The future for the EU. Leading to: Allana vs The mystery man on dark throne

well if abeloth wants the dark man back there is a good chance she might start the process in conviction sense she is going to nam choris which will make her stronger than ever

 

I'm of the opinion that the Dark Man is Luke. I don't think that Jacen necessarily would want Luke killed if he felt he Luke was in danger of becoming the Dark Man. Luke is his uncle after all. I could see Jacen taking his path to preempt Luke from going that route in an attempt to both prevent Luke from going dark and saving his life at the same time. To me he wanted both outcomes. Of course the later books seem to forget why Jacen killed Nelani and have Caedus actively trying to kill Luke. Absent Luke, I could see the Dark Man as Krayt, Starkiller, or Son (from the Clone Wars show). Or maybe the resurrected Darth Maul. It could even be Asajj Ventres; who says that the Dark Man has to be an actual man?

 

I have always thought it was really Jacen because of those times that anyone felt the Dark Man in Betrayal was when Jacen did something dark.

I was of the mind that the reason the Throne of Balance changed is because Jacen was defeated before he could really reach his full level of Sith-dom and take over the galaxy.

Plus, wasn?t the dark vision Lumiya was talking to just an older version of Jacen? And when Luke felt the dark man, he felt him as someone familiar but still unrecognizable? I always took that to mean it was a future Jacen who reached his full Sith potential and took over the galaxy. So had he won in Invincible and taken over, and set up his Empire, then he would be the Dark Man that he saw on the throne and that Luke felt.


But it has been all over the place, so I could very well see it going many other directions. Also, Abeloth mentioning how Jacen changed the current or the throne. It seems to imply he did it on purpose.
Someone mentioned Jacen?s connection to Abeloth. I hope we do find out they had some kind of interaction. I feel Jacen?s journey and story are being forgotten now that we are further along in FotJ, and it would be a shame if he wasn?t involved moving forward, at the very least, as a backstory to fill things in


It really had a lot of promise, but kind of feels like they have changed their minds several times throughout, which I hope doesn?t make it too crazy of an ending that its just silly.

 

I still think some of these newer characters (Ben, Ves, the crazy Jedi) may be the key to whether Allana or the Dark Man wins.

 

I agree, I think it is all hinged on whether or not Luke, Ben and company defeat Abeloth. Especially since we most likely will soon have Abeloth learn of Allana's identity and start coming after her.

Though i do wonder about this whole Throne thing. It seems, the way it is kind of set up now, that basically the Jedi should be able to go back and check it every now and then to see if things are on the right path. That could potentially be a silly plot device to have around, so i wonder if somehow when Abeloth is defeated, the access to view the Throne is also destroyed?

Maybe that is part of what started this whole thing, Jacen opened up a way to view the throne. In doing so, he was able to glimpse what the future was heading to, but in doing so, he had to pay the price of also unleashing Abeloth? So being able to view the future comes at a price

Either way, it seems that FotJ is set up to show whether Allana or the Dark Man wins. And Allana will still be too young to play much of an active role in it.

 

To be honest, I don't really want to know. I hope that they get away from that era for a long while. Nothing after ROTJ for a long time. Keep the stories before Episode 1. It's were they really are interesting

 

i wonder why, if that is how it will play out, Jacen felt that there would be no chance at all of helping Luke not become the dark man



You'd think someone as experienced as Jacen would know that there would need to be a real major reason for Luke Skywalker at this time in his career to turn completely to the dark side, which is what it seemed the dark man was. Why would Jacen, so obsessed with knowledge, not want to know why Luke was falling?


I still dont buy that as the reason, I think its completely made up after Betrayal was written

 

Then we go back in circles with Jacen being the cause of what would make Luke become the dark man, when Jacen supposedly fell to prevent that from happening.

Plus, the one thing that you would think would turn Luke completely dark happened, and he didnt fall completely. So what exactly was Jacen seeing with Luke as the Dark Man on the Throne? How would Mara have died any worse than being murdered by Luke's nephew to set him down that path?

Had Jacen seen that Luke was going to fall because Mara died, so he then became the dark man to have someone Luke could fight, which prevents Luke from falling himself, how exactly was Mara going to die prior to Jacen falling that would have made Luke dark? Because if your own nephew murders your wife, and that doesn?t send you completely down the dark side path, I fail to see what would have been a worse circumstance.
So Jacen?s view of the Throne of Balance with Luke on it doesn?t seem like it was set in stone by any means and didn?t need him sacrificing himself becoming Caedus


Because the worst happened to Luke and he didn?t fall


Which makes me think that it wasn?t really Luke that Jacen saw on the throne



Luke was shown to struggle with Mara dying, both for real in LotF and as an illusion in Swarm War, as might be expected when your wife dies. But neither time did he turn to the dark side or into the dark man. I don?t see why we are to now believe that Jacen saw Luke falling to become the dark man, so now he had to become Caedus to prevent that. Or mainly, why we are to believe it was ever set in stone in the way they are trying to make the Throne into



If they go down that path, I hope they give a really good explanation of why Luke would have fallen to become the Dark Man, because really, what is worse than what happened to him already? I just want there to be more of a story than ?oh, Luke on the Dark side would be baaaaaaaad?, because right now, it seems like nothing more than a simple re-write after Betrayal and LotF were done, that so far, doesn?t really fit yet

 

I don't see Luke as the Dark Man on the throne since Jacen said it wasn't him. I guess Jacen could have lied to Luke which is certainly possible, but I just don't see Luke as the Dark Man. It seems like there has to be a lot of assuming in order to have Luke turn and I don't think that he would have. Why would Luke have become the Dark Man anyway? I don't think that Luke would have become the "greatest evil" and basically try to take over the galaxy just because of Mara's death. I have always thought that the Dark Man was Ben because that makes the most sense to me with all of the circumstances of what had happened.

