why didn't padme rescue Shmi from tatooine? (2nd edition)

You're right, it's not a plot-hole. It's just a stupid illogical oversight.

It makes the "heroes" seem distant and callous, especially whiny little Annie and the vapid Padme.

 

Anakin can not can not CAN NOT go save is mother. Obi-wan would not let him the Jedi would not let him. If Anakin was not on a mission with Obi-wan then he was training. Anakin would never have been able to go get his mother.

 

Shane what is with you? Can't you ******* enjoy a film without being such a whiny brat yourself?

You're right, it's not a plot-hole. It's just a stupid illogical oversight.

I thought it was covered quite well. Padme was kept busy by her duty to her planet. And it worked out anyway since at least Shmi wasn't left to rot, she did find freedom.

It makes the "heroes" seem distant and callous, especially whiny little Annie and the vapid Padme.

Come on then BACK THIS UP

Anakin well its pretty obvious to me, he had no opportunities to free or save his mother until AOTC. Firstly the Council weren't exactly going to just let him do it and with his Master breathing down his neck and being there all the time with him I doubt he could do it. Oh and yeah its not until AOTC that Anakin has his first solo mission that he is in a position to see his mother, guess you just conveniently ignore that.
And you think Anakin didn't care about his mother? Thats pathetic, its clear he cares for his mother I mean the fact he has had nightmares about her and thinks about her means he does....or does that not count anymore?

Padme...well the film answers that pretty well and a few other people have said some good explanations.

 

DarthTerrious
I do not believe she would of had the resources to even free Shmi, especially when she is on Tatooine, she has only Republic credits, and as we know....yada yada yada, they are worthless.
Secondly yes it is valid to mention her planet needed all of her attention after the end of the TF occupation, she would not be a great servant of the people if she did not care for them and help them repair their lives

Obviously she couldn't free Shmi while she was there in TPM, but she had 10 years to do so afterwards.
As for getting Tatooine credits - take some goods to Tatooine, sell them and you have Tatooine credits.

Yes her planet is her priority after the TF battle,but does that mean she did absolutely nothing else for 10 years?
And let's be realistic here - it wasn't exactly WWII , they even had a street party at the end of TPM.
And remember - it's as a direct result of what Shmi did for Padme that she has a planet to look after .
And it's not like Padme has to go and free Shmi in person, she can send a couple of people, Shmi would cost approx the price of a Podracer that's hardly gonna break the bank.

But the question is - do you really think Padme would be at peace with her conscience if she did nothing to help this woman who risked so much to help her? I don't think so.
And yet that is exactly what she appears to have done, consequently Padme looks heartless and extremely ungrateful.

Shane what is with you? Can't you ******* enjoy a film without being such a whiny brat yourself?

Calling a fellow poster a "whiny brat" just aint cool.

g

 

Obviously she couldn't free Shmi while she was there in TPM, but she had 10 years to do so afterwards.

Shmi was not a slave for ten years. She was free for a good five years. Padme does not need to free her.

It's not even importent to the story. Again Cliegg free Shmi it works end of story.

 

Calling a fellow poster a "whiny brat" just aint cool.

Well I'd like to apologise to Shane for that comment, despite the fact I may not like the tone in your posts, it gives me no right to attack you like that.

 

Shmi was not a slave for ten years. She was free for a good five years.

Yes, I know that, But Padme didn't.

g

 

Even if Padme did want to buy and free Shmi, she would have had to do so after the events of TPM, as I doubt she thought to bring that amount of cash with her as she's fleeing the blockade.

And by then, I think the Jedi might have stopped her even if she wanted to continue trying to free Shmi, as the Jedi Council already had fears that Anakin was to old/attached to his mother to train; by freeing Shmi, that could have hurt Anakin's training even more.

 

"She had not reason to free her because her people come first. She is not going to take money from her people to help free one person."

yet in AOTC Naboo is home to immergrants from all over the galaxy who have been displaced an persecuted. They had no problem helping any of them.

"It makes the "heroes" seem distant and callous, especially whiny little Annie and the vapid Padme.

