Yoda's huge attitude change

Does anyone else notice how positive Yoda is and how slowly he rushes to judgments in the ATOC and Phantom Menace? Well, I think he appears to be quite the opposite by the time EPSB comes around. He is very cynical, stubborn, and appears creepy at times.

 

he was on a planet by himself for like 20 yrs .that woud change anybody's mind state.i tell you what, he was still as wise as ever in his elder yrs .

 

Yeah, living in a swamp, seeing his friends killed, and watching his democratic government go down the toilet made Yoda a little negative.

 

I think that he realized how much of a 'mistake' allowing OB1 to train Anakin and in seeing how far he fell he did not want to make the same mistake with Luke.

 

"I think that he realized how much of a 'mistake' allowing OB1 to train Anakin and in seeing how far he fell he did not want to make the same mistake with Luke"

He definitely wanted to intimidate and subdue Luke, making him an obedient student. That may be why he acted creepy towards him. I think Yoda was not being as attentive, and was less apt to discipline the young ones in the prequals. Whereas, he definitely realized that in the sequels and acted differently.

 

It's something I'm looking forward to in Ep3. The moment when Yoda knows that even he is unable to save the Jedi Order from collapse.

 

It also shows how horrible the situation has become, that the TOP DOG in the Jedi Order is a grumpy old hermit.

 

I would be a grumpy old hermit after living on Dagobah for 20 years wouldn't you?

 

actually, I dont so much see a change in him but I suppose.

One thing I have noticed in the prequels is an attitude towards Obi-Wan specifically, even before taking on Anakin. Is this just my imagination?

I mean, in PM he totally shoots Obi-Wan down when both he and Qui-Gon say he's ready for the trials and then in AOTC there's that remark about "even the older more experienced Jedi" becoming arrogant (or something to that effect). Anyway, the way Yoda looks at Obi during that comment would seem that it's definitely directed at him. And I would say that the criticism and doubt about Luke being trained in the OT may very well be linked to a lack of faith in Obi-Wan. The question is, what the heck did Obi do to deserve the Yoda 'tude?

sg

 

hmmmm

Strict movies...

Obi Wan is an arrogant priss. "Another pathetic lifeform", "The negioations were short", "I am ready for the trials!". In the deleted scenes he rails into his padawan and talks about how he didn't think his student was ready for the trials

Plus he's willing to jump out of a window and train Anakin without the approval of the council.

Yoda is seemingly very fond of children as a whole and a very good teacher. His objection to Anakin was based on his connection to the Force, not the boy as a whole.

I think he's aware Obi Wan was an extremely poor teacher for Anakin being a strict code follower that was hypocritical most of the time. Anakin says Obi Wan would be angry about him using the force recklessly yet Obi Wan does it, Anakin is berated for getting captured BY a captured Obi Wan, Obi Wan jumps out of a window yet ANAKIN jumps out of a speeder and gets yelled at

They're more alike than different and Obi Wan's condemnation Yoda realizes is a major source of tension in their relationship.

EU...

actually the movies more or less covered it. Obi Wan was a by the book jedi but broke the rules when it suited him, a dissonance that never sat well with Yoda

 

-yoda is just playing with luke in esb, to test his worthiness. that is the official explanantion. he knows he has to train luke
-when obi-wan says that yoda trained him during esb, lucas explains it officially as being the fact that yoda and obi grew very close and that yoda is much like a teacher/mentor to obi-wan
-qui-gon says anakin will bring balance to the force, and he does do this, albeit 35 years later
-i sense a general disliking of yoda by you dookudefense. if you just flat out don't like yoda then say so and we will understand your posts differently, that being from not a subjective point of view, but, do i dare say, as yoda bashing?
p.s. i love dooku and think he is just as cool as maul

 

I myself don't see much of an attitude change in Yoda either. As for not liking Kenobi, I agree that he was something of a failure, as he himself admits in ANH.

As for my not liking Yoda, I don't necessarily not like him as I think he's overrated. That is, I think Windu is just as "good" a character as he is, and that they both operate in fundamentally the same way. But that because Yoda's been around longer, people seem to make more excuses for him.

