X-Men Origins: Wolverine

Okay so here's a question...

In this movie we see how Wolverine gets his leather jacket. He removes it prior to the fight at the end and prior to him losing his memories. So how did he remember to go back for it after the fight was over? If his memories were gone, that would make no sense. Yet there he is in the first X-Men movie wearing it. Can anyone explain this or is it just a plot hole?

 

I was actually trying to point that out as being a major flaw in the movie. As the movie pins the Three Mile Island incident on the battle at the end of the movie, the movie can take place at no point later than 1979. The fact that the movie is never able to firmly establish what era it takes place in is another major strike against it.

Also, LSJK, take the kid to Star Trek.

 

I just saw X3 again and in it when Wolverine meets stryker in teh school at the invasion, stryker says to him that he hadn't seen him in "what, 10... 15 years?" which would place the timeline exactly where they wanted... Why's everyone saying that it isn't?

 

87 million dollars. One weekend. That's more than Children of Men made in it's whole U.S. release.

 

Was there something specific to indicate that the climax of the film was intended to be the same incident as 1979?? It seems to me that the time line isn't exactly clear. The station is still in use so its not like it suggests a specific date. The use of Humvee's by the military seems to suggest that it took place at least in the mid-80s if not later.

As for the time period of the original X-Men film its very non-specific, using only the vague subtitle along the lines of "in the not too distant future". Future from what point?? 2000?? Today, 40 years ago?? By not telling you when today is its difficult to surmise when "the future" is.

 

The X-Men films are supposed to take place sometime in the present to near future. So if we say they occur in, oh, 2003, then Stryker would've met Wolverine some time in the late 80s or early 90s. Whereas everyone is saying that the very last scene from this movie is from the late 70s, early 80s. That's a gap of about half a decade.

 

Again was there something specific to link the climax of the film to the 1979 Meltdown?? The facility still exists to this day so I don't see anything in particular to indicate when the end of the film took place. The use of Humvees indicates a timeline after 1984.

 

I think it's pretty clearly implied in the movie that it's meant to be "the incident".

The Humvee thing is just an example of the fact that the movie is absolutely atrocious at establishing period. "Military? Get us some Humvees! (as well as the super advanced computers with flatscreens, I think a widescreen tv somewhere, the clothing that looks like it was designed today, etc, etc).

 

I think what you're overlooking is that things from the past just aren't as cool and hip as modern things. No one wants to see a Wolverine movie with uncool, unhip things in it.

 

One incident was a nuclear meltdown, the movie incident was the destruction of a cooling tower. Its not at all possible that those could be separate incidents?? What specifically indicates they are the same??

It doesn't seem likely to me that Stryker would be given permission to use a sensitive nuclear facility for the testing of a series of dangerous mutants, while the facility is still active. More likely he would be given permission to use the facility several years after the incident when much of the radiation had been cleaned up, but while the official reports would indicate restoration efforts were still taking place. Thus putting the timeline somewhere closer to the mid to late 80s.

Furthermore, the purely speculative connection between the climax and the 1979 meltdown is more plausible as a timeframe indicator to you than the vehicles (that have a very specific start point and would better suit the difference in time between the movies)??

Say X2 does take place in 2003, and Stryker and Wolverine had history 15 years previously, that would set these events around 1988. That would be about when Humvees were in use by the military, the facility would be largely abandoned and thus be available to Stryker's team to experiment on mutants (and provide a plausible cover for most people to stay out, and for the strange things that would take place there etc), and would put Cyclops at roughly 30 years old at the time of X2.

Again I see nothing that indicates specifically that the climax was the 1979 incident.

 

Gee it's too bad a fictional movie can't take place in a fictional universe instead of having to match up with the timeline of our real one.

 

Cept they make a point of establishing specific periods of time (the various wars) and years (starts in 1845). The trouble is that some claim that it lacks consistency in its time frame. I am simply stating that the latter half is pretty vague and the points some people are addressing seem purely speculative, thus it very well could still be plausible.

 

I'm glad other people thought the claws looked a little underdone.

CGI Dude: "Hurry up and finish the Claws we have the Island scene coming up...the claws are not that important, they'll only see them for 25 seconds".

 

I agree that the TMI bit isn't a DEFINITE thing, but c'mon, why else would make such a point of setting it there?

And call me crazy, but the more I think about it the more I think the premise of this movie is innately flawed. I mean, the Wolverine in this movie is essentially an entirely different character from the one in the X-Men movies. His relationships with Stryker, Silver Fox and Sabretooth ultimately don't matter a whit because he ends up not remembering any of it, so nothing that transpires in this film informs the character from the other films at all.

