So Luke knows Vapaad....

In the James Luceno interview by the Robotech people, it was asked if Luke was using Vaapad during the fight in Shimmra's throne room.

Luceno said he liked that interpretation and it fit with his idea of what Luke was using.

sooooooo what does this mean for the Jedi Grandmaster?

 

That he can do Vaapad?

 

True, though I think it's probably more likely Juyo unless Mace Windu left his notebook lying around Ben's place.

 

It's more likely a form akin to Vaapad that Luke created himself. We assume he didn't learn it from a holocron or anything, since few Jedi knew it and only one had really mastered it. So Luke took the necessary steps and improved his own fighting style in such a way as to create another super-form which shares certain characteristics with Vaapad.

I personally hate the forms and think Luke is just that good a fighter. But if you're looking for a forms explanation, then Luke likely created it himself after studying all the information he'd learned from holocrons, from Ben and Yoda, from Palpatine, etc.

 

Now of course this is "Fanon" but the way I rectified the Darth Bane situation and the way I could rectify this as being Vaapad is as follows.

There are only certain ways to fight with a lightsaber that allow you to truly tap into the force. Many of the forms have been recorded and have accurate descriptions and teachings, but a few times people have independently came up with Vaapad and had the knowledge lost along the way. The Sith use it during the War against the Jedi...the feel and look of it is that of a Vaapad so they call it as such. It may vary in Mace Windu's version...which he comes up with himself many years later...but it still looks and feels like it's predator namesake. Luke, apparently knowing little about the nature of forms, decides he needs to use the most aggressive form he has ever tried and in turn uses something similar to Vaapad...although he does not name it as such.

There are only so many effective ways you can fight. Early humans from all over most like first developed the "Club" as a weapon. After that, a "Spear" and a "Bow and arrow" type thing. If we found a club in Africa and a Club in North America that Carbon Dated to the same year...we wouldn't draw the conclusion that someone went around spreading knowledge of the club...but that the club was developed by each culture. I know I am really oversimplifying lightsaber forms.....but I think it's the best way to convey my thought.

Apart from that, what in the heck was Luke doing using Vaapad? All this talk about remaining in the light during the fight with the Vong...The struggles with Kyp...Jaina's slight outrage...Jacen's "Force Anxiety" and here the Grandmaster shows that teetering on the dark side is truly the most effective way of dealing with a dangerous foe. I refuse to believe that Luke couldn't be just as effective coming out blazing in his traditional Djem So Skywalker form. When I think of Luke I still think of RoTJ luke with him taking huge swipes with that saber against the scum on the sail barge and against Vader. No elegence, no crazy acrobatics...just plain strength.

Carnage

 

Luke knows Vaapad? Give me a break!

 

Luke probably knows form 7, but not Mace's variant of it.

Anyways he's a full powered Skywalker, who managed to reach the level that his father didn't. He was just letting the Force flow through him. If it was Vaapad, then the essence of Mace must have Force downloaded it into him..

 

Charles, I listened, and it's Vaypid. Not Vap-ad.

Swear to God, I'm the only person who played Force Commander.

 

Yeah, I saw those comments.

Jassen sounds better.

 

Charles, Charles, Charles.

You're a strange man.

 

And you Havoc, seem to have a habit of understating things.

Carnage

 

Read Shatterpoint again. Vapaad is not only a variation/completion of a sword form, but it is - perhaps more importantly -a mind/body technique, a state of mind that one can strive to achieve while fighting. It is presumably linked to Juyo because Juyo is the only form that allows for the sort of aggression necessary.

When looked at this way, it's not hard to believe that Luke's using Vapaad, but he just doesn't call it that, or doesn't necessarily know he's doing anything special. At this point in time, the Jedi had temporarily abandoned their belief in the dark side, so that sort of skirting-the-edge probably wasn't seen as problematic or risky, as they'd stopped believing in an edge.

 

I'm with BobaMatt on this.

 

Same here..

 

And Vapaad worms it's way deeper and deeper into the Star Wars mythos.....

Lightsaber forms are bogus. We all know it. There probably are combat forums, but not like the lame ones we've been presented with. "Oh man, in this Sith form, they use taunts and jeers to lower and opponent's self-esteem. And this one form is sooo killer, you have to draw on the Dark Side to use it." Give me a kriffing break.

 

I tend to think of saber forms as various martial arts forms and/or sword arts(saber, rapier, epee etc..)

Some are purely combat styles and some are deeper..


Give me a kriffing break.

 

Indeed, but how many different mind/body techniques can there be? Mind/Body techniques conducive to fighting, anyway.

Carnage

 

Imagine the following conversation:

Shimmra: You're using Bonetti's defense against me, ah?
Luke: I thought it fitting, considering the rocky terrain --
Shimmra: Naturally, you must expect me to attack with Capo Ferro --
Luke: -- naturally -- but I find Thibault cancels out Capo Ferro, don't you?

 

That would be kinda funny..

 

I think Luke has studied lots of different forms. He could have a mix of styles.

 

Look here.

 

It means nothing, as we've learned from other author interviews. None of that is taken into account until it either becomes canon at some later date or, more likely, never does...

 

Yes but some of us might well be interested in interpretation in addition to facts Mr. Moderator man.

But thanks for the update.

 

I'm not sure what you mean. I think we're in agreeance, at least in part, having read your original post...

...so...

...yeah.

 

Nice..