 

A bad place, sure. But he was there just a moment, and clearly didn?t become the Dark Man on the Throne that Jacen was so terrified of. The Dark Man seemed to be someone that lasted more than 2 chapters of a book

If THAT is what Jacen was afraid of, to the point of him feeling he needed to sacrifice himself?..eh, not really buying it

Yeah I can agree with that. But then, why would Jacen feel that making himself Luke?s enemy would be the way to prevent that in the first place?

This does seem to be where it is headed, given the facts we have in place now

I just don?t really like the Dark Man stuff being set in stone with Luke falling, yet its clearly not set in stone since Jacen (or someone else) was able to change it to Allana on the Throne



I feel your explanation fits if we have all the facts we are going to get. I just hope we get more to the story than this. It feels like there is more to the backstory than we currently have. If this ends up to be it, it will be a little unfulfilling. I feel that Jacen?s backstory has so much more potential than what we have so far, I hope we get more of it tied in to Abeloth, rather than just shifting everything to Abeloth now



Not even getting into the part where I feel it is completely ridiculous to have a set destiny in star wars, considering that contradicts everything we saw in the movies

 

I suppose this could have been Jacen's way to try to prevent Ben from going down that path. He could have completely controlled Ben's training and everything to be able to prevent him from becoming the Dark Man. Jacen felt being a Sith wasnt a path to ruin if done right, so if he led Ben that way, Ben obviously wouldnt then become the Dark Man, since Jacen felt he had all the answers


I dont really buy it being Ben though

 

Yeah i agree, its all a bit too vague right now. Its a lot of promises of something bigger and huge, and we so far are supposed to just buy into it blindly


It has the potential to really live up to its hype, I just hope they do more than Luke summarize everything at the end for reasons of why everything happened

 

so from what little we have learned from jacens 5 year journey he started at the

ainng tii
mindwalkers learned about the dark man


dathmir witches


baron ado sages

fallaniss

we still have some filling in to do for that 5 years he was gone

 

I love this theory - it's great. Not only is it sort of poetic, story-wise, but it lines up with a lot of the clues we've been given over the years. While I still sometimes maintain the notion that even the authors have no idea who or what the dark man is, this goes a long way toward explaining that they might have a plan after all, even if it's just taken this long for it to come to fruition. It's all about the context, and we weren't really given any in those visions Jacen had in Betrayal - just quick flashes which merely describe how they killed each other, not why or when.

Love this, too. The mental imagery is great.

Exactly. There was hardly any context at all to Jacen's "flashforward" visions, other than Jacen killed Luke a bunch of times and Luke killed Jacen other times. He couldn't tell whether Luke had fallen to the dark side, or if HE was the Sith in those visions. We have to remember that Jacen was selfless (a word Luke himself used to describe him) and would have wanted to do anything in his power to try and redeem Luke before simply killing him.

Agreed! Couldn

 

I havent read Betrayal in a while, but i always remember it as that is all Jacen saw as well. I dont remember any indication that he had any more context than what we were shown on page

Do you think he saw any more than what we saw on page?

 

Yeah I always saw it as a case of, seeing himself kill Luke was enough to jar him out of the vision-trance and want to take up Lumiya on her offer, no matter the context. It's almost like he didn't care what the context of it all was, just that preventing Luke's death was the only thing that mattered, even if Luke was Sith.

 

In all honestly, I expect that it's going to be completely dropped. Denning appears to have had his say on the matter in Abyss, and no one's given any indication of any further interest on that plotline. It's the tassels all over again.

 

yeah that wouldnt surprise me at all


its a shame really, it had a lot of potential

 

One major reason to not agree that it's Luke: then that means that Luke falling was all but predestined, and could only be averted by things out of his control. Even ANAKIN SKYWALKER had a chance to avoid being Vader, but CHOSE not to take it. He CHOSE to fall.

This just feels so utterly dissonant with the films, that the dark side can only corrupt you if you let it.

"Never. I'll never turn to the dark side."
"No, Skywalker, you'll be my apprentice, and then a few decades down the line your beloved nephew will become a Sith to stop you from becoming one. And torch Kashyyk. And drop some asteroids on civilized city centers, and so on and so forth. You're all borked, in other words. One way or another, one of you Skywalkers goes dark. "

doesn't hold the same ring as Luke tossing his lightsaber aside and affirming his place as a Jedi.

It's all about your choice. If you're going to fall unless your beloved nephew becomes a despotic IMBECILE to prevent you from doing so, WTK are people doing training in the Force in the FIRST place? Oh, sure, you can choose the light, until some idiotic predestination ensures that there will be suffering and woe NO MATTER WHAT.

I don't buy it. Hell, I dislike the entire Throne of Balance/fixing the future concept to BEGIN with.