The Second Installment of the 2004 Jedi Draft

yeah his duel lasted longer than Obi's...it was close....but come on...compare the TPM duel...a group of fairly evenly matched fighters, going at it for a little while...Anakin was outclassed by dooku, so was obi-wan...I'd say the gap b/w anakin and dooku is about the same as the gap b/w dooku and yoda...

 

Some very good match-ups today. For the record, as an objective person, I would have taken Qui-Gon over Tiin. It'd be a great fight, but I think Qui-Gon could take it.

As for me, Exar Kun and Bastilla vs Arca and the auto loss for the TRUMP. Hopefully Kun takes the auto loss, and Arca takes out Bastilla. We'll see.

 

And in the novel Anakin was throwing some pretty serious offense against Dooku. Did you see Dooku's expression after the fight with Anakin. He looked exhausted.
=================
Well, he is 431 years old .




EDIT: And for the record, Dooku did not struggle with Anakin much at all in my opinion. Anakin fought valiently, but was just simply outclassed. Yes, I do think Luminara could have gone toe to toe with Dooku for 1 and a half minutes, and did everything that Anakin did.

EDIT: Nice to hear that people think I'm predictable

I dont think he meant it as an insult. I would take it as a compliment, because it proves you are consistent in how you judge. At least that is how I read it.


EDIT:Come on people, it's the freakin' Chosen One!


Choosen one does not equal power. That isnt what chosen one means. It's just an expression of his role in the force. Others are more powerful, strong etc....

 

Actually Chosen One does equal power. It can also equal untapped power which is what it is for Anakin. It does however mean power.

I personally don't think Anakin is a 1st round pick either. I only drafted him in the last draft because of how I deemed the judges thought of him. In this draft I traded for him to get Agen Kolar in the 4th spot.

I just can't really diss him since he is on my team. It doesn't matter now since I can longer win though.

 

The gap between Yoda and Dooku is not that big at all in my opinion. I don't understand why people think Yoda crushed him. First off Yoda was winning but he also hadn't fought Obi-Wan Kenobi and Anakin Skywalker previous to the fight as had Dooku. If Dooku was fresh like Yoda I wonder how different that fight would be. I personally think there would be a good chance Dooku could win it. Yoda was very tired after his fight with Dooku. Dooku was tired as well but he had been fighting for longer. With the extra energy he would've had it may have been enough to outlast Yoda. I would vote for Yoda over Dooku but it is a very tough call in my opinion.

For the record I would've voted for Dooku over Mace in the previous round had I been a judge. Dooku has the all important saber to saber combat. Mace does not really have that. He had some in Shatterpoint which I won't mention since I don't want to spoil it for anyone who wants to read it or is reading it.

 

What I mean by that is that people often equate TCO to mean "most powerful". That just simply isnt true no matter which way you look at it. The Chosen One refers to the prophecy of the one who will bring balance to the force.

The above words are Mace's I believe.

No where does it say "most powerful" or anything along those lines. It just refers to his role in the force's scheme of things. Power is not needed to restore balance. In the end, it was love that did it, not any SuperPower.





EDIT: I personally think there would be a good chance Dooku could win it. Yoda was very tired after his fight with Dooku. Dooku was tired as well but he had been fighting for longer.


Many reasons to your query.


1. Dooku was on the defensive for basically he entire fight.

2. Dooku was trying to kill Yoda at first, Yoda was just trying to capture him. Even with that latent advantage, Dooku didnt make a dent.

3. It was specifically written into the orginal screenplay to enforce the idea that Yoda was much stronger. In fact, in the original screenplay, Yoda actually knocks the saber clean out of Dooku's hand, cracks him in the face,knocks him down, and stands on his shoulder (at which point Dooku crushes the tower).

Among others...but there is no way Dooku would have won. GL wrote it and edited it that way for a reason.








EDIT: For the record I would've voted for Dooku over Mace in the previous round had I been a judge. Dooku has the all important saber to saber combat. Mace does not really have that


Vapaad Masters know and Master all the forms before moving on to Vapaad. It is like a prequisite. So the knowledge is there, but perhaps not at Dooku's level, which I think is what I said

 

That was not clear from how you worded it though. You pretty much said it doesn't mean power which it clearly does. I agree that it doesn't mean most powerful.

