Mini Series The Acolyte 1.05 - Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

My goodness gracious! What an episode!
-The fight choreography was jaw dropping! I felt like I was watching lightsaber battles out of the Clone Wars, it was that fast.
I've often speculated about why lightsaber battles couldn't look like TCW battles and the response is because it's animation, it's stylized, etc. etc. I just saw Jecki dual wield lightsabers with such speed that it reminded me of Ahsoka in TCW.
-And I really like the emphasis on martial arts given what would occur if a Jedi did not have a lightsaber to fight with.
-The deaths were very surprising and stunningly brutal. I figured Yord and Jecki would have plot armor and make it to the end of the series.
-A minor quibble was the "moth" type things being drawn to the light and that leading to Qimir being dragged into the treetops. A tad campy.
An easy 10/10!

 

Well that was intense..
Gonna take a couple more rewatches to decide how i feel about this one.
I wonder if “Qimir” answers directly to his own Master, or if he was a Sith apprentice who went rogue.
I have a hard time believing he is the top “Sith” or “darksider” in the galaxy

 

So Ki Adi Mundi said in TPM that the Sith had been extinct for a millenium ... so ...?

 

No, I will not try to explain anything, especially since this is not the topic for it.

But in Ahsoka every single motivation and action makes sense. And no, we don't disagree what the Ahsoka VS Anakin sequence was. It was very clear what it was. The meaning of the lesson was even more clear than what the sequence was. The writing in The Book Of Boba Fett was also totally fine. A very linear story, where every character had specific motivations and specific actions. It is ok to not be emotionally invested to a story and to not like it. That doesn't mean that the "writing of the story" is bad.

To me, Favreau and Filoni are legendary writers in the same calibre as Shakespear if I were to compare them to the writing in The Acolyte ie.

 

No, I don't Qimir is the top of the Sith chain. I do believe he'll be taken out by the top of the Sith chain before the end of the show for "revealing" them too soon.

 

I’ve been through the Jungle , with a Darth with No Name

 

I kinda like the thought of Quimir is just him and no master. Not that I mind him being a sith with a Master as usual but he goes on about wanting to be free. I guess he could be Self taught like born force sensitive and stumbled upon some nasty old Sith relic but I'm not holding my breath on the story going that way.

 

Remember when Darth Vader couldn't sense his own daughter right in front of him in the original Star Wars movie? That's right, it may be a shocking, but SW has always been full of inconsistencies, retcons and powers that work how they need to in order to make the narrative work (remember how they just kind of forgot about force speed in TPM? lol).

I'm think people should try watching the rest of the show and see what happens before they get in their feelings about some lore on wookiepedia being violated.

 

I know its not the “Jedi way”, but does anyone think the morally correct decision would probably be for Sol to kill “Qimir” when he has him.
I always agreed with Mace’s reasoning with Palpatine. “he’s too dangerous to be left alive”
While obviously murder is a last resort for Jedi, i think they had the moral authority to do it in the fight with Qimir & Palpatine

 

Well so far I have been fairly positive about this show despite all the controversy but oh my god this episode was just too stupid! Writing is worse than ever now...
Action was okay but made no sense and characters were acting like idiots. I's like Kenobi and Book of Boba Fett level all over again.

This was so poorly written and abysmally idiotic episode. Action scenes were looking cool but made no sense in the context at all. There is no continuity to what happens and no sense involved. Choreography was good considering that scenes made no sense at all. Writing is so all over the place. There was 8 jedi against one sith (this should never happen since it makes no sense unless jedi are written to be idiots) and suddenly Sol and Jecki are no longer in the fight at all (what happened to them- they got force pushed kilometers away) and one jedi already dies off-screen. The rest of jedi die like total losers and that fight looked like jedi are not even trying to win there. They are stormtroopers now?

But Osha making decision to sacrifice her droid to make bugs take sith away is so dumb writing decision it is just unforgivable. Their first priority should be to arrest him alive or kill him. Letting bugs to take him makes no sense. He is either going to kill the bugs and return for revenge (as happens) or bugs are going to kill him in which case it would be more ethical to kill him without them... Sure Osha tried to stun him once but she could probably do it now since he is unmasked. She doesn't even try but uses stupid deus ex machina bugs. This already happened in Rebels with purrgils but it was animated show and at least purrgils were effective. Bugs are not which is obvious since Sol already killed them with lightsaber. Osha ensured that sith wins the day by being stupid...

I hate this episode and this ruins this show for me. I no longer expect much. I don't care about lack of white human males in main cast, I don't mind about lesbian space witches but I hate stupid writing and idiotic characters being dumb for the sake of dumbness and this episode was all about idots in jungle with lightsabers. So... so bad writing. Action needs to make some sense. This didn't.

