Mini Series The Acolyte Season 2 discussion (spoilers allowed)

The "anti-social media".

 

People didn't watch it though. The so-called bullies were an non-issue.

 

I'm not disappointed this particular show is cancelled because I didn't like it at all. I didn't care about any of the characters and the whole things was just so disjointed. I will miss Manny Jacinto though, he stole the show. None of the other characters / actors gripped me whatsoever and unfortunately, there were times where I actually did laugh at loud at how stupid some things seemed.

All of that said, what I am disappointed about is that this likely means the end of risk taking in this era in terms of shows. In fact, it probably means all future shows will all have to be beholden to the Skywalker saga and while that is cool, I did like the idea of an entirely new part of the universe opening up (in terms of on screen) as a sandbox for further stories. This feels a bit like what Solo did for the end of Star Wars side story films.

Unfortunately, so many things have conspired to get to this point and it is so much more than just 'us' against 'them' which is what it will no doubt boil down to at the end of the day depending on which side is your 'us' and which side is your 'them'. The reality is, the show was disappointing for many viewers and they voted with their viewership shoes.

 

Sadly, no more spoilers for this show, except the possibility of what may have been!

The show was an easy target for criticism - some founded and some unfounded. But the downright trolling and discord-manufacturing gained traction in some folks' minds too.

I saw, somewhere, a meme saying "So this is how innovative content dies. With thunderous applause."

I'd add to that with true fans (and Disney's accountants) shaking their heads.

Anyway, goodbye S2! Time to hop on over to "The Acolyte Official Series Discussion" thread...

 

I’m wondering if there’s a chance Disney tries something different and shops The Acolyte to Amazon. Like how they snatched up Batman Caped Crusader. Especially if they move away from live action shows on Disney Plus. I know how protective Disney are of their IP, but times are changing.

 

You don't think the relentless review-bombing campaign and online vitriol had any influence on viewership? If so, what is that perspective based on?

 

If review-bombing campaing and online vitriol really have so much influence on viewership, that would be pretty bad. After all, studios only care about being profitable, so they will give in to hate campaigns that greatly reduce their audience.

That said, I've really doubt haters have so much power. In fact, these hate campaings are just strong when the shows and movies have a weak or divisive reception. Haters are bullies, they won't make a lot fuss with really popular shows.

For example: HOTD makes many characters to be black (when they were white in the original material), the usual suspects complained about this before the series started, but these complaints were silenced by the pretty positive reception at the end.

 

I’ve said this before, but they really need to rethink press tours

You’re kicking the hornet’s nest by going around telling reporters in the lead up to the show’s release that a large portion of your fans are racist and that you’re expecting your cast to be bullied and that they aren’t welcomed.

I don’t disagree with the notion at all, but you don’t see HBO doing that. You had haters of the Game of Thrones final season who were skeptical and also the usual suspects of weirdos online who complained about diversity, but HBO just stayed silent enough for people to check out HOTG and say “hey, this is actually pretty good!” and let word of mouth take its course, calming skepticals and getting racist babies to mostly shut up.

With The Acolyte you didn’t really have a strong enough show writing wis to become a sensation and also you just went out of your way to attract attention from rage grifters. It was a losing battle from the start.

 

Maybe it's very cynical of me, but I also suspect Disney was trying to use pretty real racist attacks the cast received to deflect any kind of criticism.

That said, it doesn't seem Disney will continue that direction on their press tours. From what I've seen in Disney most recent promotions, they seem to avoid focusing on the racial topic.


Another thing, I'm not sure if studios publicly showing support to actors who suffer racist harassment is somenthing that really helps. For example: The racist attacks against Moses Ingram (Reva) didn't decrease after Disney show its support.

 

Undoubtedly... regardless of the shows relative merits and flaws, there was a wider negative perception that didn't necessarily reflect reality... and some of that negative perception was from those who hadn't even watched it.

 

It sucks tremendously, but the reality is you don’t feed the troll.

I’m also of the opinion there are relatively few actual outright *racists* (there are, but not as many as they’d have you believe) but just a large amount of idiots who just sort of become caught in the middle of rage baiters, and then once the studio goes on the defensive, the lines between real racists, viewers with legitimate complaints about the writing and characterization of Reva, and people who don’t even really tune in and just chug Mountain Dew while watching Star Wars Theory and nodding their head in agreement with three hour streams gets blurred.