I understand your point now and for the most part I agree with it.

 

Dooku was tired though, Yoda wasn't. As I said I think Yoda would win but it would be in doubt in my opinion. Yoda didn't destroy Dooku like most people think. If he did then he would've killed or wounded him. From what we have seen in the movies I think Dooku is clearly the 2nd best with a lightsaber. Only Yoda is better. I think Dooku would wipe the floor with Vader, Luke, Anakin, Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, and Maul. Obviously that is only the movies. Using Luke's whole career obviously gives him the win. I don't think that is the case for the others. Vader really doesn't have much saber combat. He goes about 20 years without fighting and remains to be seen how big a role he has in the purge. AOTC seemed to indicate that most of the Jedi will die in the Clone Wars. With Mace we really don't know how good a fighter he really is. We have only heard how good he is.

 

Mastering all the forms is far different from being in actual lightsaber combat against another force user. He has sparred with many top masters but I doubt those are ever to the death or serious injury like it would be against a real opponent.

 

Good points, this is why i like this draft !

Dooku was tired though, Yoda wasn't. As I said I think Yoda would win but it would be in doubt in my opinion.

Yoda was slowing down a bit at the end of his fight. Whether that was because he was tired, or whether he wanted to take the fight down a nothc is a mystery in my eyes.

Yoda didn't destroy Dooku like most people think. If he did then he would've killed or wounded him.

No, he wouldnt have killed him at all. That was never the goal. His goal was to capture him and in effect,stop the war, (and question him about his suspecious activities). As far as wounding him, hey the fight was only about a minute long. Dooku is good enough that if he fights purely defensively, he wont get hit. Yoda isnt THAT good.


From what we have seen in the movies I think Dooku is clearly the 2nd best with a lightsaber. Only Yoda is better. I think Dooku would wipe the floor with Vader, Luke, Anakin, Qui-Gon, Obi-Wan, and Maul.

I actually agree with you there out of the people you mentioned (at least until e3 comes out). However, it is kind of hard to judge Vaders' overall skill level, since he was so messed up from his inner conflicts, fighting Luke etc...


Obviously that is only the movies. Using Luke's whole career obviously gives him the win. I don't think that is the case for the others. Vader really doesn't have much saber combat. He goes about 20 years without fighting and remains to be seen how big a role he has in the purge. AOTC seemed to indicate that most of the Jedi will die in the Clone Wars. With Mace we really don't know how good a fighter he really is. We have only heard how good he is.

Actually in various comics we see him kill some quasi-prominent jedi, which I can only assume should be used to judge. Dark Women is a good example, and there are others.

The tricky thing about Mace (and others) is that you have to project some sort of "level" to put them at, given the information you do have. I dont think, generally that people should gain points for being "seen", if you do have enough info to go on for the other person. That makes judging tricky, because you have to project SO much against what you know, in order to be fair. At least that is how I see it. Otherwise, we would have Geonosis random jedi #4 beating someone like Even Piell, who we have basically never seen, only read about.



EDIT: Also worth mentioning, I do think you have to take story lines into account when deciding things like this. For instance, I think Yoda is better than Luke. But would Vader have a tougher time against Luke or Yoda? I would say Luke, because of his inner conflicts. That is 1 example.


Or you infer things from the story. Like we all know that Sidious uses a aprrentice until a stronger one coms along (ROTJ). Would it not stand to reason that he casts aside Dooku for Vader at least in some part to that? There might be other things involved, but that is the type of thing I am talking about.

Or how people sometimes down play Sidious...if Sidious is so weak or inept at fighting, why doesnt Dooku just rise up and become the Master? Why didnt Vader? Vader didnt feel comfortable doing that until Luke cam on board.

Of course, there is no answer to that that is clear and dry. But I do think things like that merit some attention, so I give it attention

 

I would look at the Luminara Anakin fight like this,

Luminara has basically no experience fighting in blade to blade matches. *Correct me if I am wrong*

Anakin has a lot of experience. He has fought Dooku and Ventress.