Come on then BACK THIS UP "

If I might be so bold. I would say that people don't like films where the heros don't do the right thing (regardless if its legal or not) because it is inconvient or difficult.

IMHO, a hero is someone who does the right thing regardless of the consequences or cost to themselves or their careers or whatever excuse we're going with for why a boy wouldn't try to free his own mother from slavery.

Slavery is wrong, regardless of how benign GL made it look. If we cannot all agree on this basic principal then I fear we are in trouble.

The reason Qui-gon was an appealing hero and worked far better then Padme, Obi-wan and anakin have since, is because Qui-gon did what he thought was right. he acted on his feelings.

This is typically how heros work, infact most films center on a hero having to weigh the importance of their: job, marriage, legal status, wealth, allegances, etc etc, when faced with something that is glaringly wrong. Heros make sacrifices. They put their priorities in order.

Think about hte moment in Indiana Jones when Indy has the idol and can walk out of the temple of Doom a rich man with Willy and shortround. But he sees the slave children and he decides to go help them. Would people have responded to Indy if he had just left those kids to their fate? Not likely. But that is exactly the same scenario we have here. "We got what we needed from you shmi. Thanks for the help. We're taking your kid, he's won't be visiting you. Hope your life doesn't suck too bad. Later dude". What kind of heros are these?

I have to wonder why GL didn't just have QGJ free Shmi in TPM. She could have still recognized that Anakin needed to "let go" (Whatever that BS is suppose to mean) and stayed on Tatooine, as a free women. How would that have disrupted the plot of either movie? We're talking one or two lines different. Watto didn't sell Shmi to Cliegg but he would still know where she ended up.

I think if you polled most audiences after they saw TPM about what would happen in ep2, one of the top things they would mention would be that the heros would go back to tatooine to free all the slaves.

The key to good drama is to have a likeable character, give them a need. Something they want, that motivates them. In this case its freeing shmi, something that was important to Anakin (at least at one point) and then putting obstacles inbetween the hero and their goal.

The problem is that "you need to let go" or "love is the darkside" and "its out of my jurisdicition" or "I'm busy being a senator" or "we'd have to go to all the trouble of a currency exchange" don't really cut it as obstacles.

 

I have to wonder why GL didn't just have QGJ free Shmi in TPM. She could have still recognized that Anakin needed to "let go" (Whatever that BS is suppose to mean) and stayed on Tatooine, as a free women.

First off, how would have Qui-Gon had freed her? He didn't have the money to do so (and I believe, if given the chance, he would have done so). He couldn't just take her with them because of that chip in her.

Second, as much as a feel-good scene that would have been, these are the prequels where very little is suppose to feel good. There are some feel-good moments, but they are left with a feeling a dread. The parade is feel-good, but there's a Sith Master out there. Anakin and Padme get together, but there's a war on the horzion.

When Anakin leaves his mother, I felt bad for him leaving his mother, but also glad he was free. Also I felt bad for Shmi staying like that.

My point is Anakin leaving his mother as a slave on Tatoonie is supposed to be an emotional scene. We're supposed to feel near or close to what I described above.

 

Watto could of agreed to QGJ's suggestion of betting his pod for both Anakin and his mother.

Shmi could decide on her own to stay on tatooine, recognizing that she would only be holding Anakin back.

The scene of Anakin saying goodbye would be just as emotional, even more so. Because she is choosing to stay behind.

 

But if Qui-Gon could have done that, then he should have tried for all the slaves, not just Anakin and Shmi.

But he can't. Why? Because it would be unreasonable. Even in a fantasy, there has to be some form of reason.

 

Padme and Panaka did go back to free Shmi.

But they didn't find her at the slave quarters.

Then after being attacked by Tuscan Raiders they said, "This planet's not cool, back to Naboo we shall go."

And they did.

 

Rebel Scumb - "I think if you polled most audiences after they saw TPM about what would happen in ep2, one of the top things they would mention would be that the heros would go back to tatooine to free all the slaves."

You should create a Poll thread asking what posters would like to have seen after TPM.