 

Honest question, most of the same Youtubers that hated The Acolyte loved (or at least positively reviewed) Andor. Their influence did little to boost Andor's viewing numbers, why do we think their negative reviews hurt The Acolyte's numbers?

 

The Acolyte has been cancelled...... from a certain point of view.
The show is categorized as a mystery. When we discovered that Osha is the acolyte, one of the mysteries of the show was revealed.... which was actually more of a twist than an answer, and the story can move forward. There's no need to continue with the same show title. The storyline can continue, shifting its focus on other roles, and different show titles (The Sith Apprentice, The Sith Master).
Continue the story with a different mystery and different titles.

 

Den of geeks and theory both either hated Andor or found it boring...I remember the den of geeks guy saying star wars was dead after watching the first few episodes

 

I see fans have created a petition to renew the show.

I also notice fans created a petition to not renew the show.

 

Whether one agrees with it or not, I think negativity has a bit more cut through (in terms of social media and on-line perception). Psychologically, 'click bait' is 'click bait' because we (generally) are drawn to controversy... and it's generally not controversial to like a show/film or other... or think a filmmaker has 'done well'.

 

I don't mean this to ardently defend Star Wars Theory in particular or anything. But I think this perfectly highlights how both sides can be equally guilty of having knee jerk reactions over what the other side says without knowing the full extent of what that other side is actually saying or trying to say.

The title of that video is intentionally ironic. He is mocking the fact that that is going to be the perception now that The Acolyte is cancelled. He actually explains how that mentality would completely be the wrong one to take. And that overall this is not a good thing for the franchise, and that we all lose by Star Wars being in the state that it is. He offers genuine condolence to fans who liked the show, and admits that there are those who might have judged it too harshly. Which has been his approach all along during the entire run of The Acolyte, and in the years preceding it as he has become more critical of Disney Star Wars. He also goes on to say that he wishes he had that level of influence that LucasFilm would see his content and react according to how he thinks Star Wars productions should be made.

Believe it or not, many of the youtubers who are critical of Disney Star Wars are a lot more level headed in their criticism than you would know if you don't actually watch their content. Star Wars Theory is a perfect example of this. He's actually a really good dude, and is always engaging with the Star Wars fandom in a positive and constructive way. And the people who follow him are also good regular people who engage with each other in a positive and constructive way. But a lot of times his valid criticisms get misconstrued and misrepresented in a way that makes it seem much worse than it is. Add to that a few thumbnails and soundbites that get taken out of context, and the other side labels him and the people who follow him as nothing more than rage baiting basement dwellers (among other labels of this sort), without knowing the full extent of what is actually being said in those spaces, and without even attempting to know that full extent while continuing to dismiss it and be insulting towards those who engage with it.

Don't get me wrong, I am fully aware that some of these youtubers can say some not nice things and have thumbnails that are openly insulting. But that isn't representative of the entirety of this kind of content and the community around it.

 

The "sociable media".

 

It's just interesting to see people react to the critics of Disney Star Wars in the exact same manner that they accuse those critics of reacting to Disney Star Wars. This is something I've observed for a while now, but became much more prominent during season one of The Acolyte.

 

I've watched him for years and just seen him get mote and more entrenched in his views...id much rather watch blind wave, Kyle katarn, Alex from star wars explained and a few others.
Some fans hang on every word he says. I just find the approaches of others more appealing these days

 

There was a time when Theory was considered the biggest Disney Star Wars shill there was. A lot of people actually appreciated his honesty in coming away from that and becoming more critical of Disney Star Wars since the end of the ST. Because it mirrored a lot of peoples own experiences, and it helped to open up that conversation a lot more.

With regards to channels like Katarn or Explained, their reactions and commentary seem a bit over the top, and in my view would be too much even if all of this Star Wars content knocked it out of the park in every possible way. So for them to be reacting the way they do to content that is average to below average just kind of makes it seem ridiculous. But I admittedly don't watch their channels a lot, I've only seen snippets, maybe I'm doing to them what I feel is done to channels that are more critical of Disney Star Wars, and for all I know they could be a lot more level headed about it than I'm aware.

Which relates to the point I was making before. Where each side just focuses on the snippet over the top reactions from the other side, and that becomes the entire conversation. It's all just so polarized and there isn't any middle ground. And if you are in the middle ground, then each side accuses you of being aligned with the other side for one reason or another.

 

I've posted this before somewhere, but I too used to watch SWT before he turned into this.