Sure looked like Darth Maul had the high ground to me

I'll let you know when I figure that one out.

 

Touche'

 

I got pwned.

 

Regardless, there can be no doubt this is a punk ass death scene - higher ground indeed. I'd think Maul had the highest ground possible, ya know, like 15 feet straight up. But I digress, since the slow-mo levitation move by Kenobi SOMEHOW caught Maul unawares...

File under: Will of The Force

 

The high ground is more of a metaphor than placement of heights. This is why I love Lucas, he's such a smart writer. In TPM, Maul has the physical high ground but Obi Wan has the mental high ground. The darkside clouds thought and makes you believe your more powerful than you actually are. Maul in TPM is standing above Obi Wan, gloating and just teasing Obi Wan with saber swipes as he just hangs there.

Obi Wan, however, is so calm within the force he moves the lightsaber to the edge slowly, and is able to jump over him with a swipe to the stomach, cutting him in half.

ROTS Anakin is standing there 100% sure he's going to be the victor of the fight because of how powerful he's become. The power and the darkness inside him intoxicates him clouding his thought and he is unable to see the calm and control that Obi Wan has. Anakin leaps at him with such force he's unable to block the blade and is defeated.

 

he caught maul unawares because he used a jedi mind trick to confuse him before he jumped over him.watch the scene againbi realises that qui gons saber is nearby and faces maul and concentrates,close up on maul as he looks confused whle obi takes advantage of this,jumps over him and finishes him.
maybe if anakin had used the same mind trick on obi in rots then it would have been kenobi ending up deep fried in the lava

 

Mind tricks only work on the weak minded. Someone with a strong mind will not fall for one. In other words, they are fine for stupid Stormtroopers stuck on Tatooine, but they wouldn't work on someone more strong willed, such as oh, a Sith Lord or Jedi. Maul died because he was an arrogant fool who decided to toy with Kenobi before finishing him off, and simply wasn't smart enough to anticipate a move like Kenobi did. Kenobi kept his head, and walked away from the fight. Maul lost his head, ended up dead. Maul's latent stupidity and complete lack of situational awareness got him killed, not a Jedi mind trick. A mind trick would have been useless against a Sith Lord.

 

he caught maul unawares because he used a jedi mind trick to confuse him before he jumped over him.watch the scene againbi realises that qui gons saber is nearby and faces maul and concentrates,close up on maul as he looks confused whle obi takes advantage of this,jumps over him and finishes him.
maybe if anakin had used the same mind trick on obi in rots then it would have been kenobi ending up deep fried in the lava[/quote]

I always associated that look on Maul's face as him getting p.o'd that Obi is still sitting there looking determined and not getting afraid. Maul probably guessed that Obi was trying something, which confused and then angered him, possibly clouding his perception of what Obi was actually doing. Besides, Maul kicked Obi's saber down the shaft, he didn't expect Obi to have one when he landed. Still, that's no excuse for a Sith Lord to allow a Jedi to regain level ground. Who knows? Maybe it was just Maul's inexperience catching up with him. Also, you can't underestimate the will of a competitor who's pushed to the very brink of elimination ('04 Boston Red Sox, for instance). Maul just figured that this guy just lost his master, is just a padawan, is hanging on a ledge and can't possibly come back from this. But, we all know what happened next...

 

i still think obi used some kind of mind trick.get out your dvd and watch it again:just before obi jumps over maul he looks directly at him and from the look on his face he is obviously concentrating SOMETHING at maul.maul thn looks confused and obi makes his move.thats how i see it anyway.maybe qui gon taught obi something yoda would never approve of?

 

It was more like shock than stupidity. He was shocked to see someone escape such a dire situation, especially when he thought he was down and defenseless. Having a weapon in his hand when he did land in front of him was even more of a surprise to him, a weapon which was forgotten made him feel more dumbfounded that he had not gotten rid of it when he had the chance. I remember when I first saw the movie, and thinking he would jump backwards to the other side of the shaft, but was surprised he leapt over him. I'm sure we all thought he would do the same thing, right? See? We were both surprised.

