, for that he needed an agent present to kill the source directly. That said, the writers inserting " I was never like you", is strange and I suppose from their point of view in that episode admitted that he was an imitation of Maul and not a natural force wielder. If that is the case, than Talzin must've used up a lot of her own and the clan's force ability by pouring it into Savage - if that is the case why would they waste it on a unworthy, a male to them would be like an ultimate insult, why not just pour all that dark force energy unto Ventress(there was even a What If scenerio in some comic with her wearing Opress like gear). Another demension is that Savage was good natured and caring and not a sadistic animal which was Talzin turned him into and what Sidious turned Maul into basically, this darkside visious was not natural to Savage. He was more a noble warrior with honor, he was turned inside out through evil by others, much like Maul as he did not choose the darkside on his own it was chosen for him by the Nightsisters and Sidious. Had Maul been born in the Republic he couldve been a great Jedi Knight - I think Kenobi saw the potential and tried reaching out to Maul but he was still under Sidious' Sith Apprentice programming. Talzin I can pretty much surmise brought back Maul to kill Dooku and avenge the Nightsisters probably also thinking Sidious upon seeing Maul again and all these accomplishments would welcome him back as his apprentice. Her end game was never explained which is why we're still talking about but they never offered any real answers or conclusions.

Talzin only appears in SOD after her son was rejected by Sidious, it is unknown if Talzin aided the Mandalorians in rescuing him, there is no mention of direct or indirect involvement, supposedly Rook and Saxon followed Sidious' ship directly from Mandalore immediately after his capture. Sidious suspects Talzin aided Maul, but he seems to think she is the real leader while she played no part in Maul's operations after healing him by exorcising the demons. Talzin by the 2nd issue is able to manifest herself from out've Maul's body which was something he was never shown doing nor was there any reason for the audience to think this as it was never done prior or talked about even in passing beforehand anywhere in the storyline. If she wanted to help Maul she could joined him directly after she healed him. The Nightsisters had access to ships, they shouldve just fled Dathomir after the debacle of Ventress and Savage but for some reason she remains there in the open as they are not really a secret or well hidden and open to and susceptible to mass invasions ad visits from Jedi Knights.

 

There are certainly parallels when it comes to Savage and Maul - they were both "shaped" by someone else, in order to serve a greater power. Had they been born on a planet other than Dathomir, they could have both followed a different path. I don't think either have redeemed themselves though, even after Savage broke the "spell" Ventress had on him, he was still a ruthless killer. Perhaps Maul will change at some point, but the anger and hatred he showed during SoD isn't likely to dissipate.

 

That is funny. In "The wrath of Darth Maul", the Mandalorians are aiding Talzin in finding Maul at Orsis where she takes his blood for the Talisman, she gave Opress much later. Thus Maul is found by her thrice.

When Ventress in "Revenge" was in Chalmun's Spacehaven Kantina to take the datas of Savage, does this mean, she reserves this bounty-hounter-job for herself and no other bounty hunter is allowed then to hunt for Savage too anymore?

 

I just remember Talzin's words, when she told Ventress to go to the Nightbrother's settlement to look for a candidate who's suitable to mete out the revenge on treacherous Dooku together with her. She didn't tell Ventress: Go and ask where Darth Maul's brother is hanging out now. So what if Savage is not really a brother of Maul but just the most suitable companion you could ever ask for? Nevertheless, Savage behaved most brotherly to Maul at all.

And I admire his social skills how to lure Maul away from Lotho Minor which was surely not easy. He seemed to have a wit to understand easily without much to ask what has to be done and what not. For example how he talked to Morley without giving much information of himself but gaining as much information as possible. Savage could be a tough interrogator or inquisitor. It would be nice to see how his search for Maul went along before he came to Stobar where he found the dusty turtle-tanker.

 

The writers didnt always do a good job keeping the characters consistent in abilities and mindset/personality characters like Maul, Opress, Talzin and Ventress I think suffered from this to various extents.

 

Perhaps Talzin was able to foresee that Ventress would pick Savage because he was the strongest of the Nightbrothers and came from the same bloodline. If Savage is Talzin's son, as Maul is, perhaps she wanted Savage to further prove himself, like Maul did with Sidious.

 

Talzin spoke of Maul in the past tense as if she knew him to be dead, it is unclear how she would know this as she has not seen him since he was a child from what we're told. In "Massacre" Ventress was gone a while as if she was embarrassed and/or afraid to return to Dathomir to face Talzin, a place she had no other choice but to go back to as he's in hiding and needs protection. She tried passing the blame on Savage there typical of villains. Talzin was as coy as ever but she had by that time sent Savage on his own quest which she never informed Ventress of. She never once bothered to ally Ventress with Opress in a way suitable for an actual alliance not a disposable asset slave attack dog on a leash, she also never bothered to inform her of her Son who would've been a more ideal partner in the first place.

