Mini Series The Acolyte 1.08 (SEASON FINALE!!!) - Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

remember the jedi cover stuff up
revan
the jedi covenant
Yoda covering up the existence of the nameless

Any connection the order had with pius dea

THE LIST GOES ON

(yes I know most of the things I listed were legends but their far enough they haven't been contradicted yet by canon)

 

The problem is he literally met Osha for one second and decided he loved her and needed her to be his apprentice

 

Tarnishing what George Lucas created in such a heavy handed way is everything we've come to expect from Star Wars under Kathleen Kennedy. That's really all I have to say after watching this episode.

 

It’s a little more than that. He met two children who he thought were in danger and wanted to protect them.

 

It is beyond stupid, since you are walking in circles and try to play "gotcha", pretending to not understand what is being said. Anakin went bad and was no longer a Jedi. He was a Sith. That does not change the perception of the Jedi Order, and he went bad precisely because he ignored the Jedi teachings, that the Jedi and Yoda tried to teach him, actively. Moronic, evil Jedi doing heinous stuff and staying Jedi and covering it up DOES change the perception of the Jedi Order - which is what Acolyte does. Vernestra is a high ranking Jedi Master, who covered up a bunch of terrible stuff and threw Sol under the bus, why, exactly? The entire witch stuff crap is covered up and happened in the first place why, exactly? Don't try to play sophistry here. Yes, Anakin was a Jedi Knight, and he stopped being one when he decided to cut off Mace Windu's hand. Your point? He willingly chose to betray the Jedi Order and abandon it and join the Sith Order. What is your point? My point is that it in no way affects the perception of the Jedi Order, because Anakin abandoned and betrayed it, he joined the Sith, and it was no one's fault but his.

You asked for proof of Lucas saying that the Jedi have no authority. I gave you that. They have no authority. They let the political process go. You claimed that the Jedi have some kind of """power""" that they are afraid of losing. Which they don't. And that is the entire basis for your arguments. Stop contradicting yourself. And stop projecting your misunderstandings onto me. Thanks.

 

Maybe Im just dumb, but this series made no sense to me at all. I have no idea where the story wants to take us, the main characters are inconsistent and boring, I really couldnt care less about their story. I am way more invested and interested in The Stranger and his background. I never understood anyone's motivations for doing what they did.

The lightsaber action was fantastic, I'll give them that. If you told me season 2 was going to be about Plagueis and The Stranger and they somehow undermining the Jedi in the eyes of the Republic, exploiting their weaknesses, I'd be all in, but its going to be more story about the twins, and I just dont care about them, so yeah, no season 2 for me please.

 

the Bleeding starts with osha. it travels from her hand to the kyber

when Anakin killed the younglings his hands were metal


youngling slayer 9000 woulda had its kyber red if Ani used his feet lol

 

She went there to save Sol and ended up killing him herself. Jedi really need to stop paying attention to their visions. It never ends well.

 

Dooku murdered Yaddle with a blue lightsaber.

Anakin having a metal hand is not why his saber didn’t turn red.

It was revealed in a Vader comic series set right after RoTS that he did not know why Sith had red blades.

 

My thoughts:

Some of the episodes were hit and miss IMO, but I really liked the finale. I loved seeing Osha's fall and murder of Sol, and how it turned out she saw herself in her vision. (As the episode unfolded after she explained the vision I realized it would be her instead of Mae doing the killing. But that's a sign of good foreshadowing.) I also liked seeing a lightsaber being bled on screen. It was a really emotional moment that sells the concept well. And the duel choreography between Sol and Qimir was great.

Plus, major props for the creepy, non-dorky-looking Plagueis. Hopefully that level of good CGI design can be maintained if he steps out of the shadows (literally) in a future season.

David Harewood was amazing.

The Jedi "control room" was nicely McQuarrie and very 1970s in its aesthetic, with colors that suggest some institutional rot at the heart of the Jedi Order. In fact, it reminds me of the Film Room for reviewing starfighter battles aboard the Calamari cruiser Independence in LucasArts' 1993 X-Wing game.

Evidently Qimir's Sensory Deprivation Helmet is a Title Deprivation Helmet as well.

I was a little annoyed by Bazil ripping out the wires in Sol's ship. It was clearly obvious what was going on when you think about it - Bazil mistakenly thought Sol was going to kill Mae - but Bazil being a non-speaking character makes it a little hard to understand at first, in a way that impedes audience sympathy. I would've also liked to see Sol explain to him that he wasn't going to kill Mae. Stupid short running times.

