ST THE RISE OF SKYWALKER mirroring and symbolism

Spoiler

Yes, Supreme Leader (actually Pryde answers to Palpatine - the Sith cheat playbook).


Yes, My Master (Answering to Palpatine who started cheating his way into the Republic)

Palpatine pulling the strings.

Cheers!

MJ

 

A few other things worthy of note here:

1. Anakin pulls his lightsider weapon on Palpatine.

2. Luke pulls his lightsider weapon on Palpatine and Anakin, as Vader, defends him with his darksider weapon.

3. Kylo pulls his darksider weapon on Palpatine, who urges him to become what Vader could not.

Light > Light/Dark > Dark
And Anakin is present/relevant in all three scenarios.

 

That saber in the snow (TFA) Vader's helmet in the snow (TROS)

I mean: Rey is in Kylo's quaters, Kylo is in Kijimi. They fight. Those red beans are not spilled over the snow - but over the floor of Kylo's ship. But then the film cuts to Rey when the bond ends, and they are not there. They just disappear.

Beans being spilled. About what? The helmet? Rey took the saber from the snow in TFA. Maybe someone took the helmet. Not Kylo. This moodboard.

It looks like...the wolf/grandmother thing in little red riding hood. Witchcraft, since we know the wolf (Vader) to be dead.

 

SPOILERS
I love a LOT of the stuff on Exegol, especially towards the end of TRoS. I love all the cloaked figures that evoked an image in my mind, all the Sith that ever lived in one place.

For all the crap that TRoS gets from people, it has some great setups and payoffs:
X-wing established as underwater in The Last Jedi. Payoff in TRoS with Luke raising the X-wing out of the water. I loved that SO much for so many reasons. For one, it shows a force ghost can use the force, it shows that Luke never completely lost faith, and it shows us that Luke is still the Luke we all know and love.

I also like that Rey, as powerful as she is still has to train. Also, in light of how much people labeled her as a "Mary Sue", the movie did a great job revealing her vulnerabilities as a character.

I also like that in bringing Rey back to life, Ben had to sacrifice his life. It's the unwritten rule that using light side powers as a dark side user drains your life force, especially if you're resurrecting somebody. What Ben did was tremendously brave, because I think he knew that saving her life would end his own life.

I was touched by that scene where Rey kills Ben... then she realizes how far she's already fallen in trying to kill him, so much so that as a gesture of incredible trust, she heals him right there, on the spot.

I also loved, LOVED that they inverted that very dark scene with Han from TFA. That was so beautiful I can't even tell you.

 

@HevyDevy you never did the legacy lightsaber posts my friend

 

I don't think Ben resurrecting Rey had anything to do with dark side power or even being a dark sider. they pretty much set the concept up earlier in the film with Rey and the Snake. that you can heal as long as you give some of your life force.

 

Yep. It's all about transferring energy. If the person you save is too close to death, you'll have to spend so much of your life force that you'll die in their stead. Otherwise, you'll have to defy nature somehow, which would require dark side powers.

This explains why, for instance, it was too late for Obi-Wan to save Qui-Gon in TPM. Too much time had passed since Maul stabbed him and if Obi-Wan had reversed the injury, he would've died. Qui-Gon wouldn't have allowed that, which is why he said "It's too late".

 

Possible! Even though I see another interpretation which I prefer: force healing as some ancient jedi knowledge Rey learned in the old jedi texts and passed to Ben through their dyad. Force healing might have been 'normal' back in years but at some point the jedi went pretty dogmatic (as we see in the PT) and it was frowned upon to "manipulate the way of life and death". Remember Yoda in ROTS? He said: "Death is a natural part of life. Rejoice for those around you who transform into the Force. Mourn them do not. Miss them do not. Attachment leads to jealousy. The shadow of greed that is." I have the feeling that force healing was a misunderstood technique at some point. Rey proofed better and used this ancient skill in a selfless way for the good - and so did Ben.

 

Well id imagine the only reason it killed Ben is because Rey was dead and he gave all his life force to bring her back. while i dunno if that counts with Obi Wan and Qui-Gon because Qui-Gon wasn't dead. and apparently Rey by herself alone had enough life force to heal a snake and heal Kylo. i suppose you could say Qui-Gon was dying and thats why Obi Wan couldn't do it. but wouldn't you at least try to heal the wound at the hope of saving him?

I dunno. i don't quite understand the rules to this force power and i ain't sure Lucasfilm does either. they probably will make rules for it. but we will see how that turns out.

 

TROS does have one execution scene. Remember when Poe, Finn and Chewie are about to be executed until General Hux intervenes

 

The third film in each trilogy has a speeder chase

RotS: Obi Wan on the varactyl chasing General Grievous on the wheel speeder. Obi Wan falls off of the varactyl
RotJ: Luke and Leia on the speeder bikes. Both of them fall of their speeder
TRoS: Rey, Finn, Poe, Chewbacca, C-3PO and BB-8 on the speeder. They all get thrown off

And the third film in each trilogy has a huge space battle between two starfleets over a planet

 

my point was that if you are a dark side user, using light side powers drains your life force because you’re not in alignment with that aspect of the force. This concept was used in the knights of the old republic games.

 

Well, that's not what's established in TROS, or anywhere else in Star Wars canon. Rey explains it on Pasaana: Force healing is done by transferring one's own life force to someone else. Ben dies because reviving Rey requires all of his life force. It's as simple as that.

Besides, he is no longer a darksider at that point.

 

Bad editing?