Talzin goes so far to try and lure Ventress away from the Sith and the absurd galactic conflict by making her a Nightsister and indoctrinate her. If all these other plans worked then there is no reason why she would of bought back her son if she knew he was alive beforehand he wouldve just rotted away in exile. The Talzin in SOD is different from what we saw on the show itself. Savage is not mentioned at all and TCW Talzin had no interest in the galactic conflict or revenge against anybody. Ventress activated a chain of events, it was not something planned by Talzin which makes a world of difference of what these writers were aiming for or story they were trying to tell and sell to an audience. If Ventress never went to Dathomir, Talzin had no interest in seeking out a son among the Nightbrothers. Seems once Ventress brought Savage back, she examined his blood and realized it was a son, she sold this off to Dooku(while Ventress was not present) of Savage being of the same bloodline as Darth Maul and being of the same caliber. Somewhere off camera again, she placed Savage's blood into her orb and saw that Maul was alive and not dead she then used Savage instead of herself to locate Maul but she watched his progress and helped guide him through her medallion which probably contained her essence. Had Savage been killed she likely would've left Dathomir(which she appears to do secretly or whatever the case as she leads a male religious Force sect off world where she's worshipped as a Goddess) to find Maul herself at this point.

 

Yeah, Vorax,

Ventress had her chance to reconcile with Savage and to get to know Maul at Raydonia. She preferred to side with Obi-Wan. Thus Mother Talzin knew what she did by not telling Ventress about Savage's new mission.

BTW : In "shades of reason" Savage threw that blonde Mando woman to hang on that edge to be rescued by the Death Watch. "Walk faster, weaklings!" Then he turned his look behind. To see that the woman is surely rescued in real care for her or just controlling the Death Watch that they carry out the plans that Maul has set for them?

 

Savage may of been bi-polar due to the darkside, like a tug of war, the inner conflict that many borderline or darkside force sensitives go through between the light and the dark, good and evil, right and wrong ect. At first he was helping and then gonna spare that stupid snake on Lotho but once he was betrayed angrily killed it. Same thing with Feral, at first he refused Ventress' commands until she worked up his anger.

 

Maybe there is a difference in passing the trials of the night or choosing a mate. Somebody wrote here, that if nightsisters would always use such a procedure for choosing a mate like Ventress did with the nightbrothers, it would be a huge loss of human lives for that village. As far as I know, for choosing a mate, the nightsister just encircles the male of her choice and then the hand-to-hand combat starts to overwhelme him - or to surrender and leave - or to be killed by the victorious man.

Now, when I red Ryder Windham's "Wrath of Darth Maul" again, there is written that Talzin promised Maul, when she was trying to abduct him from Orsis to Dathomir, she would turn him into a warrior with tenfold forces and with large deadly horns after passing the trials of anger, nightfall and elevation, when I translated that from German into Englisch correctly. Obviously that were the exams Savage went through. And Wyndham already knew about Season 3 of TCW and of Savage because he is showing up at the end of his novel.

And Talzin didn't promise Maul at Orsis that he may be chosen from the most beautiful nightsister to become her mate when going back to Dathomir and to pass that trials. Thus I summon that Ventress didn't betray the nightbrothers by telling neither Brother Viscus nor Savage that she is not looking for a mate but for a companion for special purposes. She didn't have to tell Viscus. He already knew about that, I guess, after being aware of the big dimension of the competition she demanded.

But maybe Savage didn't know because such event may happen very seldom amongst the nightbrothers.

 

I just read the book. Seems Talzin went to Osris thinking Sidious abandoned him, so went to go rescue him. Upon learning Sidious did not, Talzin left(secretly taking some of his blood for the talisman). Sidious apparently felt the whole thing was a misunderstanding at this point allowed the witches to leave unscathed by his hand. I think this also goes more towards the theory Maul was brought back by Talzin for his his chance to reclaim his destiny at Sidious' side. Sidious instead chose Dooku outve fear of Maul and Opress who had become too powerful and rivals as there was two of them(and he senced Talzin I guess in Opress. So, chose instead to destroy Maul. Once this happened Talzin got involved to resscue her son or aid his war against his unappreciative former master who by this time wanted to punish Talzin for her transgressions for has been meddling in bring Maul back and attempting to kill his current apprentice.

 

The abandoning of Maul as an apprentice of Sidious was sealed by two things:
1. The fall of Naboo, when Sidious didn't feel Maul's need for help, taking another apprentice, Dooku, instead. Or Sidious felt it, but didn't want an apprentice anymore who failed twice in one mission, to slay the Jedi, which was his ultimate purpose for Sidious. So or the other way, Sidious was fed up with Maul.

2. When Savage was the one who rescued Maul with Talzin's aid from Lotho Minor, not Sidious. Why should Maul come back to Sidious, after he presented himself to the Jedi, demanding revenge from Obi-Wan? At first at this time Sidious could have signalize that he still has interest in Maul as an apprentice or another aide to his goals. But he didn't react but in a condoning laissez-faire to Maul's and Savage's actions to bother and occupy the Jedi even more. But what could Maul have done, if Sidious would ever approach him in this manner at this early stage? Or later in the throne-room at Sundari? Savage would have been "the horse", which is not needed anymore. Because he is detracting to much attention from Maul. Brothers are no Sith-Concept, when there is a master like Sidious around. If Sidious would have kept any interest in Maul, he would have asked him at least at Mandalore to kill his brother Savage to demonstrate his loyalty to Sidious. And I think Sidious was smart enough to realize that Maul wouldn't comply to such a demand, like Luke didn't much later in favour of Vader, which Sidious wasn't smart or young enough to realize anymore.

And after learned that Dooku is the new apprentice to Sidious, either from Savage or from other sources, why should Maul abandon Savage and go back to Coruscant all by himself to tell Sidious: "Hi, I'm finally back from Naboo. What's my next mission?"