Sol's whole "I kept the truth from you to give you the life you dreamed of" speech to Osha is great. SW writers often struggle to decide whether the Jedi's "no attachments" code forbids genuine natural, healthy relationships with others or just unhealthy attachments (something surely not helped by official murkiness among Lucasfilm's producers). But Sol's self-justificatory explanation was a textbook example of unhealthy attachments, and a really great illustration of his flaws as a Jedi.

The "core shaft" young Mae got sucked into is a nod to the Cloud City duel in ESB and how Luke survived that. It even has lights on the sides that light up in sequence as Mae and Osha go through it, like the ones in the round tunnel Luke passes through on Bespin when following Vader into the depths.

Overall, I'm looking forward to a Season 2, but please, for the love of Manny Jacinto's biceps, can we have longer episode running times??!?

 

That’s no newcomer, that’s a Muun! Darth Plagueis at last!



So some more thoughts … on everything.

The series, the lore, the philosophy, the plot, what it means for the High Republic and the Prequel Trilogy, what it means for the Jedi and the Sith, and what it means for the Jedi-Republic relationship.



This show has its flaws, but it both:

1. incorporates all of this lore from all eras, combining in an interesting way (and not just Star Wars eras, also from Old EU too). Cortosis, Muun Plagueis, the Hyperspace disaster reference, foreshadow/echoes of TPM, midichlorians without saying the word, more Force cults, Sith appropriately working in the shadows in this time but still Sith and not weak, etc.

2. gets the philosophy of Star Wars… and in some ways shows a better “seduced to the dark side” temptation than any of the 3 trilogies, while still recognizing that choice as evil

There’s a dark side in everyone in Star Wars, even the Jedi never fully master their emotions, but what makes someone a Sith is committing to giving into those passions instead of trying to master them. Very rooted in Eastern philosophy, about it being ok to have emotions, but letting them pass, to feel them but not to lose control to them and get mastered by your attachments and desires. Just very Buddhist/Taoist-inspired. The Jedi try to follow but also recognize they’re human and make mistakes, what makes them Jedi is they’re committed to this path and confront themselves and their dark sides, instead of leaving the dark unconfronted and untamed in their subconscious. They also did a good job about the seduction of the dark side - you see the truth, you see the flaws of institutions and others and the world itself, you get emotional about it, but instead of trying to let it pass and do the hard job of confronting it and still choosing to play by our moral code, just be free to act on those emotions and allow yourself to focus on them and give into them.

As a show, it delivers on its promises (as writers often put it). The main story is told and concluded, but still very interesting teases and links for future storytelling. The story was unorthodox and kept us guessing in several aspects, but made more sense as it progressed, like piecing it together as a puzzle, but in a way at that wasn’t predictably boring yet also clearly planned. The finale had flaws, but more flaws of the series overall, it stuck the landing.

I wish Vernestra didn’t cover-up the key details of the cover-up… but I can see how she justified it. She wants to do right by Mae, and stop the inquiries and show it’s a done deal instead of admitting the loose threads and inviting further Senate meddling.

…BUT…

At this point in history, why does Vernestra hate the idea of Senate meddling and full transparency? This was literally a murder investigation involving Republic citizens. The Senate is not nearly corrupt, it’s still the High Republic. And while Senator Rayencourt was blunt (and to put it bluntly: mean) about it, he is Correct.

The Jedi shouldn’t serve as police or agents of the Republic, I’ve argued that in so many threads over the years… but if they’re Republic citizens, and these based on Coruscant definitely are, then there should be equality under the law. A murder investigation is a murder investigation.

To use a real world example, even though the Amish in Pennsylvania are a very religious and insular society, the law of the United States still applies to them. A church doesn’t have a right to conduct its own murder investigation and not tell the police and courts about it. If a group of scientists goes to an uninhabited island to study the ecology, find there’s a hidden tribe living there, intervene, and people die… that’s wrong, and it adds to the wrongness if they cover it up when they go home too. And furthermore, if those scientists are back home and start getting murdered in their home country, some 16 years later, and one of the managers of those ecologists discovers this but decides to do their own investigation and hide it from the police… er what? And then you uncover the truth but lie about it? That’s not just wrong, that’s not even legally ambiguous, that’s just illegal. Especially when you see that government as good, close to ideal, and worth defending.

Maybe this is speculation now for the current High Republic series ends… but there must be a really good reason why the Jedi want to hide things from the Senate. One bad senator in the series who just plants a big seed of mistrust that’s still felt so many decades later. Because even in this show, one random Senator mentioned how nearly every Senator has complete trust in the Jedi, aside from Senator Rayencourt. There has to be some reason why she has this mistrust.