I am sad they failed to deliver since I'd love to see jedi and sith fighting with some sense involved. Actors were not bad, choreography was alright considering that script didn't make sense at all.

Plotholes in action:
1. People disappeared in the middle of the fight. For no reason
2. People are inactive in the middle of the fight for no reason (It's like video game battle with some long cooldown moves or confused status or something)
3. Sith decides to spare characters because they need death scenes later on. His actions make no sense from his own point of view
4. Osha's decision to use Pip to call bugs was an insane idea. He ensured sith won't get caught
5. Mae's motivation from the last episode to turn herself over to the jedi was overturned suddenly. I get it that she didn't kill Kelnacca while it looks like it, but why she resists arrest now when last time she said she is going to turn herself for the jedi?

 

I got the impression it was to kill Mae for betraying him. The Jedi got in the way and needed to die to keep him secret.

I loved the episode and was heartbroken to see Jecki go so soon. But it made sense for the Sith to stay secret. And I agree — Mae knowing Osha was alive changed everything. My big question is what did Sol and the other Jedi do on Brendok.

not sure if I saw the same episode as others but it was edge of my seat for me.

 

The thing is, he doesn't even need to sense her. Just look at her forehead. Osha doesn't have a giant white witch tattoo on it. Mae does. It is pretty easy to notice, even with the hair somewhat obscuring it. You can see the white there. If I can see it while watching, the character who is literally face to face with her there has to be able to notice that, too. Osha was his Padawan for years. He knows she doesn't have a tattoo. One of the first things Trinity did in the opening episode was checking the tattoo on Mae's forehead. And she knew immediately who it was. The whole twin swap thing is stupid, and unless Sol pretends and plays along for whatever reason (which the episode did not really try to portray), it does not make sense. I bet Bazil, the giant hamster, will need to tell him that. Even though all he needs to do is just look at her to know that it is an imposter, and not real Osha.

And yeah, while Vader/Leia thing was an obvious retcon, given that not only Leia was not related to Anakin in the first film, but Vader was not even Anakin in the first film, it can still be somewhat explained with Vader not knowing that his children were alive in the first place, thinking they had died with Padme, and he never knew what their signature in the Force was like, thus he was not able to sense them. Here we have a Jedi Master, who had trained and known Osha for years, who had known her on a very personal level, who should know what she is like in the Force. Mae is a completely unhinged psychopath, and there is nothing in common between the two. So he should be able to sense it immediately on the ship. I can give him a slack for not sensing it in the immediate aftermath of the battle, but I cannot give him a slack for not noticing a giant white tattoo on her forehead.

 

It seems as long as there is action people give it 10/10.

I didn't like this episode at all. I haven't complained about "bad writing" before in this show since it has not been this bad. But continuity just made no sense nor decisions of the characters. Also emo wanna-be sith boy easily killing 10 jedi makes it just ridiculous in my eyes. Jedi are so bad in this like totally stormtroopers with lightsabers...

Characters decisions, motivations and abilities need to be somewhat consistent. This was not achieved here. Characters act in a way writers need them to act for their script to barely make sense not in a way they would naturally act in situation they are in. That is not good writing. I want to see good writing and good action. This had alright action if it would have made sense.

 

Well everyone can rate it how they like of course. I was disappointed that's is all.

Yes it seemed to be lightsaber-proof and protect from the Force as well. It's one of the easier aspects to explain in this episode. Mask was Macguffin this sith relies on.

Observation more than criticism. People can rate it however they like of course.

 

I thought it was fine. The action was good. That's about all it takes for a pass for me tbh. I think as a show by itself it's really not very good, the writing is strange and nonsensical and acting is average. But the setting of just being Star Wars is what makes it watchable, and often enjoyable. Episode 3 is the only one I really didn't like, I thought it was just boring and didn't seem very Star Warsy.

I have to question where the money is going though. These episodes are like sit-com length. 25-ish minutes for the last 2 and it's clearly being filmed in a studio, I assume using the volume. How is this show's budget so high? They spending millions an episode on catering?

 

My thougts on Mae:

When Mae sees Kelnacca dead, she feels trapped, and not sure what to do. She was going to give herself up to the Jedi, but now Kelnacca is dead.

What is she to do now?

Would the Jedi believe her innocents since the Jedi are out for blood?

The Jedi are hunting Mae, would the Jedi believe that she didn't kill Kelnacca?