I really think that Anakin could take Luminara. After all look at the Clone Wars Cartoons, Anakin whoops Ventress and Luminara is pinned down by droids that Padme was able to kill...... well not really but her and her apprentice had to be saved by Yoda.

 

I would assume that Lumi has experience figting others in sparing and the like. But your right, Anakin has a advantage there. I would hardly call 2 fights a "huge" amount of experience, but it helps.'



But there is a problem in my eyes, at looking at one moment in time and judging off of that. For instance, in The Approaching STorm, Luminara basically cleans house while Anakin doesnt fight quite as well (imo). But then, the roles are reveresed in the cartoons.


So i try and take a whole career into account, like Corran said. It makes it easier.


EDIT: Well, Im off until tomorrow. Nice discussion everyone. See you all later.

 

He has been in combat with another lightsaber wielder. That is a huge advantage and not mentioned nearly enough in the judging.

Attaboy Niktos, attaboy.

 

Luminara is a stud, but Ani is the chosen one. How can this even be debated?

Anakin has fought with 2 blades, with one blade vs. a two blade opponant and won, nearly got Dooku...as a PADAWAN...I'll stop there.

 

Game 2: The Masters of Death (NiktosRule)[1] vs. Army of Light (EmperorWindu)[2]
Anakin Skywalker vs. Luminara Unduli - This is not so tough to me, and I am not sure why there is such debate. Anakin is indeed the chosen one, and the highest midichorian (sp) count of the Jedi. Now, he is unrefined power, true. Luminara "forged her body into a weapon" - that means nothing to me. That kind of stat is e_s trying to talk up his player. Facts are facts, sure, but I believe what I see. Anakin vs. Ventress. He was getting beaten, so he kicked it up a notch, then another then another. Yes, dark side, but hey, it really works for him - this kid has rage issues, deep seeded hurt that fuels him. Luminara will put up a hell of an offensive, and then like Assaj Ventress, get sliced and diced and overwhelmed by the kids abilities to keep going stronger and stronger.

Lumi is not Dooku. And Anakin learned from that costly duel, one would hope, but how can we say? Lumi would lose to Dooku too. And so did Assaj Ventress, who, as we all know, Anakin kills.

While I appriciate a debate, this has been blow out of proportion. Another simplier way to put it - is Luminara a Franchise player? No. Is Anakin Skywalker? Yes. Why - and if he is not, then why does he consistantly get picked first round? why isn't she picked first round then?

Winner: Anakin Skywalker

new matched up momentarily.

 

Oh well, I did call it an upset for a reason. And I did feel more comfortable doing it, since that match had already been decided, in effect.

 

Alright, now that the Anakin/Luminara saga is over, we can continue. I have been busy at work already today, which is why I did not post earlier, and I think I will be equally busy throughout the day, but we made great ground yesterday, and these next two round might get in today ? so Judges, please, start preparing the team battles now. One, of course, is already decided froma previous round, so you really can cut and paste that and just do the other two. Anyway, let?s stick to the battle at hand, shall we?

Round 4: Battle 5

The fifth number called is 2!

Winner?s Bracket:
Game 1: Free Kobe (Darth-Horax) [1] vs. The Unified Force (Gaeri)[3]
Shaak Ti vs. A'Sharad Hett & Sharad Hett via Trump

Loser?s Bracket:

Game 1: The Saber Masters (SaberLeader) [3] vs. Janson?s Yellow Jedi (JansonsYellowAces)[1]
Automatic loss due to use of Tyvokka is previous TRUMP vs. Exar Kun

Game 2: The Masters of Death (NiktosRule)[2] vs. Army of Light (EmperorWindu)[2]
Eeth Koth vs. Obi-Wan Kenobi

May the Force be With you

Let?s Get it ON!

Madine out

 

Whoops, I already had to go, but these are quick enough anyway. I may tkae a while Madine to get my team fights posted Madine, cause i got to go noiw.

