Lit The Dark Forces Saga

Yeah, I think the original game makes it clear that Kyle didn't piggyback in. The Sulon Star takes off, Kyle gets 88's head, and meets up with Jan; next thing we see, Kyle's in a cozy little location (pretty sure it's his old house) having Weegee decode the map, and next thing we see after that, Kyle's landing on Ruusan and disappointed to see Jerec beat him there. All the novellas do is expand on the already-established fact that Kyle had to pause and decode the map before going in on his own. In the game itself, it wasn't such a rush job that Kyle lacked any opportunity to communicate with the NR, so I don't think it's that bad for the novellas to take the opportunity to say, "Of course he did the smart thing and contacted the NR -- they just ended up sending him to infiltrate anyway."

 

You're right, I watched the cutscene again, and the establishing shot before it shows them deciphering the map is Morgan Katarn's farm house at night.

So they definitely left the Sulon Star and went back to Morgan's farm.

 

Okay, I stand corrected, I blame it on new input my brain received over the last 15 years, and on the fact that I still don't like the "Kyle wasn't a two-man team" approach the novella took a single bit, especially since it doesn't fit well in the first place ("He'll go because it's his destiny; I have to, well, stand around a bit over there").

Concussion rifle. That sound. Those fuel tanks never stood a chance. I generally love the sound design in the Jedi Knight game very, very much (and yeah, a lot of that is thanks to the movies).

I have to say that I really loved playing the final two or three non-duel levels without killing anyone, though, since Force Protection and Force Persuasion (or whatever those are called) just let you walk past the non-boss enemies. I actually had a Jedi Shadow quest in TOR yesterday that I think I could have solved without killing anyone, but I'm not convinced that I'd gotten an XP bonus in the end that made up for all the battle XP I would have missed out on (plus the usual 'slaughter' subquest XP, urgh).

 

The conc rifle is amazing. Is it in any of the games other than Jedi Academy? It's the only one I played that had it.

I think if so much of TOR's level-up experience didn't require killing enemies, that I'd be a master of sneaking around by now. Especially on the stealth classes, of course...but even on my Knight and Warrior, I've gotten used to hopping on the bases of statues of mounds of snow or rocks to skirt around enemies. It's really an art form when you don't have stealth.

 

The concussion rifle is in every Dark Forces game. And it's my favorite gun too.

 

Wait, it was in Outcast?

 

It was not in Outcast; however, Jedi Outcast dropped the Dark Forces moniker so it technically isn't a Dark Forces game.

 

I guess it wasn't? I assumed it was, but it doesn't show up under appearances on Wookieepedia. But it's in Dark Forces, Jedi Knight, and Mysteries of the Sith.

Edit:

Spoiler: Big Images

I miss video game ads of the 90s. The best part is the bottom of both ads advertising the LucasArts BBS with phone number.

Edit 2: And speaking of TOR, playing the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight series really makes me wish TOR's gameplay wasn't so exclusive. Playing a Jedi Knight in TOR means you're strictly playing a Jedi Knight. If you choose to be a Dark Jedi, your Force Stasis doesn't become Force Choke. Likewise, a Consular's Project doesn't become Shock and Telekinetic Throw doesn't become Force Lightning. So there's no opportunity for this:


And you're restricted to melee weapons. And I suppose there's balancing purposes for this as well as thematic -- people don't don't envision a Jedi using a blaster, "so uncivilized" -- but I think for the first twenty or so years of Star Wars there wasn't this strict adherence in the Jedi that we saw, namely Luke and Kyle Katarn. They were pragmatic, not traditionalists. But for the gameplay balance, I think there's reasons to limit the Jedi to melee DPS or melee tank versus ranged which I guess makes sense -- there's not much reason to play a trooper or smuggler if a Jedi can do the same thing. Though I think you could do completely different talents and abilities, perhaps a separate AC entirely, if you wanted to.

 

It's odd that the Conc rifle was left out of Outcast but was in the rest of the games...like they forgot it or something. Those are awesome ads, especially the target on the stormtrooper's head.

As to TOR, I guess they really had to do that because of the DPS-Healer-Tank system, and the class story system, but I agree. It's why Academy and the games like it have such great replay value–you can switch up your powers, weapons, lightsaber color, lightsaber style, fighting stance, all of it, every time you play. One time you can play the Dosuun (prison break) level and spend the entire time using a blaster rifle one time, or just go through blasting everyone with Force lightning the entire time. You can shoot down Rax Joris from the floor, blow him away with your heavy weapons, or get right up beside him and shoot him to death with a blaster rifle. Compared with TOR, where it's just "kill him with a lightsaber, then kill her with a lightsaber, and then use your lightsaber to tear everyone else apart, too."

 

From the Dark Forces FAQ -- not sure if it's official or not but I suspect it is/was -- last updated July 5, 2001:

1.2 Is DF canon?

DF itself is not canon (meaning 'in Star Wars continuity'), but that's not to say it doesn't have ties to Star Wars continuity. Kyle Katarn's first mission takes place shortly before the events of Star Wars: A New Hope (Episode IV).
Surely, if there were a Rebel who had accomplished as much as Katarn (succeeding in over a dozen extremely difficult missions single-handedly, facing hundreds of opponents), we would have heard of him by now. But, hey -- just try to play along, okay? After all, you may shoot down the enigmatic bounty hunter Boba Fett -- but he later appears in Return of the Jedi to be fed to the Sarlacc, and then reappears on Nar Shaddaa in the Dark Horse Comics series Star Wars: Dark Empire.