Anyway, there is an entire 10 year period where we don't know what happened to Shmi, other than the fact that her freedom was bought and she was married. Maybe someone DID try to go back and free her, but found that she had already been freed. Also, I'm sure that Anakin's nightmares didn't start until his mom had been captured. Since he could feel her pain, I'm sure that he could feel her happiness before the capture. The unfortunate thing is that AOTC doesn't address what happens to her in some small way to relieve those that can't understand why they left her there, or why they didn't try to go get her. It raises issue with something that really shouldn't be in debate.

 

If I might be so bold. I would say that people don't like films where the heros don't do the right thing (regardless if its legal or not) because it is inconvient or difficult.

IMHO, a hero is someone who does the right thing regardless of the consequences or cost to themselves or their careers or whatever excuse we're going with for why a boy wouldn't try to free his own mother from slavery.

For christs sakes, RS, you know full well why Anakin could not free his own mother, why the hell do you choose to ignore the answers?

This annoying me, you unfairly attack Anakin yet you have no evidence to back up what he could done.

You forget he is held back from doing anything by his Master (and he hasn't been able to be away from him until his mission to protect Padme, his first solo mission) and the Jedi Order and its Code (which forbids attachment).

Besides there is another thing, as we have seen with AOTC who says that Anakin or Padme had to do ANYTHING? Shmi just as easily found her OWN freedom, thanks to someone else.

And just a totally unrelated note on Anakin, the PT is about Anakin making the wrong choices, which is why he turns to the Darkside, if people find it uncomfortable to see someone make bad decisions then the director has succeeded.
And I dont frankly know what people expected the PT to show, apart from a good guy become a bad guy. I mean what else could Lucas show?

Anyway Anakin not saving his mother was taken out of his hands, if he had had his way he would of saved her, yet he was forbidden to.

 

In the meeting with Watto there is a close-up on Padme looking at Anakin just after he asked 'You sold her?', and then Watto starts telling the story about Cliegg and how he marry Shmi. There was no sign of surprise in Padme's face, it was like she knew something else. So, my question is: why would Lucas put that close-up there?

My theory is that Padme gave Cliegg the money to free Shmi.

 

And Padme never mentioned it to Anakin because? If she knew Cliegg why would they have to stop at Wattos to get direction.

"For christs sakes, RS, you know full well why Anakin could not free his own mother, why the hell do you choose to ignore the answers?"

I'm not. Because the code forbids it. I jsut don't understand why the code exist in the first place. Nor why Anakin wouldn't convince the republic and the jedi to go save the slaves.

"This annoying me, you unfairly attack Anakin yet you have no evidence to back up what he could done."

What do you mean? He's a space hero.

"You forget he is held back from doing anything by his Master (and he hasn't been able to be away from him until his mission to protect Padme, his first solo mission) and the Jedi Order and its Code (which forbids attachment)."

But what is so tragic about the jedi being wiped out, if they aren't very good people to begin with? What makes palpatine so smart if all he did was outsmart some halfwits. If the Jedi are not portrayed as just and capable and good heros, then their downfall will have no impact.

Why wouldn't Obi-wan want to help Anakin free his mother?

"Besides there is another thing, as we have seen with AOTC who says that Anakin or Padme had to do ANYTHING? Shmi just as easily found her OWN freedom, thanks to someone else."

"You say the biggest problem in this universe is that nobody helps anyone else"

Why should anybody help anyone, things will probably work out for them in the end.

"And just a totally unrelated note on Anakin, the PT is about Anakin making the wrong choices, which is why he turns to the Darkside, if people find it uncomfortable to see someone make bad decisions then the director has succeeded."

I agree, but that isn't how its being portrayed. We aren't seeing him make a bad choice in this instance, we aren't seeing the question even being addressed. It isn't presented as a mistake at all. No emphasis is put on the issue(s)

"And I dont frankly know what people expected the PT to show, apart from a good guy become a bad guy. I mean what else could Lucas show? "

Thats exactly what I want to see. But thats not what we're getting, we're getting inconsiderate and uncaring people turning to evil. We need to see Anakin Padme and Obi-wan as good people if their respective corruption, death, and exile are to have any impact.