Winner?s Bracket:
Game 1: Free Kobe (Darth-Horax) [1] vs. The Unified Force (Gaeri)[3]
Shaak Ti vs. A'Sharad Hett & Sharad Hett via Trump

Verdict: Ti is good, but cant handle 3 blades, and the raw speed and power, and cohesion of this family trump.

Winner: Hett Trump

Game 1: The Saber Masters (SaberLeader) [3] vs. Janson?s Yellow Jedi (JansonsYellowAces)[1]
Automatic loss due to use of Tyvokka is previous TRUMP vs. Exar Kun

Winner: Exar Kun

Game 2: The Masters of Death (NiktosRule)[2] vs. Army of Light (EmperorWindu)[2]
Eeth Koth vs. Obi-Wan Kenobi

Verdict: While not a blowout, there is really no debating that Obi Wan isnt better than Eeth Koth up and down the board. Also, he is the CW and OT. Koth isnt. Obi wins.

Winner: Obi wan kenobi

 

Would someone mind telling me what GFFA stands for?

Toady is my last day at my co-op placement!!! I am excited to go back to school oddly enough.

 

Game 1:
The Match-Up - Shaak Ti vs. A'Sharad Hett and Sharad Hett

Shaak vs. A'Sharad would have been really difficult to judge, but the addition of Hett Sr. seals the victory for The Unified Force.

The Winner: Hett Family Trump


Game 2:
The Match-Up - Tyvokka (Forfeit) vs. Exar Kun

The Winner: Exar Kun


Game 3:
The Match-Up - Eeth Koth vs. Obi-Wan Kenobi

No way Koth can stand against the power of Obi-Wan.

The Winner: Obi-Wan Kenobi


Love 'em or Hate 'em, those are my picks.

Let's Get it On!!

P.S. I've got to leave for a while, but I'll be back later this afternoon.

EDIT: I believe the G.F.F.A. stands for the Galactic Federation of Free Alliances.

~Corran

 

Galaxy Far Far Away

 

The sixth and final number for Round 4 is 4!

Winner?s Bracket:
Game 1: Free Kobe (Darth-Horax) [1] vs. The Unified Force (Gaeri)[4]
Vodo Siosk-Baas vs. Automatic loss due to use of Sharad Hett in previous Trump

Loser?s Bracket:

Game 1: The Saber Masters (SaberLeader) [3] vs. Janson?s Yellow Jedi (JansonsYellowAces)[2]
Arca Jeth vs. Bastilla Shan

Game 2: The Masters of Death (NiktosRule)[2] vs. Army of Light (EmperorWindu)[3]
Agen Kolar vs. Foul Mouduma

May the Force be With you

Let?s Get it ON!

Madine out

 

Amateur Horax Amateur Horax Amateur Horax.

What do you think about that? You lost to the same GM that beat me... meaning our match would have been a good one. It also proves that you had an easier road than I did .

 

Winner?s Bracket:
Game 1: Free Kobe (Darth-Horax) [1] vs. The Unified Force (Gaeri)[4]
Vodo Siosk-Baas vs. Automatic loss due to use of Sharad Hett in previous Trump

Winner: Vodo Baas


Loser?s Bracket:

Game 1: The Saber Masters (SaberLeader) [3] vs. Janson?s Yellow Jedi (JansonsYellowAces)[2]
Arca Jeth vs. Bastilla Shan

Verdict: Kind of a tricky fight. However, Arca was one of the best his time, very solid in battle, and a great teacher of powerful students. Overall, I just think he is more powerful than Bbastilla, and a better fighter as well. That is enough to get the win.

Game 2: The Masters of Death (NiktosRule)[2] vs. Army of Light (EmperorWindu)[3]
Agen Kolar vs. Foul Mouduma

Verdict: While I do think this would be closer had we more information on Foul, there is really no denying that with what we do have, Kolar is by far the stronge of these 2. He will win with his superior saber skills, and overall experiences, and force power.

Winner: Agen Kolar

 

Yeah, my team sucks! I knew there'd be a trump, but I was hoping it would fall on a lower pick than Vodo.

Oh well, at least I'm still in the running, BBurditt!