 

A New Hope
OBI WAN KENOBI:
The Force can have a strong influence on the weak-minded. You will find it a powerful ally.

Attack of the Clones
PADME:
Are you going to use one of your Jedi mind tricks on me?

ANAKIN:
They only work on the weak-minded. You are anything but weak-minded.


So, are you then suggesting that Palpatine had a weak minded apprentice? The Star Wars films establish that Jedi Mind Tricks only work on the weak minded...So, if you maintain that he used one on Maul, and that it actually worked, it makes Darth Maul look even worse as a villian for being incredibly weak minded, and it makes Sidious look worse, for not even training Maul to be tough enough to resist a simple Mind Trick. Again, Maul's death had nothing to do with a Jedi Mind Trick, as Maul would have been far too strong willed for it to have possibly worked.

Indeed, if a simple Jedi Mind Trick would have worked on Maul, why didn't Obi Wan simply tell Maul to jump in the pit, rather than just stand there for a few seconds? Why didn't either he or Qui Gon suggest to Maul earlier that he should lay down his lightsaber? If Maul was susceptable to something as simple as that, there would have been no need for the fight at all...

 

im just going on the evidence i see in the film.why does maul look confused before obi jumps.the look on mauls face to me before he does is''huh? what? did he just try to use a mind trick on me?.maybe they do indeed work on the weak minded but maybe a good enough jedi can use one to distract even a sith momentarily.commanding maul to jump into the pit,maybe not!

 

Maul can sense Obi-wan's thoughts and feelings at the moment. He goes from despair to calm certainity. He can sense that Obi-wan is about to do something, but he cannot figure out what it is he is doing. Maul can also sense Obi-wan drawing upon the Force around him, which is also puzzling. Obi-wan doesn't perform the mind trick. He is getting ready to act purely on instinct, which leaves Maul unable to tell what is about to happen. Obi-wan is in that moment one with the Living Force.

 

excellent post.that convinces me thats what really happens in that scene.i guess that takes care of that!

 

Its only the second time he posted that too

And I still think Dooku had the best death. Hes a punk, so he got punked by palps. And then got his head chopped off. What more do you want?

 

Okay finally some people who see the flaw of the Episode One movie, I mean come on Darth Maul was better than both Qui-Gon Jin annd Obi-Wan. He fought the two of them at the same time with ease and even Killed the Jedi Master. But then he gets killed by some scruffy little punk that hasnn't even passed apprenticeship! The only reason that Darth Maul died is really very simple, George Lucas wanted him to. That's it I mean Darth Maul was better than Obi-Wan in so many ways it's not even funny. I mean just look at the lightsaber combat style that Darth Maul uses, It's a variiation of Form VII: Vaapad called Juyo. It focuses on ones lust for the fight and harnesses the dark side of ones emotions. This automatically gives Maul the upper hand since he is in face a SITH. Plus Maul is a exceptional user of the force but does he use it more than the simple push? No he didn't, Then to top it all off he does nothing durinng the time of Obi-Wans jump. Throughout the rest of the movie Darth Maul was faster than a speeding bullet by then he has to space out.

I just like Darth Maul a little XD

 

I never understood why Obi Wan asked Anakin to concede because he had the high ground. Anakin had previously fought Count Dooku on a set of stairs, which would have given Dooku the high ground.

I think the real advantage is that Anakin had very limited options about where he could go. The "low ground" in front of Obi Wan was too hot for even a Sith to stand on without catching fire. Obi Wan also knew about the leap and swing the sword trick, so it would not work on him. (Anakin tried the same move Obi Wan used to defeat Darth Maul, only Obi Wan was prepared for it)

 

The resemblence of Obi Wan's low ground vs. Anakin's low ground, is obvious symbolism.

I really don't understand why this isn't understood!

 

so if what you are saying is true then kenobi should have been severly injured as well but since that didn't happen you my friend are wrong.

LONG LIVE DARTH MAUL

 

No you obviously missed it.