If Kelnacca was alive Mae could have reasoned with the Wookie before all the Jedi arrived and maybe the Jedi would have listened to Kelnacca.

Mae could have reasoned with Jecki during their fight but of course Jecki was out for blood, giving up was a lost issue.

I truly believe that Mae felt lost and trapped and her only goal was to escape, but she could not... Once Kelnacca was killed by Darth Smiley, giving herself up was extinguished or snuffed out.

Osha's stomach wound is the only thing I agree with about her character not seeming clear.

Mae loves her sister, why would she stab her in the belly? Maybe Mae thought Osha was a lost cause, since she wanted to arrest her and bring her before the Jedi for sentencing.

Mae's revenge was for her sister and her coven, now she believes her sister is brainwashed and can not see it her way, so she leaves Osha for dead, and continues on her mission to kill the Jedi.

Sol isn't innocent either, what did he do on the day of the fire, 16 years ago?

 

At least you are honest about it. Many people accept brainless action as entertainment. (Otherwise Marvel wouldn't be so popular). I agree about non-sensical writing though. But if I say my opinion I am "one more hater" throwing a tantrum. I haven't even complained about this show before. But this was just too dumb for me. I expected bit better than this... What is starwarsy and not is matter of opinion. Episode 3 had some odd choices though...

 

Indeed. Despite calling himself a Sith -after first saying he's nothing (no title/label)- plus his spiel to Sol about wanting to do things his way instead of following Jedi rules, I got the feeling he's not a Licensed Sith. Stong dark side user absolutely, but it felt more like he read about the Sith out of a book (or holocron) and is calling himself one.

Which may be a problem if an actual Darth finds him

 

It's really cool that Osha's previously mentioned arm tattoo, which was a good establishing character beat in ep2, might now be more important to Sol realising that he's got an impostor aboard. Nice little set up that will probably have a payoff next week.

The choice to initially open the episode after a minor time skip had me worried, as did the choice to shoot some of the early duel action from a distance through the trees. I though, 'oh, that's the stuff we wanna see, not just Osha's reactions'! But then as the episode went on and we got plenty of well-shot action moments, I think that early annoyance faded away. It actually works well to sell the disorienting effect of our 'maybe' Sith getting into the Jedi's head and putting Osha on the back foot.

The Qmir reveal worked for me, it was both suspected beforehand but with just the right amount of other possibilities and doubt sprinkled in so it wasn't a Captain Obvious reveal. He was genuinely menacing in an unhinged way, especially after backing up his madness with all the deaths. Jecki going down brutally in a fight was one thing, but then Yord's neck-snap was a hugely striking moment. They also hedged on revealing whether Qmir was Sith master or apprentice yet, I guess there's still some mystery there. I wonder why there's also that 'you can call me Sith' business, as if he isn't up to fully claiming the title. Maybe evidence of a schism, and we'll see more that two possible Sith this season? I can't be sure, or if it's just ambiguous wording.

Liked that the 'light attracts the creatures' bit wasn't simply to motivate a random monster attack, but used as a twist against Qmir. I didn't see it coming but it was appreciated, as was getting to see Qmir go full 'Cal Kestis on Kashyyyk' slashing up the insects.

Mae still frustrates me a bit. When Osha brings up the rightful fact that Mae started the fire, she doesn't refute that by saying the obvious, such as something like 'oh, but the fire didn't kill all the witches, did it', which might seed some doubt in Osha about the events on Brendok, but instead goes straight for 'the Jedi brainwashed you' without elaborating. She's not doing a very good job selling her case, though at least Osha agrees and rejected her for all the murdering.

Still, next week should be interesting, with Osha interacting with Qmir and Mae having to hide around Sol. It could go in a lot of directions.

Edit: This is a really minor nitpick, but there’s this little cheerful trumpet moment when Jecki lit up her borrowed second lightsaber. It was a very classic-Star Wars sounding cue, but I don’t think it gelled that well with the rest of the score, which isn’t much like Williams’ compositions. I dunno, it’s a tiny detail, but it took me out of the action for a moment

Edit 2: Comparing this to another episode that mostly built around lightsaber duels, as I was reminded of it, I think the fourth episode of Ahsoka handled it slightly better. There was more drama in the ticking clock of stopping Morgan and Baylan from escaping the planet, and there was an almost chase-like flow to the action leading the characters through the woods to the cliff edge. Here in the Acolyte I felt the scenes of running around the woods a little directionless. There wasn’t much sense of building to a tense and inevitable dramatic climax, although when the pivotal deaths did come they were executed (poor choice of words?). Still, an overall enjoyable episode, probably the peak of the Acolyte so far.