If the republic was not very good in the first place then what is so bad about the empire taking over?

if the jedi are as corrupt, arrogant, lazy, calice, and incompentent as they are being portrayed then why should we root for Luke as he tries to become one?

IMHO, if your going to show something/someone break in a film, you need to show it working first.

 

Because the code forbids it. I jsut don't understand why the code exist in the first place. Nor why Anakin wouldn't convince the republic and the jedi to go save the slaves.

Because, at one point in time, the code did work. The way I see it, if you keep something the same all the time, it becomes useless. That is what is happening to the code in the PT. It's just no one realizes that yet.

As for Anakin convincing the Republic and the Jedi to save the slaves, it wouldn't have worked. What sets a free socity from a socity like the Empire is that a free socity doesn't get into other people's way. If the Republic went in and freed the slaves, it would have made other planets think: "Well, if they can go into any planet they please and enforce their way of life on people, then this is not a good system."

But what is so tragic about the jedi being wiped out, if they aren't very good people to begin with? What makes palpatine so smart if all he did was outsmart some halfwits. If the Jedi are not portrayed as just and capable and good heros, then their downfall will have no impact.

The Jedi are good, it's just they see the code in a way that prevents them to do what you want them to do. That is what's wrong with them. Their mistake is not changing the code when it needs to be changed.

Why wouldn't Obi-wan want to help Anakin free his mother?

See above. Same reasons.

We aren't seeing him make a bad choice in this instance, we aren't seeing the question even being addressed.

I do. Not in this instance, but Anakin has made some bad choices.

If the republic was not very good in the first place then what is so bad about the empire taking over?

Because, unlike the Empire, the Republic had freedom.

if the jedi are as corrupt, arrogant, lazy, calice, and incompentent as they are being portrayed then why should we root for Luke as he tries to become one?

But Luke doesn't completely follow their teachings. Luke still has his friends and he goes and tries to save his friends a la Anakin in AOTC. But yet, Luke still becomes a Jedi. It shows that the Jedi path is all what we see it in the PT.

 

Rebel Scumb:

And Padme never mentioned it to Anakin because?

I don't know. Maybe she wants Anakin to find out her mother is free by himself. Maybe it has something to do with him being a Jedi. Maybe she thinks he would want to free her by himself, so she didn't want to hurt his feelings and did it all anonymously. I don't know, it's something some people do: help other people without telling them who was the one who helps them. (Arrgh! This is much easier to explain in spanish . Am I making sense?)

If she knew Cliegg why would they have to stop at Wattos to get direction.

Well, if Padme had a motive to not tell Anakin, she obviously cannot tell him where to go in Tatooine...

ANAKIN: And now all we have to do is land by Watto's junkyard...

PADME: No, no. Let's go to that moisture farm over there.

ANAKIN: Why?

PADME: Uh?

Besides, she don't even have to know the Larses. Maybe Panaka's cousin, or Saché went to Tatooine and met Cliegg, explained only what he needed to know and gave him the money. There are quite a few ways it could work.

My point is: why is that close up there? Or it's just that I see what I want to see?

 

If I am remembering Tatooine Ghost correctly, Qui-Gon had arranged for a Tobal Lens (big crystral rock type thing that shines really bright) to be sent to Shmi or something like that (before he died of course) and not too long before Cliegg showed up, she received it.

Then Cliegg showed up looking for parts, and Shmi took interest in him (and vice versa). Shmi found out that Watto had some sort of ship or something that was missing a tobal lens, and told Cliegg about it. So Cliegg sent Owen, and Owen went to buy the ship, but then we he found out from Watto (which he already knew) that it didn't have the lens, he said he wouldn't buy it.

Shmi said Cliegg had one, (Watto didn't know Owen/Cliegg were connected) and I think that Cliegg sold it to Watto or something like that. They got a bunch of money, Owen never showed back up for the ship, and they didn't have to sell the farm like Cliegg had originally intended to do to pay for Shmi.

That is the EU's explanation of how it happened, and I don't think Padme is ever mentioned.