 

How jolly would you be if you had to cook and eat that stew everyday? Not too jolly methinks.

 

"i sense a general disliking of yoda by you dookudefense. if you just flat out don't like yoda then say so and we will understand your posts differently, that being from not a subjective point of view, but, do i dare say, as yoda bashing?"

Its INdookusdefense to you DarthGrendal! Just kidding. Actually, I do not dislike Yoda at all, but I am in agreement with Jabba-Wocky that his character is overrated by many. I would not consider myself a "Yoda basher though".

When I first saw Yoda fight Dooku in the theatre I was kinda pulling for him, and afterwards I thought that Yoda was the man. But then when I saw it again on the t.v. I realized that he had battled Dooku to a standoff and nothing more. I think very highly of Dooku because he fought three of the toughest Jedi EVER all one after another and definitely held his own. In the theatre everyone was so excited that Yoda was actually fighting, and I think it influenced my opinion of him for a short time.

 

"As for not liking Kenobi, I agree that he was something of a failure, as he himself admits in ANH"

I am not saying this to Yoda bash, but isn't it Yoda who was the bigger failure? Yes Obi trained Anakin, but Yoda could have shot the whole thing down. He also could have intervened more. I remember when Obi talked about Anakin's arrogance to Yoda, and Yoda inferred that it was Obi who was arrogant. Yoda should have taken Obi at face value, but instead it was like he wanted to teach Obi a lesson for not listening to him in the first place ten years ago. I don't, it just seemed like Obi was very concerned and know one else gave a damn.

 

I am not saying this to Yoda bash, but isn't it Yoda who was the bigger failure?

You may very well be right. Someone as old and experienced as Yoda making a mistake of this caliber would most certainly cause the attitude change discussed here.

I'm sure he feels every bit as guilty and responsible for the state of things as Obi-Wan does. He's determined not to make the same mistakes with Luke, so it's natural he would alter his approach somewhat.

 

Disclaimer: I really like both Yoda and Obi-Wan. And at least Obi-Wan tried. Yoda was just.... "mmmm".

But they screwed up. Big-time. Kinda funny how they both agreed to begin with.
"The boy is dangerous. They all sense it...."
"Fear leads to anger...blah blah blah... SUFFERING."
Turned into:
"I will train Anakin. Without the approval of the council, if I must."
"The council is confident in its decision Obi-Wan." [then takes a small dig at OW]

I do think Yoda and Ben have an attitude change from prequels to OT and it makes sense to me. They blew it.

 

"They blew it"

Indeed they did

 

They blew it

That's quite the understatement.

-Jedi Master Zax Starwalker

 

You must take into account also that from the prequel trilogy to the original trilogy Obi Wan and Yoda have been through a great deal. They've seen the end of the Jedi and the rise of the Empire and they also know that the conversion of Anakin to Vader is at least partially their fault. I don't think Yoda has an attitude as much as he's become cynical and now he knows that Luke is the best thing they've got going for them. And lets face it in the ESB, Luke isn't exactly impressive.

 

"I don't think Yoda has an attitude as much as he's become cynical and now he knows that Luke is the best thing they've got going for them. And lets face it in the ESB, Luke isn't exactly impressive"

Actually I think Luke was very impressive in ESB; going head to head with Vader and progressing at a very rapid rate. Granted he was too emotional, but remember when he forced Vader off the edge in the carbon freeze area?? I know Vader was kinda toying with him, but I also know that Vader did not want to be embarrased like that.

 

Makes you wonder how Anakin would have fared had Yoda taught him instead of Obi-Wan.

 

Sadly Yoda NEVER wanted Obi Wan to train Anakin, remember

"Approve of you taking young Skywalker as your padawan Learner *I* do not."

(note Yoda was trying to convince him to ditch the boy even then)

 

"Makes you wonder how Anakin would have fared had Yoda taught him instead of Obi-Wan."

You know, I can't say that Anakin would have fared any better, as he was even worse than LUKE, who himself completely disobeyed Yoda's orders several times.

 

If Yoda even had a clue how to handle Anakin he would NEVER have allowed him to go off and guard Padme like that. Atleast Obi-Wan knew it wasn't a good idea and tried to stop it.

sg