 

Sure, maybe. But if this theory above happens to be correct, it would look like bad editing all the same from our 2021 perspective.

More about witchcraft.

 

I think the movie clearly shows us that the life force given is rechargeable. That’s what BB-8 does with D-O. I don’t think Obi-Wan knew Force healing. Ben have given so much of his life that it killed him. We saw Luke exert so much power it killed him. Also Ben was severely injured from his fall - that might have been the reason he died. A third option is Ben Solo isn’t dead. He was moved somewhere else by Leia.

 

Yeah, I'd say it's a given that the life force regenerates over time. That's how nature works. We use energy, but we also charge ourselves with food, rest, sunlight etc.

I find it very unlikely that the Jedi had somehow forgotten about Force healing though, since it's such a basic and frankly obvious way for a Force user to help others.

 

Can’t forget what you never knew. If it was known, why didn’t Anakin try it in his mother? The other possibility was it being forbidden. So the Jedi we’re not taught how to use. Anakin has a line about knowning the Jedi were hold back certain knowledge from him. Maybe it was to dangerous as path to the dark side?

At the same time Palpatine made it sound very unique and exotic that Darth Plaguis could save the ones he cared about from dying.

 

Again, healing people is an obvious application of Force usage. Especially for the Jedi, who are all about helping others.
Anakin wasn't in the business of sacrificing his own life to save others, though. He wanted to live and keep those he loved around. That selfishness was his great flaw.
He certainly put himself in danger a lot of the time, but he wouldn't have done that if he hadn't believed he'd make it. Saving Shmi in AOTC would've killed him, without question. That's why he didn't try.
Besides, she was content ("Now, I am complete") and on some level, he may have respected that.

I might be wrong, though. It's possible that the power Palpatine talks about is what we see in TROS - and that it was actually a light side power all along.
Or a neutral power that may be light or dark depending on how and why it is used.

 

ROTS : Twice the pride, double the fall.

TROS: Stand together, die together.

Sith confidence. Nothing like it!

Cheers!

MJ

 

Stealing this one but I think it's brilliant...

 

Here's my take on Ben healing Rey / bringing her back from death: it's not something that can be done so simply, so Jedi cannot usually just heal others who are about to die (or otherwise, the entire plot of ROTS would become strange). How about Ben was only able to bring Rey back under these special circumstances because she had healed him from a fatal wound earlier? When dealing with the vexis serpent, Rey blatantly says she was transferring some of her life energy to the snake. So, when healing Kylo, she gave some of her very own life energy to him. A part of her lived on in him.

So Kylo didn't really heal her in that sense, but rather gave her back her own life energy that she had sent to him earlier. So she could live on, and thus, he had to die.

 

YES!! Agreed with everything! I LOVE TRoS. There are so many good scenes in it! So much visual candy, so many good scenes honestly. It made me appreciate and love Rey as a character. At first, I will admit I was sceptical. Not negative in any way, and she was a sweet character. But I grew to love Rey in this one. And I feel like I could understand (and in an abstract way) relate to her. And it made me fall in love with Luke all over again. Luke always had a special place in my heart, and loved him in these movies. He didn't have much screentime, but the journey he had was non the less very powerful. He dealt with all the skeletons in his closet and was finally at peace.
I also think that scene where Rey kills Ben was very powerful. I've watched that one so many times. It's pure storytelling, arc building, character development art. Fantastic!

And the inverted/wishful sceen with Han mirroring the one from TFA is heartbreaking and when you really dig down into why Kylo had that scene, it's just so ....I'm speechless.

Poe's reaction to the spy-reveal is one of the best things ever, lmao. Just the utter absolute shock in his loud voice as he finds out is so funny.

 

Thank you! Yes, to be honest I’m really surprised that it gets so much hate. When I saw the first trailer and realized Palpatine was coming back, I thought to myself “all right, They’re taking a cue from the expanded universe novel dark empire in which the emperor comes back several years after the events of return of the Jedi.”

A lot of people give the movie flack because of “fan service”, but the way I see it pretty much every decision in that movie led to furthering the story or enhancing it in someway or another, which I always approve of.

there are two really important metrics I use to judge whether or not the movie is great: 1) did I fall in love with the characters? Most definitely.
2) do I want to watch this again and again? also yes!
By the way you might enjoy this:

 

Bear with me (follow the color code )

TPM: (Phantom Menace - Palpatine behind the shadows) (something elsewhere but can't be pinpointed)

End of TPM

Yoda: Confer on you, the level of Jedi Knight the Council does. But agree
on you taking this boy as your Padawan learner, I do not.
Obi Wan: Master Yoda, I gave Qui-Gon my word. I will train Anakin. Without
the approval of the Council if I must. (that Anakin will eventually correct the impending imbalance that the Jedi find hard to accept)
YODA : Qui-Gon's defiance I sense in you. Need that, you do not. Agree, the council does. Your apprentice, young Skywalker will be. (So Yoda acquiesces)

ROTS: (The Phantom Emperor reveals his presence; comes out of the shadows)

Start of TROS

Rey: Luke searched for it. For a long time. He nearly found it.(to correct the imbalance as he envisioned Palpatine returned- he pinpointed it)
Leia : "No" (Leia isn't happy the Rey goes to face the Emperor)
Rey: "I don't want to go without your blessings, but I will "( she leading the way to find the Emperor to correct the imbalance)
Rey: "It's what you will do" - (so Leia acquiesces to Rey's insistence, gives Luke's saber to Rey)

Cheers!

MJ