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Lit Books Thrawn: BOOK III: LESSER EVIL by Timothy Zahn. Nov 16th, 2021.

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Jedi Master Frizzy, Apr 1, 2021.

  1. Chris0013

    Chris0013 Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    May 21, 2014
    Just finished...I still wish we got pictures and stats for all the ships and a map of the Chaos.
     
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  2. Golbolco

    Golbolco Jedi Master star 4

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    Jan 20, 2016
    With all the new names and nouns in this trilogy, a WEG-style sourcebook or other visual representation would be highly appreciated.
     
  3. mnjedi

    mnjedi JCC Arena Game Host star 5 VIP - Game Host

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    Nov 4, 2012
    I think it’s interesting that Thrawn seems to take the wrong lesson from this into his dealings with the empire. A big part of the reason that he is able to triumph over Jixtus is that unlike the rest of the Chiss he’s willing to understand and work with the other alien species of the region, and they all come together in the climactic battle. Yet he can’t see it himself and actually infers the opposite as the reason the Republic fell and why the Empire is necessary.

    Love that out of all the alien tech, he goes with the gravity well generator as the key to his battle plan. That is such a classically Thrawn move I couldn’t help but grin when I realized it.
     
  4. imiller

    imiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2004
    I really wish they'd make a comic adaptation of this particular trilogy, because of all the new ships and characters and planets. I really loved the adaptation of the 2017 novel, and this would be even cooler to see done in 18 parts.

    I was blown away by the novel itself. I have gradually enjoyed this series more and more each book - the first one was a bit of rough going, the second one really sucked me into Chiss culture and the intensity of the subtle plots by the villains, but this one - not only was there a wonderfully done sense of tragedy and loss because of how Zahn makes this novel dovetail perfectly with the 2017 novel, but there's also an actual emotional connection that Zahn made for Thrawn, with all the Thrass stuff. I never thought I'd get emotional over the cold hearted jerk Thrawn, but...last night, when I finished, I was really moved.

    And I'm still amazed editorial let him get away with BASICALLY making Outbound Flight part of the story. :)

    I do wish that Zahn would be able to write a "Fall of Thrawn" type of book or short story, where you see him go from being nobly committed to the protection of his people to being willing to exploit entire races like the Noghri, and betray his word to Mara in Dark Force Rising. I could easily see something happening in the time between his absence during the OT and later one that would corrupt him, but I'd like to see what Zahn's take on that is.

    I also wish that they would have made a sprayed edges special edition to match the red-edged pages for Greater Good. :( I don't really want to collect the Out of Print Tees super special expensive edition, but I would have sprung for a bit extra for the Goldsborough Books edition. :(
     
  5. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    Headcanon:- the star superweapon is a Sith relic from Naga Sadow’s Empire.
     
  6. imiller

    imiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2004
    But why not the Rakatans? :)
     
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  7. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    Because in 5000 BBY Naga Sadow blew up some suns, mainly!

    Not sure if we could take it that the invaders in the centuries after were Vitiate’s Sith
     
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  8. SyndicThrass

    SyndicThrass Force Ghost star 5

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    Sep 25, 2016
    Nearing the end of this, and there’s a lot to process. It’s definitely the most emotional Thrawn story in a long time, maybe ever.

    The back to back moments of Thrawn’s sister having no memory of him, with the Thrass chapter of him dying in Outbound Flight really hit hard.
     
  9. imiller

    imiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2004
    Absolutely. I never, ever thought I would get emotionally worked up reading a Thrawn novel BECAUSE of Thrawn, but I really did this time. Made this one very special.
     
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  10. imiller

    imiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2004
    You make a good point, but did it say specifically that the tech was from contemporary civilizations?
     
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  11. SyndicThrass

    SyndicThrass Force Ghost star 5

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    Sep 25, 2016
    Well, it is accomplished.

    I now need to go take a walk in the woods or meditate by a lake or something and gather my thoughts on this book.

    Immediately reaction though, they gotta do another Ascendancy Trilogy. With or without Thrawn.
     
  12. imiller

    imiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2004
    I'm absolutely up for more Zahn writing about the Chiss!
     
  13. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    I nearly cried.

    It just hit so hard.
     