And that’s not even getting into whatever happened between her and Qimir…

They’re kind of turning Vernestra into the one who spoiled the High Republic and ended that era. But how she becomes that is the question. And why are Yoda and others letting her make all these decisions and being complicit… so I guess it’s not just her, she’s just the face of it, for visual storytelling reasons and limited screentime.

But still. What made the Jedi get to this point? It’s one thing to maintain independence, to be an ally and defender of the government and especially its ideals, but still independent… yet be transparent, and when dealing with the Republic (or working in its territory or with its citizens, like themselves), respecting and working under its laws, especially when it comes to murder investigations… without becoming the Republic’s equivalent of a hybrid Navy SEALs / Diplomats / FBI.

Did she have a vision of the future, where she sees the Jedi working as agents of the Republic… and that being its downfall? Because that would be true. But also another self-fulfilling prophecy.

 

I must admit, Plagueis looked really good, much creepier and better than I imagined they would pull off.

 

Yaddle wasn’t the person who raised Dooku and she also didn’t kill Dooku’s mother. Osha is literally strangling to death the person she once cared for the most. Her rage is obviously on a much higher level than Dooku’s was.

 

osha didn't either and it still turned bled

Dooku wasn't too mad to kill Yaddle

 

Oh and since I’m starting to read the thread and see people are talking about the lightsaber bleeding here too… Wikipedia is your friend:


https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Bleeding

Bleeding was the process that a dark side adept used by way of the dark side of the Force to bend a kyber crystal to their will, turning it red. It was possible for some light side users to purify corrupted crystals, which would bring them back to the light side and change their color to white. During the Imperial Era Ahsoka Tano purified kyber crystals that had been bled to make her white lightsabers.

“Since kyber crystals are naturally attuned to the light side of the Force, those who serve the dark side must follow a different path. First, they must seize a pure crystal from the lightsaber of a Jedi they have vanquished in combat—for the saber of a Sith is not given. It is taken. Then, they must infuse that crystal with their pain, anger, and hatred, bending it to their will. This corrupts the crystal, aligning it with the dark side and making it bleed with unbridled crimson power. The bleeding process can yield unpredictable results. Some crystals shatter, making their energies unstable and unpredictable. Others resist their realignment, refusing to be bent toward the darkness. Once a crystal has been properly bled, the primal power it releases becomes not only a deadly instrument in the hands of a Sith Lord, but a symbol of their true strength in the dark side.”


Behind the scenes

Bleeding was first mentioned in the 2016novel Ahsoka, written by E. K. Johnston.[1]Bleeding first appeared in Darth Vader(2017) 5, which was authored by Charles Soule, penciled by Giuseppe Camuncoli,[2]and released on September 6, 2017.[16]

In Star Wars Legends, Jaden Korr changed a red synthetic lightsaber crystal into a yellow one. He later used this for his third lightsaber. The process was called cleansing.[17]




Anakin in ROTS didn’t seize the lightsaber of a Jedi he killed, and focus his rage into it. Neither did Dooku with Yaddle, and he wasn’t truly in furious hatred with Yaddle at the moment anyways.

 

Bartender served as a witness of events. Bar saw the fight. None I'd them saw Sol there. In fact he was likely on Coruscant when that went down.

Sol is legitimately with other Jedi the whole time when Torbin offs himself. You think the Jedi from that mini temple are going to back Venny's story?

Any amateur investigator would figure out Sol didn't kill Indara & Torbin in no time at all.

Horrible ending.

 

I just finished watching the episode. I might try re-watching the entire season in one go in the next week or so to see how I feel about it. I've liked quite a lot of aspects of it, but some others not so much. Like some others, I'm a bit puzzled as to where a second season goes with these characters. I suppose I'd still say that, for me, especially after the brief glimpse of Plagueis, the logical endgame of this series remains Plagueis taking a young Palpatine as his apprentice.

 

I have yet to see a bazil toy anywhere let alone any kind of branding. Sooooooo

let’s talk grogu. Ewoks. Porgs. Episode I 1999….

 

Funko POP! Star Wars: Acolyte Bazil 4.4-in Vinyl Figure | GameStop

 

well I’m sold. Funko can take my money. I already sold my soul to Disney.

 

There's no shortage of people that know that Sol was on Coruscant for Indara's murder and were definitely in the actual hallway with him when Torbin died. More over, hologram footage of Mae attacking Sol on Olega exists. Ki Adi Mundi was just one of many people in the room at the time it was shown. This cover up is gonna have to involve so many people. It's really not just a few Jedi.

 

I believed Osha's turn to the dark side and immediately infusing all her hate and rage into Sol's light saber. It seemed as fast a process as in the Ahsoka book. Far more believable than Anakin's fall in RotS. There was something foreboding, frightening about Osha and Darth Whatever holding hands over the corrupted saber.