I think the character would have been served much better if the film had been a Godfather II-style prequel/sequel hybrid, with "present-day" Logan rediscovering his past.

 

It's an Origin movie. Why would they need him to rediscover his past? Alternatively, they may just have a sequel in the works. It seems to be doing fairly well.

 

Yeah, I don't know that I agree with that criticism, JKH. Anyone who bought a ticket knew going in that Wolverine didn't remember his past. Or, at least, it was clearly established in the first two X-Men movies, and harped on repeatedly. The appeal of an origins movie, then, was just that people wanted to see more adventures from a character that they thought was interesting. You're also ignoring the fact that Wolverine was, as a character, shaped by things even if he doesn't remember them. The claws, for instance. Or, even if he doesn't remember Stryker, Stryker certainly remembers him, so it has significance in that sense.

 

But it's really not, that's my point. Origin stories typically explain not just the what but also the WHY. Sure, it's interesting to see how superheroes get their powers and costumes, but the meat of the story is in learning why they are the way they are as superheroes.

The murders of Ben Parker and Thomas and Martha Wayne inform the 'present-day' characters of Spider-Man and Batman. The death of Silver Fox on the other hand has no impact on who Wolverine is in the X-Men movies, because he has no memory of her. The character of Wolverine who is developed in this film is for all intents and purposes killed at the end of the film and replaced with a brand new character just before the credits roll.

We never learn how Wolverine becomes the person he is at the beginning of X-Men. The last we see of him is with an amnesiac blank slate; we never see how he comes to be the grizzled cynic Rogue meets in that bar. We get Wolverine's history, but not his origin.

 

Except the only thing he did in those 15 years was sulk around trying to remember.

 

So um... anyone know how Logan remembered to go back and pick up his jacket after his memory had been erased?

 

Because it creates a plausible situation in which a ready built facility would be abandoned and available for Stryker and provide him with a cover story to keep people out, without having to explain why people are staying out.

Actually we learn specifically why Wolverine is who he is in X-Men. He is a man quite adept at killing and violence, but doesn't remember who he is. His motivation and journey in X-Men is to discover who he is and what the cryptic, horrific dreams mean. That's the point of this movie is to fill in the gaps left about his past by the other movies. It gets him to where he was in the X-Men films. The cynicism is the result of years of bigotry and hatred towards mutants.

Not to mention the origin stories of Batman and Spider-Man establish their acquisition of their specific talents and the emotional motivation to do what they feel needs to be done. The death of Silver Fox puts him in a situation to acquire his specific augments, and place him in a situation that directly results in his memory loss, thus establishing specifically who he is in X-Men. You are trying to compare an unconventional character to conventional superhero stories.

His motivation in X-Men is to understand his past. Thats entirely what this story is. It answers his and fans questions of what happened to him and where elements of himself came from. Why is he called Wolverine? Where did his claws come from?? What led to him being augmented with Adamantium?? Why does he not remember anything??

Any number of reason...its not the same jacket, someone else (Gambit, Sabertooth) grabbed the jacket and gave it to him later. It hardly seems relevant.

 

I forgot about him losing his memory! I'm a moron sometimes.
Thanks.

 

Better than Bayformers.

 

Except that Wolverine, the character from X-Men, never actually learns these answers. The audience learning the answers without him is like cheating, and is therefore deeply unfulfilling.

The questions that get answered in this film are either superficial or completely irrelevant to the character as he exists after this film. For example, the questions you bring up above:

Why is he called Wolverine?
What led to him being augmented with Adamantium?
-The answers to these questions have to do with the personal motivations of a character who no longer exists at the end of the film. Unless something happens for 'present-day' Wolverine to access his history/memories of James Howlett, these are issues that have zero bearing on the X-Man Wolverine.

Where did his claws come from?
-It's nice to see them as bone and have the matter addressed explicitly, but the origin of the claws is easily inferred from what we learn of Logan in the first X-Men movie. His entire skeleton is grafted with Adamantium; his claws are Adamantium; thus, his claws are part of his mutation.

Why does he not remember anything?
-The film's 'answer' to this is a big ol' plot hole. Logan is left with a bullet-sized piece of Adamantium lodged in his brain, which apparently no one notices when they scan his body in the first X-Men movie. Which, given how intent they are on figuring out who he is and where he comes from, is patently absurd.

This movie simply has ZERO dramatic relevance to the character as he exists after the credits roll.

 

So Keiran: Wolverine or Watchmen?