  14. imiller

    imiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2004
    Same. This book was so excellent.
     
  15. SyndicThrass

    SyndicThrass Force Ghost star 5

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    Sep 25, 2016
    So, having had time to chew on this some, I think I can say that I really liked the book. Some reservations of course, but few things are without them.

    I’ll get the stuff I didn’t like out of the way first before I get to the good stuff.

    Conceptually I think this all mostly works for me, though I think when it comes to the writing style itself Zahn focuses on the wrong details. He’s not the most “visual” of writers, but I feel like that’s gotten worse as the years have gone on. I think it stands out more here because we’re in a whole new world with new species, new ships, major new characters and we don’t get much, if any physical details to help the imagination along. I think that genuinely hurts the experience here.

    Conversely, Zahn feels the need to tell us the names of every single crew member on the bridge of several major ships. It’s unnecessary information, because most of the time they’re not really characters and their long, unwieldy Chiss names can be daunting and confusing. It slows the reading process down and several times I had to catch myself because I had gotten mixed up about which ship I was following during the major battles

    The battles themselves, they’re a mixed bag. I could follow them after a fashion and saw the cleverness, but I found them pretty boring save the big climatic one. I think I’ve got to come to terms that I don’t find these kinds of action scenes engaging.

    Now that’s all technical issues, when it comes to the narrative itself I think only have one, and that’s that we didn’t get any major new pieces of information on the Grysks. I did enjoy Jixtus quite a bit, but things resolved a little too neat and tidy for my liking. We know that the Grysks are still out there, but there’s less urgency to their threat because they’ve lost their Darth Sidious figure and gone back to being goons. A scene with Jixtus and his fellows conferring and exchanging notes on their plans for galactic conquest (I’m thinking the SPECTRE meeting scene from Thunderball) probably would have gone a long way to convincing me just how dire a threat these guys are to everyone that the Sith and the Empire feel like the Lesser Evil.

    Other than those misgivings, I really liked the book.

    The world building with the Chiss Ascendancy itself was top notch, especially their ancient history with the formation of the Nine, the Starflash, and the role of House Stybla in everything. Zahn mentioned he has an idea for that story and that it might be an alternative to doing another Thrawn centric novel...GIMME. GIMME NOW. I love this corner of the galaxy so much. It’s so different and weird, but it has that archaic fantasy quality interwoven in the more hard edged Sci-Fi stuff that it feels like Star Wars in its own unique way.

    I also....I’ve really grown to love the cast. Thalias is an endearing character, as is Che’ri and their relationship is very sweet. Sometimes it’s good to have a dose of wholesome in Star Wars. Samakro...this grumpy standoffish guy proved himself an absolute badass and I had to pick my jaw up off the ground after reading that scene between him and the Magys. And I think after 5-6 novels everyone’s in agreement on Ar’Alani being great.

    But even the villains were a step up this time. Nakirre isn’t exactly the most fleshed out character, beyond being a zealot but his interactions with Jixtus were entertaining as hell. I had major C’Baoth/Thrawn vibes from their banter.

    And even though I wasn’t satisfied with how his story resolved, I liked Jixtus. Having the benefit of him being a trilogy spanning villain with a lot of parallels to Darth Sidious made him feel like a proper foe for Thrawn. He’s not quite on that level, and I would have liked to have seen him inflict some more damage on the Chiss and Thrawn to ramp up the tension, but you definitely got the sense throughout the book that this entire conflict was one big chess match between the two of them. He made the Grysk more interesting with his existence.

    And Qilori Lives?...Qilori Lives!

    He’s a cowardly scumbag, but I liked his take on the Force and him eventually turning on his masters after 3 books of essentially cowering for his life was a good turn around. I think I’d enjoy seeing him and his fluttering winglets again down the line. Zahn resolved everyone’s storylines well enough that we can revisit them all at any given time, and hopefully that’s sooner rather than later once Filoni’s stuff has been made clear.