On the other hand, Justin Chin writes:

Kyle Katarn is not a more visible character in the Rebellion because Mon Mothma and the rest of the leaders of the Rebellion are concerned about the controversial nature of his employment. Namely his past with the Empire, in which he had many successful operations against the Rebellion, leaving many dead. The other is that he is not officially a part of the Rebellion, and is paid very well for his deeds. Other rebel members are not paid so well if not at all. In fact this very fact greatly upsets Princess Leia to no end. Even with the success with the Death Star plans and the Dark Troopers. Mon Mothma went behind Leia's back to hire him to steal the Death Star plans.​

​

BTW, "katarn" (the surname of the protagonist in DF) is the name of a predator on the Wookie homeworld of Kashyyyk. Also, in the Star Wars book Heir to the Empire, written by Timothy Zahn (the first book in his trilogy), there is a Lieutenant Page who heads a New Republic group called the "Katarn Commandos."

Justin Chin writes:

["Katarn"] was used before I officially started on the project. I tried to think of a better one, but I as well as others, were used to it so it was not changed. He was in fact named after the animal. But he has no relation to the Katarn Commandos.​

 

Not official. It's a fan source, even though it's pretty valuable for the fan due to the BTS info the writer got from Chin.

My favorite weapon is the fusion cutter from DF because it's a, well, fusion cutter and not a real weapon.

 

I suppose the acknowledgements should have clued me in.

It's interesting that Chin's backstory for Katarn implies that he's a bit older than it was later established and that he had more history among the Imperials. I posted earlier in the thread his backstory in the Dark Forces manual which was distinct from what later became his backstory in many ways, including both his parents dying in an Imperial attack which the Rebels were framed for, and he continued to serve in the Empire after learning the truth from Jan Ors whom was an uncover operative. He only left the Empire when her cover was blown and he rescued her, thus compromising his own status. But he didn't go join the Rebel Alliance and steal the Death Star plans as his first mission out of the Empire, but became a part of the underworld and learned more skills from the smugglers and bounty hunters. He didn't believe the Rebel Alliance would win and was a burnt out cynical husk of a man just making his way in the galaxy, taking on missions for Mothma so long as the price was right.

 

The original Kyle Katarn was also wearing Mandalorian armor chestplate under his rocking leather jacket and he certainly behaved like he was making Mon Mothma a favor when he took on the Dark Trooper Project. I think Chin had a bit of a mancrush on his own creation but I also liked that angle better than the Rebel agent one.

 

Was he wearing Mandalorian armor? I noticed Wookieepedia had that a few months ago but someone removed it. It suggested Katarn was wearing full Mandalorian body armor in gameplay.





I kinda figured it was just an armor breastplate, because I don't really think the Mandalorians were much of a thing in 1995. At least, Mandalorian love was focused on Boba Fett. And it wasn't even clear if he was a Mandalorian, or just wore their armor.

 

Definitely looks Boba Fett inspired to me.

 

Edit: I think Kyle Katarn is, prior to and during the OT, supposed to be the Star Wars equivalent of Solid Snake. But in Jedi Knight, he does get his butt handed to him on Nar Shaddaa.

 

I think he's supposed to be John Matrix... literally, as the removed cutscenes from DF1 were taken from Commando.

 

Was it lifted directly?

 

Yeah. I guess they were supposed to be placeholders but they never got to animate anything to replace them so they merely took the code out. But it was pretty easy to get them back.

 

Some unused art and scenes:






Notice the YT-2400 in the bottom right.

Very reminiscent of the Jedi temple. It's supposed to be Kyle's castle in the dark side ending, I presume, with Kyle and Sariss in the picture.

 

The idea that he uses the Jedi Temple as his castle is very eerie. Wonder if there would've been an eventual Luke/Mara vs. Kyle/Sariss showdown in that alternate continuity.

 

It's not supposed to be the Jedi temple, because the Jedi temple didn't exist in 1996-1997.


It seems to be taken for granted that this is supposed to be Coruscant, and I suppose we didn't know what Coruscant looked like visually from a film perspective at the time so maybe it was intended to be, but it could very well be Barons Hed.


It would guess it was a concept for Barons Hed originally, because the Government House doesn't match.


They probably reused the concept for the dark side ending. Under this alternate dark side continuity, Katarn would have established himself as Emperor in 5 ABY, so Luke probably would never have met Mara. It would be interesting if they gave it the TFU treatment though and created additional content off of the dark side ending. Some fan made mods may already exist..

Watching the dark side ending again, it reveals those aren't entry steps but rather a throne room.

 

Well yeah, I know it wasn't actually supposed to be the Jedi Temple, but it looked enough like it (in the picture you posted, anyways) to be an eerie idea.

 

Spoiler: Huge Image