Obi Wan used focus, determination, and the lightside to over come his low, while Anakin was reckless, unfocused, and full of hatred and failed.

 

Darth Maul is DEAD. He was a throwaway badguy, only filling a minor role in TPM because Lucas wasn't smart enough to have made Dooku's turn a part of the movie...Darth Maul was only created to allow Obi-Wan to KILL HIM, to help establish Kenobi as a great Jedi, and to ensure that Anakin is trained by him, not Qui Gonn. He served NO purpose whatsoever other than that. He was expendable. But, if you want to insist that Obi-Wan used the mind trick on Maul, go right ahead...but, if you do that, you have to accept the following:

1. Darth Maul was a weak minded fool. There are multiple instances in the Star Wars movies that say mind tricks ONLY work on the weak minded...therefore, if Obi-Wan's was successful, it means Maul was a weak minded nitwit, which only adds to the arguments of people like me, who think Maul was a mere placeholder, in our position that Maul lacked the capability to lead the droid army, such as Dooku was capable of.

2. It also means that Obi-Wan, even as a padawan, had a stronger grasp of the force than Maul, apprentice to arguably the greatest Sith lord ever. If a mere padawan was able to apply a mind trick on Maul that he couldn't resist, it takes away Maul fanboy arguments that Kenobi merely got "lucky". If his mind trick was strong enough to confuse a Sith lord, then obviously you Maul fanboys aren't giving Kenobi the credit he deserves, or if you refuse to do that, then you have to admit that since it worked, and Obi-Wan was just a padawan, then Maul was almost worthless as a force user. So, either Kenobi is better than you want to admit, or Maul was worse. Which is it?

 

there are many flaws with your idea

1. Maul is faster than Qui-Gon-Jinn and Obi-Wan combined
2. Maul had the better combat style for the area
3. Maul is quite adept at using the force
4. Maul is exceptionally strong
5. Maul has a vast knowledge of combat
6. obi-wan doesn't didn't have the lightside and was calling on the Darkside at the moment
7. obi-wan was focused because his mind was shrouded in other thoughts

so once again you are wrong

 

I don't think there was a mind-trick involved. Simply Obi Wan's ability to escape the situation using focus and light-side powers.

Maul was undoubtedly strong, he was a reflection of who Anakin would become, but the light-side simply won in this instance.

 

I agree that Maul was weak. Just because he looks cool, he get waaay more respect than he should. Maul is a glorified asassin. Tyranus would absolutely run circles around Maul. Palpatine wants who ever is strongest. And, since the Sith were operating in secret, Maul would do. He can kill people and do a lot of other Palpatine's errands. But once Palpatine finds someone that is stronger, than Maul's history. He really didn't do much in TPM, he killed Qui-Gon who was no duelist. He had Kenobi on the ropes and then decided to spark him to death. Maul obviously lacked good judgement, again I will say the guy looked really cool, but he is nothing special, very run-of-the-mill.

 

Alright first off Darth Maul deserves nay Commands more respect than that, he is one of the greatest characters ever made in the Star Wars unniverse if no the best. As for the mind trick thing who the hell in their right mind would say that?! I mean just look at Darth Maul and all the training he has done to perfect his bodily technique as well as his spiritual connection to the force.

I however agree with you on the Lucas part, he may be a giften man who created this great thing but he killed off a great character to early. I mean he managed to screw up an extremely good movie with the last part of the film. The death of Darth Maul was poorly constructed and rushed. He dominated the entire battle then gets killed as his enemy slowly jumpes up and over him to slice him in two. The attack could be easily blocked by simply activating his lightsaber.

As for the mind trick, it is a idotic claim that holds no ground against Maul since he is obviously a gifted user of the force as well as a tactical fighter. He planned out his attack and waited for the right time to attack. His ability to track the jedi is only further proof of his brains.

For your claim of Obi-wan having a better grasp of the force, If he was so powerful with it then why did Maul push him back a long ways. If you have even read anything about Maul you would know that he is one of the greatest force users of the sith. Later on in the series he comes back and battles vader as a spirit.



(finally someone to argue with)