    And then the Thrass of it all. The memories chapters of this book were the emotional backbone. They almost singlehandedly humanised Thrawn more than all of the previous books combined and perfectly married Outbound Flight with the new expanded Chiss lore of canon. When I got to that final memory chapter it was a brilliant mix of excitement (Loranna Jinzler!) and heartbreak. We see in this book exactly what Thrawn has lost in his life, a sister who was stolen and forgot him. A big brother who saw how he struggled to fit in and natured him. Thrawn’s intelligence might be obnoxious at times, but I think with this book we can see that he’s not perfect and he is in fact quite broken.

    And where things end, it’s almost perfect no matter what they do with Thrawn going forward. Noble anti-hero? Ruthless villain? Something in between? They all work in the context of the book’s ending and Ba’kifs final exchange with Thrawn. There’s a whole parallel to the prequel trilogy I could get into, but I suspect I’ve rambled on long enough.

    Basically, this is a damn good book. It’s not perfect, and I’ll likely continue to wrestle with elements of Zahn’s modern writing style, but I really look forward to the next time we get to return to the Chaos.
     
  16. imiller

    imiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2004
  17. Foreign32567

    Foreign32567 Jedi Master star 4

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    Jun 4, 2021
    IMO, Qilori seems to be the main "sequel hook" for the future, given what information he now has and his
    uncertain fate at the end. Maybe he will become the Chaos version of Jorj Car'das.

    My most anticipated plot line in the future - Thurfian's eventual downfall, it has a potential to be both tragic (because this character is quite sympathetic) and satisfying.
     
  18. SyndicThrass

    SyndicThrass Force Ghost star 5

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    Sep 25, 2016
    Yeah I was actually quite surprised to see that Thurfian didn’t get a full turn as a Thrawn fan or some kind of comeuppance. I liked it though, he’s definitely a complicated guy trying to do what he thinks is the best. The final note they left him on was quite poignant.

    With Qilori, I *hope* we see him again though I’m not entirely confident if we will. But there’s definitely so much to explore with him and his unique perspective on the Force and how the Pathfinders and the Sky-Walkers factor into things. Not to mention that Attendants, which was a juicy little canon morsel.
     
  19. Foreign32567

    Foreign32567 Jedi Master star 4

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    Jun 4, 2021
    I think Thurfian is a good example of a character that is in opposition to "the Chosen One" idea, he believes in hard work and cooperation even between rivals, not in blindly following one individual with mad schemes.
     
  20. mnjedi

    mnjedi JCC Arena Game Host star 5 VIP - Game Host

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    Nov 4, 2012
    Regarding Qilori
    I suspect he winds up squealing to the Grysk about what he figured out, given that by the end of Treason they appear to be targeting Sky-walkers.

    He’s interesting though in that he’s acutely aware everyone he’s working for is garbage but he just hates the Chiss the most.
     
  21. imiller

    imiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2004
    I think you're likely right. I really need to reread the 2017 Thrawn trilogy - I held off during Ascendancy's publication, but I've started 2017, and will probably go on to Alliances and Treason!
     
  22. Sinrebirth

    Sinrebirth Mod-Emperor of the EUC, Lit, RPF and SWC star 10 Staff Member Manager

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    Nov 15, 2004
    With the emphasis on the Grysk identity, I suspect that the Grysk in the later trilogy are going to be revealed to not be the actual Grysk. Not sure.
     
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  23. imiller

    imiller Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Apr 26, 2004
    We likely won't know until and unless Zahn gets a new book, and I'd expect him to be at least a year, probably more given the breakneck pace he wrote this trilogy.

    :(

    Which makes me sad, but the guy is not young! I hope he's writing because he wants to, and not because he needs to.
     
  24. Jedi Ben

    Jedi Ben Chosen One star 10

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    Jul 19, 1999
    Zahn has other work that I want him to get to - like continuing the Honorverse prequel.

    By the time that's done the state of play should be clearer.

    Having just started the Ascendancy trilogy, I'm now wondering if a final trilogy will concern how the Ascendancy responded to the First Order's antics in the Unknown Regions.
     
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  25. SyndicThrass

    SyndicThrass Force Ghost star 5

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    Sep 25, 2016
    That path is tricky, because I feel it would a be a colossal disservice to bulldoze all of this world building we’re getting to prop up the First/Final Order.

    I’ll say I’d be pretty happy if we get a few books revealing that Snoke/Palpatine were being played by certain factions in the Unknown Regions.
     
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